Honda/Nissan/(Mitsubishi) merger

[oldGSfan]

Had a 2002 Nissan Frontier 4x4 crew cab longbed. My first new vehicle I ever bought. Really liked it. Had it for 13 years. Ran great mostly, till one thing after another started to go. All in all, a solid truck. I really liked the bold styling, compared to the others in the category at the time: Taco, Ranger. Nissan really seems to have softened on the styling since then IMHO. The later gens seem pretty bland to me now. We had a Pathfinder for a few years too. Also a solid vehicle. IIRC we traded that for a minivan because that was more practical for us at the time. Fuel economy on both Nissans was not great. Doesn’t seem like they’ve improved on that. Checking the numbers in the newer trucks shows they’re about the same. That’s over 20 years of development with practically no improvement in fuel economy. Doesn’t seem right. Once had a Rogue as a loner for a few days. I think it was when their CVT was still new. I hated that transmission. Couldn’t really pinpoint why. Just didn’t like anything about it.

Yes I agree, that's what I was sort of alluding to earlier, when Renault got involved it seemed the cars got really ugly, and really cheap. Sure, maybe they solved financials but dang, the cars looked awful. I had a Frontier too, a '98. I bought it new at such a discount that I sold it for a profit a year later. Never been done! My wife barfed into the dashboard vent and I had to sell it, on a cold day. On a hot day it smelled like an A's burger's burrito and would kill the sale LOL. Other than that it was pretty good but I was so cheap I bought a single cab, much too small. To my eternal regret, to buy it I sold a really clean '71 F250 Camper special with a 390 because it had a rear main seal leak I didn't want to fix, and I didn't want it soiling the driveway of the house I had just bought. What an idiot! I paid $1K for it and made a profit, but it was super clean.

[Rob S.]

I bought an '09 Infiniti G37 Sport/Auto. I was seduced by that 328 HP and the chassis and brakes. The price was good at 35K out the door. It only has about 95K miles on it now, and it has been pretty solid, but there are issues.

First is a harshness in the engine on any cool day, say 60 or so. It runs like it's got a bag of rocks in it, prob running on 5 cylinders. 10 minutes later when it is warmed up, almost on the dot, it cures itself. It's been to the dealership for diagnosis, and self-proclaimed Nissan/Infiniti VQ experts, and nobody can find anything wrong. I cleaned the throttle body after reading that may be the issue. Nope. That sux. Worse than that, the interior has disintegrated. The dashboard has turned into a fly-trap, i.e. a big gluey mess that defies cleaning. All the LED dashboard lights have poofed out. To replace those is not for the faint of heart, or wallet. I make do with an LED light shining on them, haha. Oh, all the thin rubber coating on interior surfaces lasted about 2 years, then turned into a mess. Jeez. Mechanically I had to replace the rear axle seal as it was making noises, and the heater hose behind the engine, which was not fun. Not bad, it's strong mechanically for sure. I just donated a few ounces of knuckle meat putting in a new starter, hey $80 vs over $500 to have it done is worth a bit of blood!

So no problems? "Pretty solid"?

[Rob S.]

My wife barfed into the dashboard vent...

You know what we say here at the GS Resources...show us the pics or it never happened.

Definitely intrigued by your wife.

[oldGSfan]

So no problems? "Pretty solid"?

Nothing blew up. Solid from a mechanical perspective.

[wyly]

I don't see what Honda gains from this other than a lot of engineers a bigger workforce and assembly plants. Maybe it's to counter an expected tsunami of ev cars coming out of China.

[wyly]

Toyota has been hesitant on the full EV front. And I don't blame them. Internal combustion engines are their history, so trashing that must be very difficult for them. And Honda, maybe even more so. They make some of the best lawn equipment, generators, boat engines, and of course, motorcycles.

But Toyota is going all in on Solid State batteries it's assuming control of Panasonic batteries.

[wyly]

BYD is putting the smack down in China, the world's largest auto market. China sales were 26M in 2023. The US market, in 2nd place, is 1/2 of that.

Electric cars are coming fast. Sadly, electric cars in the US, other than Tesla, are losing money for the automakers.

Some are bashing Honda for taking on Nissan, and their debt. Nissan is a company with deep engineering skills and resources, though, and Honda knows that. Hopefully, they can work together and create something great.

Hybrid sales are good in the US. I think they will be the stopgap for a number of years here. Full EV's are the future, though.

