School me on paint, please :)

[Guest]

So, I'm getting into the nitty gritty of my GS300 rebuild and I'd like to start thinking about the easier parts like painting. I'm using a 50's era Chevy Belair as a theme for the bike, mixed with a Bonne for styling.

Thanks to TimTom, here is a mockup of what I would like the end result to look like - a slightly surfier green but the lines and flow, etc.



I am in need of some advice of what options I have for painting. I would like to go for that rad surf green with a white/cream two tone to really give it that retro vibe. Color isn't where I'm stumped, its the method of painting that has me stumped. So I have a few questions...

1. I don't have access to a spray gun system, so is aerosol can my only option for the tank and the side covers?

2. Getting the frame prepped - sand blast or stripper and wire wheel on a drill? I don't think it is it that bad of shape, but I want to do a thorough job obviously and not have to worry about any rust eating away at the paint.

3. Clear coat - I've heard of a rattle can that is worth while, Spraymax or something?

4. After I polish alot of the covers, rims, etc., what is the best clear coat I should use to keep em looking fresh?

5. Does anyone know a good source for automotive rattlecans that may have the colors I'm looking for?

6. Any alternatives to powder coating the frame that are durable and inexpensive?

I may just look into calling a place like MAACO and see how much they would charge to paint everything after I got it everything prepped, although I am on a budget obviously.

Or if there is anyone in the DC area that is pretty handy with a spray gun and tape that wouldn't mind shooting some tins for me and earning a little cash and a six pack?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated and I'll try to throw some of my paint prepping and final product photos in this thread as I move along.

Thanks!

[Big Rich]

Spraymax 2K Clear, which I get from www.repaintsupply.com, is what you're thinking of.

I use black Appliance epoxy on frames after prepping - it takes a while to cure but is great paint. Doesn't need a primer or clear coat, and can go over top of scuffed original paint (but not rust or grease obviously).

Sorry, rushed reply..........

[Flyboy]

I am no guru, but will drop my 2c anyway....

1. I don't have access to a spray gun system, so is aerosol can my only option for the tank and the side covers?

Any good auto paint shop should be able to supply you with base coat and clearcoat in an aerosol can, they work great, go down well.

2. Getting the frame prepped - sand blast or stripper and wire wheel on a drill? I don't think it is it that bad of shape, but I want to do a thorough job obviously and not have to worry about any rust eating away at the paint.

Many ways to skin a cat, the best, read easiest is sandblasting if you have the gear, or are willing to pay to have it done.
If you are doing it yourself, go for a mixture of paint stripper and the rotary wire brush on the drill.
You don't want to just use the wire brush, you will hate your life, it takes forever and you go through a few of them, so it becomes costly, also makes a horrible mess.
Take the bulk of the paint off with a good strong paint stripper, the good strong non eco friendly stuff, then use the wire wheel as needed to finish off.

3. Clear coat - I've heard of a rattle can that is worth while, Spraymax or something?

Yes, not sure of the brand over there, but that is what you need a 2k clear coat or every drop of fuel spilled will eat your paint alive.

4. After I polish alot of the covers, rims, etc., what is the best clear coat I should use to keep em looking fresh?

Mmmmm, I guess that depends on where you stay and how big a problem rust is for you.
Personally I would not put clear over polished metal, it yellows and fades with time and chips, although if you stay in an area where rust is a real problem, you may have no choice, but a bit of elbow grease and a good rubbing with some metal polish once a week should keep things shining.
You can maybe apply a good wax instead of a clear coat.

5. Does anyone know a good source for automotive rattlecans that may have the colors I'm looking for?

Sorry

6. Any alternatives to powder coating the frame that are durable and inexpensive?

No powder coat or paint are your options, if powder coating is too expensive you have to paint, I am sure the guys here will tell you what they used and what results they had and how it held up.
I used a 2k in a can as I also don't have a compressor, and I was very happy with the result, the 2k has a hardener, so it is durable.
Or you could just polish the whole frame......

Good luck with it and be sure to post updates with lots of pics as you progress, you know how we all love pics.

[Flyboy]

Remember, all the painting advice and even painting skill is worthless unless you prep the parts properly first.
The key is in the preparation for painting, no amount of paint can cover a badly prepped surface, even the slightest imperfection will show up like a wart on a nose when you lay colour over it.
So take your time, spend hours, days...hell, weeks if you have to to get it right, this cannot be stressed strongly enough.

[hjacobmiller]

Thanks! Boy, what a great response! I really appreciate all the great info - now it is just a matter of actually doing it...

I spent a fair amount of time on google looking for a paint supplier and I came up with these two:

https://www.paintscratch.com

https://www.automotivetouchup.com

Looks like they can match the exact color code of the 57 Belair, but unfortunately looks to be a bit pricey @ around $20-$25 a can, plus clear coat.

Has anyone used these before?

I don't know if I could justify polishing once a week, and I don't have a fancy garage or equipment that would really lend itself to that much shine time. I also don't think the girlfriend would appreciate me massaging the bike more than her

I definitely agree about the prepping though - any good references for me to read up on how to do a proper prep?

Thanks again and look forward to more knowledge!

[Flyboy]

Well the good news is, you don't have to spend your life polishing, and in fact, you shouldn't, the less you have to polish, the better.
Polishing should only be done to remove imperfections and damage, such as swirl marks in the paint.
Remember it is not the polish that shines, it is the paint that shines, paint that is in good condition, damaged paint does not shine, so by polishing, we are correcting the paint, to make it shine again.
So the trick is to avoid paint damage in the first place, if the paint has no damage, we don't need to polish.
Remember, polishing corrects paint and repairs the damage, not by filling it, but by removing the top layer of paint that is damaged, so therefore it holds true that if we polish every week, it will not be long before we eventually remove all the paint. So the less you need to polish, the better.
The trick is to polish the paint to a high gloss finish, then apply a good wax, to seal the paint, once the paint is sealed, it is protected, to a point.
Because waxing is nothing more than adding a barrier on top of the paint, you can wax to your hearts content as often as you like.

