Valve stem seals, without removing the cylinder head

[posplayr]

I am almost sure non of those compressors will work on a GS with the double springs down in the bucket bores, but good luck.

I have personally used the first one to do a GS1100ED head. The only problem is with doing it on a bare head as you torque the head with the handle.

Chef1366 helped me if you want to ask him.

[posplayr]

on the floor

[azr]

Just watched steves video, still cant see why I cant do it with the head on.


I will need to make "special tools"

- the pvc pipe

- the spring compresser yes this is tricky, frame in way an all, but it might well be a good leverage point.

- a keeper installer, ive seen some that are like tweezers, only the tips are shaped to hold the keepers, used with grease. once on they hold keeper with spring tension till valve is released.

This would be a great addition to the 'how to' tutorials if you get it to work. If we could change out the seals without having to spend the $$$ on base and head gaskets that would be great. Looking forward to your progress.

[Suzuki_Don]

It might just be possible to change the valve seals on the 16 valve head (as in Jim's pictures) as the springs stand proud of the head. But there is no way in the world that you can do this on an 8-valve head while the head is still in place on the motor in the frame. It is a battle to do it with the head on the bench let alone still being on the motor. The motor you are talking about uses the bucket system and these as well as the springs are recessed down inside the head.

I hope you can prove me wrong, but I doubt it.

[Buddy]

I've done it on an 8 valve head in frame. It aint easy. So hard infact I don't want to relive it here telling how. But I'll try.

I used a piece of rope, a pvc pipe coupling with a window cut in it, a cam bearing block form a junk head, a hose clamp and a pry bar. Feed the rope into the cylinder and turn the engine to put presure on the valves. Put the clamp around the cam block and pry against it with the bar pressing down on the pvc.The hardest part is keeping the spring cap centered in the pvc coupling while you put in the retainers.

Hope that helps,
Buddy

[duaneage]

I'll throw my .02 cents in and say it's probably faster to pop the head and do it right than try to work with it together. It is a real Hillary to get those keepers in with the head off, I can't imagine working around the frame spine, with the engine where it is, and getting them in.

Unless you are generating a cloud behind you on deceleration I would leave it alone and not worry about it. If you are burning that much oil it would be good to pull the head, clean off the valve stems, and button her back up

[sedelen]

Are you really sure you want to "attempt" this? Sounds like you need the help of a master, like Houdini. Short of that, it sounds like a desparation
attempt to save from the cost of purchasing a few gaskets. If you do this I wish you well, good luck. If it were me, I'd pull the head off.
Ropes in the cylinder, air to keep the valves up, you've got to be kidding me! I can visualize the anguish already.

[john82q]

food for thought

if only it were a honda;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_9Y8Y2vEXw

Thing about the amazon tool is I dont like the hitting, if were miss-aligned, you could bend the valve. That could happen easy, given the clearance/access issues, also the bore for the bucket could be in peril.


had in mind something like this,YES i know this wont work on the GS, but it gives me ideas, and they hurt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-I85URitTdM&feature=related

This is totally about cheapness, yes tearing it down would be better, but that will cost at least hundreds, seals cost just $20. If this can be done then I wont need a rebuild for a few more years.

The bikes running fine, except for the oil it uses which costs money (300 ml per 200k) Rings seal ok, compression is high, there are other leaks that ive already fixed. The only smoke I ever see is on the over run and startup.

But even if some is getting past the rings if I can reduce oil consumption, by say 50% for an investment of $20 then im still on a big winner.

[duaneage]

Speaking from experience I can tell you it's a tricky operation and there is only about 1/4 inch of leeway when the spring is down to get the keepers in. One slip and they go flying.
you won't be able to use the rope method because the cams will be out and the pistons will be free. Compressed air is the only option and both cams have to be off.
Good luck with it and report back how it goes.

[Nessism]

you won't be able to use the rope method because the cams will be out and the pistons will be free. Compressed air is the only option and both cams have to be off.

Please explain this comment. Why would the cams have to be in place to use the rope method?

BTW, Buddy already detailed how he did the job using the rope method. What's the confusion about?

[mike_of_bbg]

Yeah, as long as somebody is holding up the cam chain I don't see any issues with turning the crank to compress rope for holding up the valves with the cams out. But yes, it is tight work on an 8V in any case. Having the frame in the way isn't going to help. Definitely a 2-person job to me. The next time I adjust valves (not due for a long time now) I'll have to look and think about it. Some metal strap bolted down in place of the cam caps might make a good leverage point. Broom stick hooked there pushing down windowed PVC pipe over valves. Sheet in place to prevent keepers from falling anywhere they can't be recovered...

[john82q]

so I went ahead and started

So last night I said "f it" and ripped in.

Airbox out, carbs off, cover off, tensioner and cams out.

Had a look and decided cylinders 2 and 3 exhaust will be the hardest with the least amount of room. so gunna start there.

took the bucket out.




made a arrangement so the engine can be turned with out the cam chain jamming, just pvc and wire the chain slides over the pvc pipes ok.



fed about a 1 foot of rope into the plug hole, turned it by hand till it jamed.
clamped a spanner to the crash bar so the engine cant turn , accidently.




made a pvc "special tool" and put it in place,




I used a piece of timber as a lever against the spine of the frame and pushed down, and this is where I stuck the first snag.

The 25mm PVC I used fitted in the bucket bore, but the spring retainer pushed up inside the PVC. (ie the ID of the tube is too big) and didnt compress the spring at all.

However in the Pic above it would seem access to the keepers wont be so bad, remember this will be the worst one. (Provided I remove the chair to access the other side)

I will buy the next size down PVC today and try again tonight.


John

[Suzuki_Don]

Well done John. Am watching with baited breath for the next episode. You got a lot of work done on the first night, cams out, etc. At least with the engine in the frame you have a number of good leverage points.

Good luck and keep at it.

[hampshirehog]

I would throw a rag over the cam chain tunnel at the very least - don't want a keeper disappearing off down there.

[Buddy]

You're on the right track. Good job on the chain rollers. It is a good idea to cover the chain tunnel. I let a keeper get away from me and was very relieved to find it caught in the wires next to the coils.

Buddy