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Feeler Gauge Wont Go Through Cam Lobes

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    Feeler Gauge Wont Go Through Cam Lobes

    I just recently put the head back on my 78 GS550 after cleaning the valves and installing new valve gaskets. As I proceeded to check the valve clearance I could not fit the thinnest part of my feeler garage (.0015 inch) through the clearance between my cam lobe and my shim bucket. I thought to loosen the cam chain and the cam caps but it still would not fit. Does anyone know what could have happened?

    Thanks

    #2
    You need thinner shims.
    Ed

    To measure is to know.

    Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

    Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

    Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

    KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by SB3 View Post
      I just recently put the head back on my 78 GS550 after cleaning the valves and installing new valve gaskets. As I proceeded to check the valve clearance I could not fit the thinnest part of my feeler garage (.0015 inch) through the clearance between my cam lobe and my shim bucket. I thought to loosen the cam chain and the cam caps but it still would not fit. Does anyone know what could have happened?

      Thanks
      What do you mean by valve gaskets? Valve seals? Did you remove the valves? Did you remove carbon build up in the combustion chamber, on the valve seats on the head and valves? Possibly mixed them up? Are all of them tight or are some of them really loose. Did you possibly mix up the shims?
      :cool:GSRick
      No God, no peace. Know God, know peace.

      Eric Bang RIP 9/5/2018
      Have some bikes ready for us when we meet up.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by gsrick View Post
        What do you mean by valve gaskets? Valve seals? Did you remove the valves? Did you remove carbon build up in the combustion chamber, on the valve seats on the head and valves? Possibly mixed them up? Are all of them tight or are some of them really loose. Did you possibly mix up the shims?
        yes, valve seals. Sorry got ahead of myself. Thanks for pointing that out! I removed carbon build up from my valves and the head of the combustion chamber. Also honed the cylinder walls. I labeled everything accordingly and even put everything in individual plastic bags so I highly doubt I got them mixed up.

        Maybe the new valve seals are making the gap tighter???

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Nessism View Post
          You need thinner shims.
          Thought that was the case, just didn't know if it was a bigger problem or not

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by SB3 View Post

            Maybe the new valve seals are making the gap tighter???
            No.

            Most likely the valves were carboned up because they weren't adjusted regularly and were hanging open (and losing compression), and now that you cleaned them they are seating down better onto the seat which moves them deeper into the head and thus thinner shims are needed.



            .
            Last edited by Nessism; 05-20-2019, 10:36 PM.
            Ed

            To measure is to know.

            Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

            Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

            Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

            KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Nessism View Post
              No.

              Most likely the valves were carboned up because the valves weren't adjusted regularly and they were hanging open a little, and now that you cleaned them they are seating down better onto the seat which moves them deeper into the head and thus thinner shims are needed.
              That's what i'm thinking if the parts didn't get moved around.
              :cool:GSRick
              No God, no peace. Know God, know peace.

              Eric Bang RIP 9/5/2018
              Have some bikes ready for us when we meet up.

              Comment


                #8
                Depending on how you "cleaned the valves", you might have simply removed some carbon that was holding the valves open a bit or you might have removed a bit of metal. Either way, the valves are closing farther, which is now properly. As Nessism says, you need thinner shims.

                May I suggest taking advantage of the offer in my signature?

                .
                sigpic
                mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                Family Portrait
                Siblings and Spouses
                Mom's first ride
                Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by Steve View Post
                  Depending on how you "cleaned the valves", you might have simply removed some carbon that was holding the valves open a bit or you might have removed a bit of metal. Either way, the valves are closing farther, which is now properly. As Nessism says, you need thinner shims.

                  May I suggest taking advantage of the offer in my signature?

                  .
                  I use a regular scotch brite pad and some WD-40. Attaching the valves to a drill. I was very careful to not remove any medal. Just as much carbon as I could without staying in one spot for a long time, maybe 10-15 seconds for each the bottom and tops of the valves. When I was done I dried them and sprayed for WD on them.

