Oil Fouled Cylinder - please help!

[Bustedknuckles]

alrighty, so ive been restoring a 79' GS850 for nearly a year. as i expected i keep running into issue after issue. the problem i am having now is that i am getting oil into my far left cylinder.
its fouling the plug and barely firing.
even after the bike has warmed up i can actually put my hand on the header without burning myself, that's how poorly its running.
what im looking for in this thread is someone with knowledge or experience with this issue.
im not sure if its the top valve cover gasket that needs replaced or if its the cylinder head gasket that needs it, or even something else that might be leaking.
ive never worked on a motorcycle before this one and ive never had to deal with this type of a leak so im somewhat clueless on how to approach it.
if someone could give me a little guidance or direction that really all i need.
~~~additionally ive added an edited picture that shows a little better what im dealing with. i have taken the valve cover off and there was alot of oil "pooling" above that cylinder.

 

[cowboyup3371]

Oil pooling at the top is normal so that the shim can have plenty of oil as needed. As far as where the fouled plug, I'll leave that to someone else.

 

[JEEPRUSTY]

Oil is sposed to pool in the cam area.
This is likely a ring issue or a carb issue.

Experts shall be on this in a bit.

 

[Adler]

If it is indeed oil that is causing your issue (I suspect carbs... I always do) it is either entering from the top (the valves) or the bottom (the rings).

I would suggest that you make absolutely sure that your problem is as stated. how are you so sure?

 

[Bustedknuckles]

response

response

cool, i knew there was supposed to be a sleight amount of oil around the valve but wasnt sure how much. it seemed like a lot to me. but in retrospect it was leaning that direction on the kick stand so duh....

now when you say rings you mean piston rings right?

and as far as a carb issue, i didnt know bad carbs could cause oil to get into the cylinder. i thought gas was the only issue...

again, this is my first bike so im kinda learning as i go along...

thanks for your help though guys, im hoping to get this figured out soon so i can order the parts and get the bike up in running in time for decent weather.

 

[Adler]

cool, i knew there was supposed to be a sleight amount of oil around the valve but wasnt sure how much. it seemed like a lot to me. but in retrospect it was leaning that direction on the kick stand so duh....

now when you say rings you mean piston rings right?

and as far as a carb issue, i didnt know bad carbs could cause oil to get into the cylinder. i thought gas was the only issue...

again, this is my first bike so im kinda learning as i go along...

thanks for your help though guys, im hoping to get this figured out soon so i can order the parts and get the bike up in running in time for decent weather.

Carbs cant cause oil in the cylinder. It can cause that cylinder not to fire. How did you determine there was, indeed, oil in the cylinder?

 

[Bustedknuckles]

oil fouled

oil fouled

im almost positive that the single cylinder is getting oil fouled because all of my other cylinders are operating well and have normal spark plug wear.

its the far left cylinder that is running poorly and when i checked the plug it was shiny and oily. i even looked in through the plug hole with a flashlight and saw that the cylinder itself is oily.

i also recently wrapped the headers, and all of them are cured except for the fouled cylinders header. its still a lighter color.
you can somewhat see this in the pic.

 

[Bustedknuckles]

then again

then again

then again im not too experienced with this subject. all i can do is explain the symptoms and speculate... thats what i need you guys for

and thanks again for the input

 

[Adler]

im almost positive that the single cylinder is getting oil fouled because all of my other cylinders are operating well and have normal spark plug wear.

its the far left cylinder that is running poorly and when i checked the plug it was shiny and oily. i even looked in through the plug hole with a flashlight and saw that the cylinder itself is oily.

i also recently wrapped the headers, and all of them are cured except for the fouled cylinders header. its still a lighter color.
you can somewhat see this in the pic.

To me, that indicates that cylinder is not firing... not oil fouled...

The wetness you see is likely unburned gasoline. Start with checking if that cylinder has compression, then check if it has spark.

 

[Nessism]

If the header pipe is cold that cylinder is not firing. To determine why, remove the plug, place it back into the coil plug, lay the plug against the side of the engine with the metal thread portion grounded against the engine and then crank over the engine to see if there is a spark. If no spark, try a brand new plug and see if that sparks.

If the plug is oil fouled like you think, a new plug will fix the problem...but you should see blue smoke out that cylinder. My guess is the cylinder is not oil fouled, but rather gas fouled.

When was the last time you properly cleaned the carbs and adjusted the valves? If the valves have never been adjusted they may be burned now, thus releasing too much compression for the engine to fire.

