Southern Indiana: IN Route 66 - WOW!

[twr1776]

Bill, Brian and I would never go above the posted speed limits.

Brian and I both pretty much rode "the pace" most of the day and with so many corners to carve and blind hills to go over demanding your 100% attention you kind of catch your breath on the straights, look around, and enjoy the scenery before hitting the next set.

[Buffalo Bill]

Anybody need some extra troopers?

Hey Tim,
I'm seein' troopers everywhere these days, there's an oversupply, and because all the vacationers have gone home, they stick out. And me with my only plated bike waiting for new brake pads.
Bill

[bwringer]

This area of Southern Indiana is quite sparsely populated. There are very few people of any sort out there, and I don't recall seeing any police out in the countryside Saturday. It's a long way from anywhere else, too, so there are very few sportbikes. A few cruisers, including two gents who actually moved over to allow us to pass (that hardly EVER happens in Indiana). There were several bikes parked at the Overlook Restaurant in Leavenworth, including a few BMW tourers.

As Tim stated, we generally use "The Pace", so even on the ends of the straights where revenooers like to hide, we shouldn't be going fast enough to attract attention.

[Buffalo Bill]

OK, please define…

OK, you guys are putting quotes around “The Pace” so, please define this term.
Bill

[twr1776]

Here is some info on "The Pace".

http://www.fjrowners.ws/pace.html

[Buffalo Bill]

OK, but not for racers…

Thanks Tim,
OK, “the Pace” emphasizes smoothness for entry and exit, with limited top speed between corners. Very good for public roads, that is, ideal or well known public roads, and for strange roads it's the best approach.
I try to be so smooth on public roads, however I find I have to hold my pace back considerably to prevent exceeding the safety limit of public roads, and on all roads, conditions change by the hour, plus hazards from road work and other vehicles.
However for ruthless, track racing “the pace” would deliver you to the back of the group.
Thanks for the definition Tim!
Bill

[bradleymaynar]

I'll chime in here seeing as that my Uncle, who recently followed me on his BMW while I rode two up, commented that my pace was too fast for him. I was on unfamiliar roads and riding at a pace that kept me well within my comfort zone. He had planned to make the Fennimore ride, but, unfortunately, I think my personal pace (with passenger) intimidated him. His loss, but his choice.

The "pace" of any rider is that which is comfortable to him/her. He and I had a lengthy conversation about how a rider following will try to keep up and that competition plays a role in that feeling. WRONG!! I explained to him exactly what I've come to learn on the GSR and on the rides and rallys I've been on with many GSr's, IT IS NOT A RACE! We wait at the next intersection/stop sign for the entire party to regroup. And in most, if not all, group rides, there are individual pace groups. Spirited and touring.

In the times that I have found myself in the lead of a group I ALWAYS feel responsible for those that follow me. I want everyone to have fun, but I would never expect them to feel that they need to keep up. That's if my pace is faster than their comfort zone. I think this same message has been put out there time and time again, but I guess adrenaline and wanting to prove one's self sometimes still prevails. I, and I'm sure many, can say, I'd rather see you pulling up behind me at the next turn on the road then having to turn around and find why you haven't.

Sorry, but I can't stand that some people can blame others when their own outcome is less than desirable. Every rider is solely responsible for how they ride. No one else can be blamed for driving X over the posted if the rider following (and in large groups the rear is always moving faster) the group was beyond their own comfort level.

Damn! We love what we do and it's not up to someone else to be responsible for us.

Just my .02.

Brad bk

[bwringer]

Talking about "The Pace" is a bit of a digression, but anyway... I'll point out that it doesn't require anyone to ride any faster than they are 100% comfortable with.

Tim and I, and many others from this forum, have safely ridden many thousands of miles together, and we're rarely within shouting distance.

I go do my bending space/time thing, and I wait for the following rider(s) at each stop sign or intersection. If there's no other traffic, I also quite often will slow way down below the speed limit on the straights to bunch the group together a bit and reduce the amount of time spent waiting.