                  But yes, Steve, I sent you an email just now, I'd appreciate the spreadsheet I've read a lot about it!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by SB3 View Post
                    I use a regular scotch brite pad and some WD-40. Attaching the valves to a drill. I was very careful to not remove any medal. Just as much carbon as I could without staying in one spot for a long time, maybe 10-15 seconds for each the bottom and tops of the valves.

                    It seems pretty clear then that the motor was previously abused. For some reason a lot of people don't maintain their bikes; they ride them until they start to run crappy and then they try to figure out why. With shim type GS Suzuki's the valve clearance decreases with usage and eventually all the clearance goes away and the valves don't close anymore. When this happens the valves and seats accumulate carbon and compression goes down, and eventually the bike won't run well or at all. Suzuki calls for checking the valve clearance at 3500 mile intervals but it's startling how many owners don't pay attention.
                    Ed

                    To measure is to know.

                    Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

                    Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

                    Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

                    KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Nessism View Post
                      It seems pretty clear then that the motor was previously abused. For some reason a lot of people don't maintain their bikes; they ride them until they start to run crappy and then they try to figure out why. With shim type GS Suzuki's the valve clearance decreases with usage and eventually all the clearance goes away and the valves don't close anymore. When this happens the valves and seats accumulate carbon and compression goes down, and eventually the bike won't run well or at all. Suzuki calls for checking the valve clearance at 3500 mile intervals but it's startling how many owners don't pay attention.
                      You hit the nail on the head, I bought the bike off a guy that I'm pretty sure was a drug head... So he probably didn't take care of it all

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Does you guys recommend running the motor before replacing the shims?

                        For example, if the OP goes down one size on the shims now, is it likely he'll need to go down another size after running the motor?

                        Another example: my bike has sat for a year. Should I ride it for a few days/miles before I check and replace the shims or can I check shims now?
                        Last edited by hannibal; 05-21-2019, 05:37 PM.
                        Jordan

                        1977 Suzuki GS750 (My first bike)
                        2000 Kawasaki ZRX1100
                        1973 BMW R75/5

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Not sure if running it first will help any, but you do need to make sure the engine has not been run for at least eight hours before checking clearance. Since you are at that "8 plus" right now, why not do it?

                          .
                          sigpic
                          mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                          hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                          #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                          #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                          Family Portrait
                          Siblings and Spouses
                          Mom's first ride
                          Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                          (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I've done valve checks after less than 1 hour cool down using a fan blowing on the engine. As long as you can put your hand on the cams and don't feel an increase in temperature you are good to go.

                            Regarding running the engine after a rebuild before checking the valves: NO! Do them before running the engine and then again after a few hundred miles.
                            Last edited by Nessism; 05-21-2019, 07:38 PM.
                            Ed

                            To measure is to know.

                            Mikuni O-ring Kits For Sale...https://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ts#post1703182

                            Top Newbie Mistakes thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...d.php?t=171846

                            Carb rebuild tutorial...https://gsarchive.bwringer.com/mtsac...d_Tutorial.pdf

                            KZ750E Rebuild Thread...http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum...0-Resurrection

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Ed, have you ever compared clearance on hot and cold engines? I am curious how much it changes, but have never been quite curious enough to take the time to do it myself.

                              .
                              sigpic
                              mine: 2000 Honda GoldWing GL1500SE and 1980 GS850G'K' "Junior"
                              hers: 1982 GS850GL - "Angel" and 1969 Suzuki T250 Scrambler
                              #1 son: 1986 Yamaha Venture Royale 1300 and 1982 GS650GL "Rat Bagger"
                              #2 son: 1980 GS1000G
                              Family Portrait
                              Siblings and Spouses
                              Mom's first ride
                              Want a copy of my valve adjust spreadsheet for your 2-valve per cylinder engine? Send me an e-mail request (not a PM)
                              (Click on my username in the upper-left corner for e-mail info.)

                              Comment

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