Possible voltage drop at solenoid/intermittent starting problem

[lordcannon88]

Several months ago I noticed sometimes I would hit the starter button and nothing would happen. Battery is fine, and all connections seemed tight. I bought a new solenoid, put it on and same problem! I then put a test light on the stater solenoid activation line and it has without fail, lit up the test light. This really got me curious, so then I put a voltmeter on it, and couldn't get it to read ANYTHING. Since the test light lights and the voltmeter reads nothing this means massive voltage drop, right? Where would be the best place to clean/check for the drop at? Also worth mentioning, sometimes when I turn the ignition switch on then off without turning the bike on for a split second the starter and relay open like the bike is trying to turn over.

Related question: Are there anyone/anywhere to obtain new wire harnesses for these bikes? I suspect that would solve 95% of our problems.

 

[DanTheMan]

Run a ground wire from your solenoid to the battery it'll cure your intermittent starting woes. Your old starter solenoid is probably still good.

 

[lordcannon88]

Run a ground wire from your solenoid to the battery it'll cure your intermittent starting woes. Your old starter solenoid is probably still good.

Hmm, like where on the solenoid should I ground it? On the back where it's bolted onto the bike?

 

[bluewool]

Hmm, like where on the solenoid should I ground it? On the back where it's bolted onto the bike?

Are there four wires on the solinoid?
2 big ones and 2 small ones?
One of the small ones is a ground. These small wires feed the coil on the soilinoid.
On MY bike ( I didn't bother looking yours up, I figure you could do that) the black wire with a white stripe is the negative or ground as some like to call it. The orange wire (which is positve) comes from the start button.

 

[DanTheMan]

Hmm, like where on the solenoid should I ground it? On the back where it's bolted onto the bike?

Put the ground wire underneath one of your solenoid mounting bolts, run it to the battery ground. Should work fine then. Suzuki expected it to ground via the battery box, but corrosion destroys that grounding concept every time, the wire restores the ground.

 

[lordcannon88]

Put the ground wire underneath one of your solenoid mounting bolts, run it to the battery ground. Should work fine then. Suzuki expected it to ground via the battery box, but corrosion destroys that grounding concept every time, the wire restores the ground.

That makes so much sense it isn't even funny. Theoretically then, by simply running a ground here from the battery and then grounding RR here (originally it was grounded nearby), it should eliminate the issue of the RR frying itself, as well as that entire area having a deficient ground...

 

[lordcannon88]

Are there four wires on the solinoid?
2 big ones and 2 small ones?
One of the small ones is a ground. These small wires feed the coil on the soilinoid.
On MY bike ( I didn't bother looking yours up, I figure you could do that) the black wire with a white stripe is the negative or ground as some like to call it. The orange wire (which is positve) comes from the start button.

There are three. One to power solenoid, one to send power to starter, and a trigger wire. I think the ground wire trick solved my problems.

 

[DanTheMan]

There are three. One to power solenoid, one to send power to starter, and a trigger wire. I think the ground wire trick solved my problems.

I also run a seperat ground for the r/r just for safety's sake. Some people think I have too many, I don't.

 

[lordcannon88]

I also run a seperat ground for the r/r just for safety's sake. Some people think I have too many, I don't.

On a thirty year old machine...it's cheap insurance.

 

[lordcannon88]

Well, I ran the ground. No luck. Still having the problem, only now I'm not getting any voltage to the relay trigger wire. Where would be a good place to start hunting for the break/corrosion in the wires?

 

[DanTheMan]

Have you done the "clean all the connectors" drill, including in the fairing and followed your wires under the tank forward and cleaned them? How about rhe fuse block? A common failure point is on the back of the fuse block. The connectors overheat and disentegrate. I replaced my old fuse block once with the one off of my parts bike, that one wasn't much better, then I bought a blade type, wired it up, and cured that problem. It's also possible the problem could be in the start button or the engine cut off (kill) switch. Just be careful opening up the right hand control, so you don't lose any little springs. One other thought: Is your clutch safety switch still wired up, or do you have a sidestand safety switch? My clutch safety switch has been bypassed for a long time so that never entered into the equation for me, and I don't have a sidestand safety switch. Just some more spots to look at.