In fact, many riders will purposely allow the leading rider to get far enough ahead to be out of view so that there's no chance of distraction. Everybody has a great ride, and the lead rider is the only one who has to know where you're going.


Another interesting thing about The Pace is that you'll find that highly skilled riders on the street will tend to make nearly identical choices. The end result is that velocities are nearly identical regardless of machinery. For example, I rode hundreds of miles like this in North Carolina at the rally this summer in the company of two guys on modern bikes (I was on my GS850 and they were on a Buell Ulysses and a Suzuki SV1000). On the track, of course, they would leave me for dead, but on the street there's a certain limit of sanity that's pretty much the same for everyone.

[Buffalo Bill]

Sad man…

Gosh Brad, your point has merits, but it's kind of sad you implied you can't stand your uncle on a public forum. Glad not to be with you.
Bill

[bradleymaynar]

Gosh Brad, your point has merits, but it's kind of sad you implied you can't stand your uncle on a public forum. Glad not to be with you.
Bill

Sorry Brian for going OT in this forum. Bill, I never said that. Take what you will from my comments. My Uncle made those comments to my father, which were passed along to me. It still boils down to the basic principle of riding your own ride. He chooses to enjoy solo jaunts while I prefer being in a group. That's it.

And I do intend to make BC next year!

Brad bk

[TheCafeKid]

Talking about "The Pace" is a bit of a digression, but anyway... I'll point out that it doesn't require anyone to ride any faster than they are 100% comfortable with.

Tim and I, and many others from this forum, have safely ridden many thousands of miles together, and we're rarely within shouting distance.

I go do my bending space/time thing, and I wait for the following rider(s) at each stop sign or intersection. If there's no other traffic, I also quite often will slow way down below the speed limit on the straights to bunch the group together a bit and reduce the amount of time spent waiting.

In fact, many riders will purposely allow the leading rider to get far enough ahead to be out of view so that there's no chance of distraction. Everybody has a great ride, and the lead rider is the only one who has to know where you're going.

Unfortunately, this philosophy and courtesy, seems to have been lost on some "leaders" of rallys recently. I have personally been victim of TWO (and oddly, the SAME "leader" ) instances where the leader either lost part of his group, or had a rider or TWO go down and wasnt even aware of it. I wont spit names, but THIS person wasnt a GSR, and it wasnt a GSR rally. Tho he IS/WAS the Area Director for the COG group in the SWOH area i believe.. ( know he was a COG Director, just not sure of WHERE for sure)

Recently Ive talked to a couple of GSRs and some other riders I am friends with who were, and have been pretty ticked off by some group "leaders" on a couple of GS rallys however, feeling that they'd been left or lost, and also that the leaders they were speaking of didnt seem to give a hoot who was behind them, or how many. Basicly, NOT being a good leader.

Its not my belief that a ride should be as organized as the rides ive taken with Wingers...although they have VERY SAFE rides, and its still quite entertaining, I feel that SOME would feel very constrained by such organization. I also do not believe that a ride or group leader should have to BABY SIT other riders, and ride a pace that EVERYONE is comfortable with.

HOWEVER, I DO believe that a ride or grop leader/organizer SHOULD FEEL AND BE RESPONSIBLE for his entire group! There are exceptions to the rule, as always, but if youre going to volunteer to LEAD, then you should also be volunteering to ASSURE that you keep everyone with you, no rider is LOST or LEFT BEHIND, broken down or not. You should also make your intentions on pace, distance and route CLEAR to anyone who may want to ride under your leadership. This includes CHOICE of ROAD. If you know you have some rookie or relatively NEW riders in the group, you may not want to head down a bunch of pig path, beaten up roads that may be trecherous for a newbie. On the OTHER side of the coin, if these roads are part of your route, you may want to consider suggesting that the newb take this into account and may want to ride with someone else. If he then choses to ride with you anyway, thats on him/her. ALL riders should be responsible for themselves. This includes riding at their own pace, assuring that thier bike is up for the challenge, and making the leader aware of any concerns or issues they may have prior to leaving. BUT, a leader should also take care of his peeps. Ride your own ride, but as Brian has said, when you get to a stop or a straight, count headlamps, make sure all are good to go, and everyone is feeling comfortable and having a good time.