 

[Bustedknuckles]

it sparks

it sparks

the plug is fine, it sparks and the cylinder DOES fire, the bike will run but poorly,
while running if i take the cap off the plug the bike will die instantly. so i know its firing. and i know its oil because Ive had the bike disassembled for several days and the plug out of the cylinder hole to inspect. if it was gas it would have evaporated already and it wouldn't be as oily as it is...

the plug has sat out for several days and when wiped its very shiny and is clearly oil. its either a golden brown color or black.

i am also currently rebuilding my carbs because they weren't in great condition. but again i didnt think poorly functioning carbs could cause oil to build in a cylinder.

 

[Nessism]

Carbs won't cause oil fouling. Do you see blue/white smoke when running the bike? Does the bike use oil?

Back to the carbs, it's very difficult to diagnose running problems until all the maintenance is up to date. Doing the carbs is a good thing, and don't forget to replace the various O-rings with a kit from cycleorings.com - and don't forget the intake boot O-rings too.

You didn't mention checking the valves...so?

 

[Bustedknuckles]

valves

valves

i bought full rebuild kits for the carbs (o-rings and all) and the intake boot o-rings are brand new. so im good there.

i havent checked the valves yet but intend to while the valve cover is off.
i have no idea how to go about it, but i know basscliffs website has alot of info about the subject. if the valves are off could it cause oil to get in?

give me a min and ill take some bright, close-up, hi-def pics of the valves, maybe you can tell me something from just looking at them

 

[Bustedknuckles]

no pics

no pics

well never mind on the pics. cant get a good enough angle and lighting for it to really help.

when im running the bike i don't really get a lot of smoke, its mostly clear gasses, it doesn't seem to be burning a lot of oil

 

[DanTheMan]

I doubt it's an oil problem. I think your plug is fouled from that carburetor flooding the cylinder and the oil sump. So, your oil is heavily fuel diluted, pushing it past the rings on that cylinder anyway.
So, fix your carbs, soak them in Berryman cleaner, follow BassCliff's guide for this and do your valve shims, put it all back together with good gaskets and try it again. Why did you wrap the headers? Do you have a 4-1 and no chrome on the headers?
Oh yeah, dump that fuel diluted oil and put new oil in it too.
As far as looking at the valves, looking at the cam lobes and buckets doesn't tell anything, the head would have to be removed to even have a hint of what valves are like.

 

[Adler]

I doubt it's an oil problem. I think your plug is fouled from that carburetor flooding the cylinder and the oil sump. So, your oil is heavily fuel diluted, pushing it past the rings on that cylinder anyway.
So, fix your carbs, soak them in Berryman cleaner, follow BassCliff's guide for this and do your valve shims, put it all back together with good gaskets and try it again. Why did you wrap the headers? Do you have a 4-1 and no chrome on the headers?
Oh yeah, dump that fuel diluted oil and put new oil in it too.
As far as looking at the valves, looking at the cam lobes and buckets doesn't tell anything, the head would have to be removed to even have a hint of what valves are like.

To test the carb leaking into the oil, you can take off the oil cap and take a whiff of the oil. If it smells like gas... drain it immediately and rebuild the carbs and maybe the petcock.

 

[Bustedknuckles]

awesome

awesome

that actually makes alotta sense, the cylinder im having problems with also had issues with the carb that went into it. it was leaking gas. but i never thought that it could be leaking into the oil. i bet that was my issue,

i just ordered a new petcock and the carb rebuild kits are in the mail for all 4 carbs.
ill check and adjust the valves,
put on a new gasket,
replace the plug,
change the oil,
slap everything back together, and see what happens.

thanks for all the help everybody, everything makes more sense now and i know how im going to approach it.

 

[Nessism]

that actually makes alotta sense, the cylinder im having problems with also had issues with the carb that went into it. it was leaking gas. but i never thought that it could be leaking into the oil. i bet that was my issue,

i just ordered a new petcock and the carb rebuild kits are in the mail for all 4 carbs.
ill check and adjust the valves,
put on a new gasket,
replace the plug,
change the oil,
slap everything back together, and see what happens.

thanks for all the help everybody, everything makes more sense now and i know how im going to approach it.

Carb rebuild kits that come with the jets and such are garbage. cycleorings.com is the hot ticket since they sell an O-ring kit like I suggested already. Please do not remove the Japanese Mikuni jets and replace them with aftermarket parts.

And needless to say you should adjust the valves. Why so many people neglect them is one of the mystery of the free world.