 

[lordcannon88]

Have you done the "clean all the connectors" drill, including in the fairing and followed your wires under the tank forward and cleaned them? How about rhe fuse block? A common failure point is on the back of the fuse block. The connectors overheat and disentegrate. I replaced my old fuse block once with the one off of my parts bike, that one wasn't much better, then I bought a blade type, wired it up, and cured that problem. It's also possible the problem could be in the start button or the engine cut off (kill) switch. Just be careful opening up the right hand control, so you don't lose any little springs. One other thought: Is your clutch safety switch still wired up, or do you have a sidestand safety switch? My clutch safety switch has been bypassed for a long time so that never entered into the equation for me, and I don't have a sidestand safety switch. Just some more spots to look at.

Yes, I've cleaned everything I've messed with. Hmm, good ideas. I've heard the sidestand switch is a safety hazard anyhow. I'll bypass them both and see if that changes anything. My fuse block is a blade type, and the back of it is completely sealed.

 

[Steve]

I've heard the sidestand switch is a safety hazard anyhow.

Just how is the sidestand switch a "safety hazzard"?
It only illuminates a light on the console.

To troubleshoot your starting issue, follow the current path.

Starting at the third fuse (IGNITION), current goes to the ENGINE STOP (kill) switch, then through the start button, over to the clutch "safety" switch, then to the starter solenoid. If you are not seeing it at the solenoid, look for it at any intermediate point.

.

 

[lordcannon88]

Just how is the sidestand switch a "safety hazzard"?
It only illuminates a light on the console.

To troubleshoot your starting issue, follow the current path.

Starting at the third fuse (IGNITION), current goes to the ENGINE STOP (kill) switch, then through the start button, over to the clutch "safety" switch, then to the starter solenoid. If you are not seeing it at the solenoid, look for it at any intermediate point.

.

Hmm, now that you mention it the safety issue might have been for a different bike. BUT...I can't say I remember, but if I were to put the bike into gear while the motor was running and then suddenly put the sidestand down, wouldn't that kill the motor, or was that "feature" not yet incorporated on the GSes? I know I've heard people on other forums talk about bypassing them...

Thanks the for routing info, I'll let you know what I find. Doesn't it also go through the IGN switch?

 

[Steve]

Hmm, now that you mention it the safety issue might have been for a different bike. BUT...I can't say I remember, but if I were to put the bike into gear while the motor was running and then suddenly put the sidestand down, wouldn't that kill the motor, or was that "feature" not yet incorporated on the GSes? I know I've heard people on other forums talk about bypassing them...

Thanks the for routing info, I'll let you know what I find. Doesn't it also go through the IGN switch?

No, if you put the bike in gear while the motor is running and then put the side stand down, the ONLY thing that happens is that the "SIDE STAND" light illuminates.


Yes, of course, it goes through the ignition switch, but it does that just before it gets to the ignition fuse. If you want the ENTIRE circuit:

From the battery to the MAIN fuse, on to the ignition switch, back to the IGNITION fuse, on to the kill switch, through the starter button, on to the clutch switch and finally to the solenoid.

Since it appeared that you had power to all other circuits, I was presuming that the ignition switch was working and sending power to the fuse box, hence the original suggestion to start there.

.

 

[lordcannon88]

No, if you put the bike in gear while the motor is running and then put the side stand down, the ONLY thing that happens is that the "SIDE STAND" light illuminates.


Yes, of course, it goes through the ignition switch, but it does that just before it gets to the ignition fuse. If you want the ENTIRE circuit:

From the battery to the MAIN fuse, on to the ignition switch, back to the IGNITION fuse, on to the kill switch, through the starter button, on to the clutch switch and finally to the solenoid.

Since it appeared that you had power to all other circuits, I was presuming that the ignition switch was working and sending power to the fuse box, hence the original suggestion to start there.

.

Steve 2, Caleb 0. Haha. Your logic > mine. Thanks a lot, hopefully by tomorrow I'll know something.

 

[Steve]

Steve 2, Caleb 0.

Nobody's keeping score, we just want to see the video of your bike running.

.

 

[Guest]

I have been using stainless steel star washers on both sides of my connections especially the grounds. They dig in real good and should keep a good connection longer.