I agree hybrid sales are where it's at right now Toyota is doing well with it's hybrids. I expect when Toyota gets it's SS batteries up and running the switch to full SS EVs wont be far behind. SS Lexus Hybrids should be out next year.

Honda has finished building a Solid State research facility and from their press reports intends to be selling SS EVs including motorcycles before 2030, and only SS Evs by 2040.

https://global.honda/en/newsroom/news/2024/c241121eng.html

I don't think there's much doubt the age of ICEs is closing fast I wouldn't want to be the guy that buys the last $150K pickup rolling of the assembly the resale value is going to take a hit.

[GS1150Pilot]

A good read on the issue of the world going fully EV:

The Future of Internal-Combustion Engines | Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA)

[wyly]

Very good article, I just skimmed through it's very long I'll to sit down a give it a better read when I time.

A couple quick observations, claiming ev numbers is only a small percentage of cars on the road isn't taking into account the average life span of a car is 11 yrs, as practical ev's are still fairly recent I expect we'll see a noticeable *@%^$*@%^$*@%^$*@%^$ in 5yrs in North America, domestic builders need to improve their products.

Rural areas slow to adopt evs, Not surprising rural people being more conservative are slow to pick up new technology. And the range issues haven't been solved for their needs.

All the various fuels for ICE, I see that as stop gap measures for countries that are far behind in ev infrastructure. Toyota is a conservative company it knows the future is electric but its taking it slow covering all bases.

When Battery range, charge and infrastructures issues are solved I can't envision ICE surviving except for super clean emission vehicles but that will only delay the inevitable. Give consumers 1000km range, gobs of pin you to your seat torque, 10-15min home charging and I'll never own another ICE again.

[rphillips]

Probably nobody ever thought we wouldn't eventually evolve into something better than ICE, Just seems we've not evolved that far "yet". When we do folks will buy them just cause they think they're better than ICE. Even that Ford CEO, Jim Farley, back last Aug., after a trip in a Ford EV admitted we had a ways to go and how challenging keeping the Ford charged was. Seems we've knid'f been getting forced towards EV's for the past few yrs., before they have evolved enough to suit the general public. No doubt, we'll get there, just not yet.

[oldGSfan]

Probably nobody ever thought we wouldn't eventually evolve into something better than ICE, Just seems we've not evolved that far "yet". When we do folks will buy them just cause they think they're better than ICE. Even that Ford CEO, Jim Farley, back last Aug., after a trip in a Ford EV admitted we had a ways to go and how challenging keeping the Ford charged was. Seems we've knid'f been getting forced towards EV's for the past few yrs., before they have evolved enough to suit the general public. No doubt, we'll get there, just not yet.

My then 18 y/o son met Jim Farley in the pits at Monterey Historics in Sept '23. Farley chatted with him a few minutes (my son is a bit of a gearhead...) and let him sit in his Cobra, which he raced to a very close 2nd. It was about 1 hour before the race. After the race my son was hanging around the pits, waiting to see him come back in, and Farley (cousin of Chris) got rushed off to do a promo for the latest electric Mustang. Pretty wild being in such a time where things are transitioning. We love the past but embrace the future. Hopefully.

[GS1150Pilot]

Very good article, I just skimmed through it's very long I'll to sit down a give it a better read when I time.

A couple quick observations, claiming ev numbers is only a small percentage of cars on the road isn't taking into account the average life span of a car is 11 yrs, as practical ev's are still fairly recent I expect we'll see a noticeable *@%^$*@%^$*@%^$*@%^$ in 5yrs in North America, domestic builders need to improve their products.

Rural areas slow to adopt evs, Not surprising rural people being more conservative are slow to pick up new technology. And the range issues haven't been solved for their needs.

All the various fuels for ICE, I see that as stop gap measures for countries that are far behind in ev infrastructure. Toyota is a conservative company it knows the future is electric but its taking it slow covering all bases.

When Battery range, charge and infrastructures issues are solved I can't envision ICE surviving except for super clean emission vehicles but that will only delay the inevitable. Give consumers 1000km range, gobs of pin you to your seat torque, 10-15min home charging and I'll never own another ICE again.

While I may own an electric grocery getter in the form of an electric bike or tiny hatch, I do not think, in my lifetime, that I will ever be without an IC vehicle. I say that as I lay plans for finding either an early 70's El Camino or Ranchero and while loving the Harley and looking at Guzzis and various Beemers.