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I've ordered from DCC before, including the mini-gauges on my bike. The speedo failed after a year and about 2,000 miles. But I liked the style and decided to buy another unit in July. DCC sent me a speedo with a 2:1 drive, instead of 2240/60.
DCC doesn't sell a 2:1 speedo.
I had no reason to expect a speedo with the wrong ratio. After going back and forth for a month, Herm won't refund my money because I cut 4" of wire when installing the bad unit.
Here is my long reply (detailing this crap) and Herm's final response. Herm's quotes are in red, his re-quotes from my mails are in green
[Cinders], as I stated in my last email, i had no problem refunding the unit because you did in fact receive something other than what you ordered. However, when you received it it was NOT Damaged, it is damaged now by your hand, not ours! Agian, I am working with the manufacture to see if they will credit me. Once I have word I wil get back with you.
On 8/23/2012 12:43 PM, [Cinders] wrote:
Herm:
Let me get this straight.
When my old DCC speedo failed, I ordered an identical replacement. DCC lists the gauge on its website and expressly advertised a 2240/60 drive ratio. That is the ratios that works for Japanese bikes. The first unit I bought a year or so ago did exactly that until its needle broke.
DCC sent me a speedo that looked identical to the unit pictured on the site and the old DCC unit I purchased before. The packaging, invoice and web listing all matched up with the same item number (SKU: 15-0032W). Based on the information DCC provided, I installed the speedo.
It immediately gave significant errors for speed and mileage, showing much faster speeds and racking more miles than actually traveled. Further inspection of the unit in comparison with my old DCC speedo suggested that the drive ratio was wrong. Although nothing on the site, box or unit said "2:1" (or "2240/60"), I suspected that the drive ratio was actually 2:1 based on the cryptic labels on the backs of the units (the old one said "M=2.1" and the new one said "M=2,0"). When I noted the discrepancy, you initially assured me:
After claiming that 2:1 and 2240/60 are the same thing, you insisted that my unit was properly marked as a "2:1" speedo:
Despite the basic fact that DCC sells only one kind of speedo, you continued to push the error onto me, even as I attempted to work with you for a replacement. Here you display your contempt for me and literacy in general:
Of course, if you actually can read and comprehend numbers and letters, then your evasive pleas of ignorance stagger me. Do you really expect me to swallow the idea that DCC's vice-president for "product questions and R&D," doesn't know the basic function of a speedometer and cannot recognize a product that doesn't belong in DCC's inventory?
I have no idea how you managed to ship a product that DCC does not carry. Maybe your supplier sent the wrong units, or DCC had it for a special Harley project and it was misplaced in your inventory. Your vendor relationships and inventory management are not my responsibility. To compare this to the "accidental purchase" of a coffee maker or TV set shows a fundamental misunderstanding of your business or a flimsy attempt to mislead me further. I did not "accidentally purchase" the wrong speedo. DCC only sells one speedo. That's what I ordered, and according to DCC's documentation, that's what DCC purported to deliver. Until now, I assumed a supplier mishap caused this and was glad to help DCC avoid similar headaches from other customers who might not enjoy the benefit of a comparison unit.
So DCC advertised (and still does) one product. I paid for that product and incurred shipping costs twice, but you refuse to deliver what I ordered. With the non-conforming product back in DCC's possession, you now insist that I bear the costs of DCC's incompetence empty-handed. Help me understand how this is not a bait and switch tactic built on DCC's explicitly false advertising? It did not occur to me that your initial "it's the same thing" response aimed further a bogus advertisement. It might have worked had I discarded the older DCC unit to compare or shared your claimed ignorance about the basic workings of a speedometer.
In short, I do not trust DCC to fulfill this or any order. The information posted on DCC's web site and catalog misrepresents the quality and application of the products actually shipped. Your statements about DCC's inventory do not add up. So, do not bother trying to fill my order -- #100024604 (placed on July 30, 2012) -- from whatever stock DCC may or may not actually keep. I refuse to bear the costs of this misadventure, however, and demand that you refund the $80.14 charged to my card in this debacle. DCC has until August 27, 2012, to issue the refund.
Still nothing.
DCC doesn't sell a 2:1 speedo.
I had no reason to expect a speedo with the wrong ratio. After going back and forth for a month, Herm won't refund my money because I cut 4" of wire when installing the bad unit.
I hear you, but regardless, if the unit is no longer able to function it is not eligible for a return with any manufacture. And with the wires snipped off at 3" it is now a non-functional unit.
It's no different with any other retailer...even if they sell you the wrong coffee maker, or you accidentally buy the wrong TV set, you cannot alter it's manufactured state and expect to get a refund when you discover it's not what you wanted. Just does not work that way.
I really want to help you here, and had every intention to send you a replacement unit, but I am not sure I should eat the cost of the unit.
I've reached out to my supplier and am awaiting a reply at this time. I'll let you know the outcome.
Herm
It's no different with any other retailer...even if they sell you the wrong coffee maker, or you accidentally buy the wrong TV set, you cannot alter it's manufactured state and expect to get a refund when you discover it's not what you wanted. Just does not work that way.
I really want to help you here, and had every intention to send you a replacement unit, but I am not sure I should eat the cost of the unit.
I've reached out to my supplier and am awaiting a reply at this time. I'll let you know the outcome.
Herm
Here is my long reply (detailing this crap) and Herm's final response. Herm's quotes are in red, his re-quotes from my mails are in green
[Cinders], as I stated in my last email, i had no problem refunding the unit because you did in fact receive something other than what you ordered. However, when you received it it was NOT Damaged, it is damaged now by your hand, not ours! Agian, I am working with the manufacture to see if they will credit me. Once I have word I wil get back with you.