At the 2010 Red River Rally, I will not evolve it into a regimented organized ride, as that is NOT what I want, and not what alot of the guys I enjoy riding with want. However, If you VOLUNTEER to LEAD, I WILL EXPECT you to take the decision seriously, and TAKE CARE OF YOUR GROUP....

I digress...

[bradleymaynar]

Unfortunately, this philosophy and courtesy, seems to have been lost on some "leaders" of rallys recently. I have personally been victim of TWO (and oddly, the SAME "leader" ) instances where the leader either lost part of his group, or had a rider or TWO go down and wasnt even aware of it. I wont spit names, but THIS person wasnt a GSR, and it wasnt a GSR rally. Tho he IS/WAS the Area Director for the COG group in the SWOH area i believe.. ( know he was a COG Director, just not sure of WHERE for sure)

Recently Ive talked to a couple of GSRs and some other riders I am friends with who were, and have been pretty ticked off by some group "leaders" on a couple of GS rallys however, feeling that they'd been left or lost, and also that the leaders they were speaking of didnt seem to give a hoot who was behind them, or how many. Basicly, NOT being a good leader.

Its not my belief that a ride should be as organized as the rides ive taken with Wingers...although they have VERY SAFE rides, and its still quite entertaining, I feel that SOME would feel very constrained by such organization. I also do not believe that a ride or group leader should have to BABY SIT other riders, and ride a pace that EVERYONE is comfortable with.

HOWEVER, I DO believe that a ride or grop leader/organizer SHOULD FEEL AND BE RESPONSIBLE for his entire group! There are exceptions to the rule, as always, but if youre going to volunteer to LEAD, then you should also be volunteering to ASSURE that you keep everyone with you, no rider is LOST or LEFT BEHIND, broken down or not. You should also make your intentions on pace, distance and route CLEAR to anyone who may want to ride under your leadership. This includes CHOICE of ROAD. If you know you have some rookie or relatively NEW riders in the group, you may not want to head down a bunch of pig path, beaten up roads that may be trecherous for a newbie. On the OTHER side of the coin, if these roads are part of your route, you may want to consider suggesting that the newb take this into account and may want to ride with someone else. If he then choses to ride with you anyway, thats on him/her. ALL riders should be responsible for themselves. This includes riding at their own pace, assuring that thier bike is up for the challenge, and making the leader aware of any concerns or issues they may have prior to leaving. BUT, a leader should also take care of his peeps. Ride your own ride, but as Brian has said, when you get to a stop or a straight, count headlamps, make sure all are good to go, and everyone is feeling comfortable and having a good time.


At the 2010 Red River Rally, I will not evolve it into a regimented organized ride, as that is NOT what I want, and not what alot of the guys I enjoy riding with want. However, If you VOLUNTEER to LEAD, I WILL EXPECT you to take the decision seriously, and TAKE CARE OF YOUR GROUP....

I digress...

Thanks Josh! I think we've managed to make atleast GS Discussion material here. Gonna cut and paste and give this thread what it deserves, a break.

Brad bk

[Buffalo Bill]

Hope not to offend…

Hope I didn't offend you Brad, you sound like a good egg.
Group leading is a big deal, and I would think more than 4 followers would be too many and string out too far, unless it were a parade.
Tim followed me through our ride in Berrien Co. and I almost got him a citation and fine, OOPS!
I felt like I should go faster in order to entertain him, or I should slow down because he didn't know the roads and was riding a heavier bike. I was just glad I spotted the 2nd trooper stalking us before we got into more trouble.
Bill