So avoid damage to the paint with proper washing technique and seal the paint with a good wax to give it a protective barrier, then you should only need to polish to remove damage, no other time.

Of course this is not a perfect world and damage will occur from time to time. no matter how careful we are, but you can go a long way to minimizing it, remember, every time you touch the paint, such as washing, there is the possibility of damage to the paint, so try and keep it to a minimum.
No need to wash the bike every week because it is the ritual, wash it if it is dirty, otherwise leave it be.
Use a proper two bucket washing technique, but that is a whole other thread.

[hjacobmiller]

Thanks Flyboy! But I'm not taking a word of your advice until you give me an update on Jennifer's makeover. My girlfriend and I read through that thread (she liked the story line, I liked the great info and craftmanship).

So please, do all of us a favor who are waiting with held breath and tell us what your status is!

On the painting note, I've called a few places around where I live to investigate blasting and powdercoating the frame. A lot less expensive than I would have imagined, around $250 for the whole process and if I bring him some other stuff he'll work out some sort of price deal he says.

Sooo..... my goal is by Sunday to have everything down to the frame, stripped the paint and have given it a once over with the wire wheel. Figure I'll save him some shop time and me some $$$ by doing so. Then, after a few weeks and a couple more paychecks under my belt I can bring him a heap of parts. I'm debating what all I should have powder coated. So, I need some suggestions for powder coat colors. My thoughts thus far are:

Frame (dark grey/black)
Swing arm (dark grey/black)
Upper and Lower Triple Trees (silver)
Peg brackets & Levers (silver)

Wheels to match the frame, but I am torn because he has to do the whole wheel and won't be able to leave me any room to polish, which is bad because I need the chrome-like finish for the classic look.

Here is the exact colors I am thinking of for the tank and the covers (minus the rust :


Extra points to anyone who can tell me what make & model that truck is.

[Flyboy]

hahahahaha, yes, Jennifer's make over has been on hold for the last three months due to the ability of the wallet to stretch only so far, and I had to put all the coins aside to come and visit you lot on that side of the pond.
Was over there last week of July, first week of August visiting Dale (Rustybronco) to drag him kicking and screaming to the Oshkosh Air show.
But you will be pleased to know that work and progress on her, resumed this weekend past again, updates to follow as soon as I have something picture worthy.

I see you stay in Williamsberg VA, a very good friend of mine from here, who immigrated over to the dark side, lives there as well now, small world.
He flys survey for a crowd out there, I forget the name of the outfit now.
We learnt to fly together.

[hjacobmiller]

Well I went to grad school in Williasmburg, but now I am up north in the Washington DC area, or as I have affectionately nicknamed it, "The Valley of the Never Ending Line of Cagers."

Good to hear your back on her though! Beautiful work, well written tutorials, just an all around good thread.

You may find this interesting - two dear friends of mine (brothers) are knee deep in building a little flying machine:

http://rvhaslanded.blogspot.com/

[hjacobmiller]

A little update on the frame -

Taking to powder coaters on Thursday! Woo hoo! Really excited, and hoping to pick up some time next week. I'll call the guy to make sure, but I think it will be an easy drop off.

Here is the frame:


First go round with the stripping:



Tried the wire wheel drill combo for about 20 minutes and said the hell with it. They have to blast for prepping for power coat any ways so I'll let them deal with it.

So a few questions:

1. How much/where do I need ground points to the frame? I'm guessing the coating will not conduct, so I need some advice on where to have them leave some bare spots for the engine to ground to.

2. Color suggestions for the frame, swing arm, other accessories previously mentioned?

Thanks and looking for some replies!

[Flyboy]

Hahahaha, told you. wire brush is a PIA, ask me how I know.
Good to see the progress, keep at it.
One point, if you can, just remember to plug off all the holes where you don't need powder coat, that stuff is thick and sticks like a SOB, I sugesst screwing bolts into all the threaded holes to keep powder out of the threads, or you will have a right job putting it all back together, you will hava to run a tap through the threads to clean them up.
Also, don't forget the steering stem openings, swing arm openings and the hole where the rear brake lever goes through the frame.
You can ground the frame anywhere, I would leave a spot near the battery box, for th battery and at one of the rear engine mounts for the engine.
Or you could just grind those two places clean when you get the frame back.
I reckon good old high gloss black is a good colour for the frame, and will work well with the scheme you plan om using.

[hjacobmiller]

Ha yeah I know. I wimped out and was like them deal with it.

I don't know if I'm really digging black though.

What are thoughts on silver/dark gray? I don't want to take away from the chrome though....

[Flyboy]

Dark Grey could work, I reckon a hammertone finish would look good.



Or maybe an off white ivory/cream colour, to accent the old school green.

[Syncro]

DON'T SAND BLAST!!!!! It distorts he metal, A friend had his truck sandblasted and the painter asked how the body got so f*cked, Media blast it or wire wheel, if anything block sand it, but I do not suggest sandblasting.

[hjacobmiller]

Thanks! Yeah, I don't even think they do actual 'sand' blasting any more. At least not in the DC area with all the environmental/health restrictions around here.

Thanks though I appreciate it!

Flyboy - that hammertone was exactly was I was thinking!