On 8/23/2012 12:43 PM, [Cinders] wrote:
Herm:
Let me get this straight.
When my old DCC speedo failed, I ordered an identical replacement. DCC lists the gauge on its website and expressly advertised a 2240/60 drive ratio. That is the ratios that works for Japanese bikes. The first unit I bought a year or so ago did exactly that until its needle broke.
DCC sent me a speedo that looked identical to the unit pictured on the site and the old DCC unit I purchased before. The packaging, invoice and web listing all matched up with the same item number (SKU: 15-0032W). Based on the information DCC provided, I installed the speedo.
It immediately gave significant errors for speed and mileage, showing much faster speeds and racking more miles than actually traveled. Further inspection of the unit in comparison with my old DCC speedo suggested that the drive ratio was wrong. Although nothing on the site, box or unit said "2:1" (or "2240/60"), I suspected that the drive ratio was actually 2:1 based on the cryptic labels on the backs of the units (the old one said "M=2.1" and the new one said "M=2,0"). When I noted the discrepancy, you initially assured me:
"Hi, it's the same thing. 2:1 is a standard method in the US, whereas all others are 2240/60. But they do read the same."
Then I explained to you several times how speedo drive ratios work and why what appeared to be a 2:1 drive speedo was useless to me and did not conform to the DCC product that I attempted to purchase. Over numerous e-mails, you claimed ignorance and confusion about the primary functions of your own product.After claiming that 2:1 and 2240/60 are the same thing, you insisted that my unit was properly marked as a "2:1" speedo:
"it says 2:1 [Cinders]!"
You then suggested that I ordered a "2:1 speedo" (impossible) and that my installation and use of the non-conforming speedo rendered it non-returnable, even though you advertised and identified the product with a DCC SKU for the 2240/60 model. Somehow, I am responsible for double checking DCC's inventory system to make sure that I didn't receive a product that I could not have ordered from DCC. Then you insisted that:"[Cinders], you're losing me here... you ordered a 2:1 speedo, you somehow received a 2:0 speedo, which I don't even carry, but you had to of known this was a 2:0 unit when you installed it because according to you the gauge is labeled as such, yet you chose to install it anyway. I'm not doubting you here by any means, just real confused man...."
First, a "2:0 speedo" does not exist. Second, I never ordered a "2:1 speedo." To be clear, I ordered a 2240/60 speedo - THE ONLY MODEL DCC OFFERS! Your suggestion that I knowingly accepted and installed a non-conforming product that you mislabeled and sold contrary to the advertised feature is wrong.Despite the basic fact that DCC sells only one kind of speedo, you continued to push the error onto me, even as I attempted to work with you for a replacement. Here you display your contempt for me and literacy in general:
"this is your email below: which is clear that you are claiming to me that the 2;1 is an accurate drive ratio.
The UMJ standard uses a 2240/60 (2240rpms = 60 mph) ratio to spin the cable, not the 2:1 (2000rpms = 60mph) typical for a Harley, which has a different front wheel size and speedo drive.
The 2:1 drive ratio makes the speedo very inaccurate, and shows speeds and distance that are at least 10% greater than actual travel.
I rather you not buy another one until I receive the one you sent back so I can sort this out, because you sir, have confused me like no other. hahaha"
Words and numbers can be confusing, I guess. Good for you to find humor in your reading and math challenges. The UMJ standard uses a 2240/60 (2240rpms = 60 mph) ratio to spin the cable, not the 2:1 (2000rpms = 60mph) typical for a Harley, which has a different front wheel size and speedo drive.
The 2:1 drive ratio makes the speedo very inaccurate, and shows speeds and distance that are at least 10% greater than actual travel.
I rather you not buy another one until I receive the one you sent back so I can sort this out, because you sir, have confused me like no other. hahaha"
Of course, if you actually can read and comprehend numbers and letters, then your evasive pleas of ignorance stagger me. Do you really expect me to swallow the idea that DCC's vice-president for "product questions and R&D," doesn't know the basic function of a speedometer and cannot recognize a product that doesn't belong in DCC's inventory?
I have no idea how you managed to ship a product that DCC does not carry. Maybe your supplier sent the wrong units, or DCC had it for a special Harley project and it was misplaced in your inventory. Your vendor relationships and inventory management are not my responsibility. To compare this to the "accidental purchase" of a coffee maker or TV set shows a fundamental misunderstanding of your business or a flimsy attempt to mislead me further. I did not "accidentally purchase" the wrong speedo. DCC only sells one speedo. That's what I ordered, and according to DCC's documentation, that's what DCC purported to deliver. Until now, I assumed a supplier mishap caused this and was glad to help DCC avoid similar headaches from other customers who might not enjoy the benefit of a comparison unit.
So DCC advertised (and still does) one product. I paid for that product and incurred shipping costs twice, but you refuse to deliver what I ordered. With the non-conforming product back in DCC's possession, you now insist that I bear the costs of DCC's incompetence empty-handed. Help me understand how this is not a bait and switch tactic built on DCC's explicitly false advertising? It did not occur to me that your initial "it's the same thing" response aimed further a bogus advertisement. It might have worked had I discarded the older DCC unit to compare or shared your claimed ignorance about the basic workings of a speedometer.
In short, I do not trust DCC to fulfill this or any order. The information posted on DCC's web site and catalog misrepresents the quality and application of the products actually shipped. Your statements about DCC's inventory do not add up. So, do not bother trying to fill my order -- #100024604 (placed on July 30, 2012) -- from whatever stock DCC may or may not actually keep. I refuse to bear the costs of this misadventure, however, and demand that you refund the $80.14 charged to my card in this debacle. DCC has until August 27, 2012, to issue the refund.
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