Delayed gear engagement

[Guest]

Not carb/ fuel/exhaust problem but I've noticed lately that my bike has been having a delay after I shift and release clutchthere is a delay before it goes into gear... Seems to go away after riding for a while. Always worse when motors cold. Not sure if its a clutch or transmission issue

[OldVet66]

I have not experienced or heard of that but it sounds like you might want to check your clutch cable first to make sure it's not starting to bind up a bit. It's not normal. A clutch cable needing adjustment will cause things like difficulty shifting into neutral. What type of oil are you using in the bike? Automotive oil will make the clutch slip. You want to be using something like Rotella-T in these old bikes.

[John Park]

The six speed is rather different in its habits compared to the 5 speeds. I'm not sure exactly why the symptom you're having occurs, but it's a common 'feature' of the breed. There is a spring cam mechanism which - once past the halfway point - pulls the drum into the next gear. If the spring is getting weak, which is probably universal by now, any resistance to turning the drum or sliding the dogs and gears on the shafts will be enough to hang it up. Commonly, it's sixth that is the worst because they made the engagement dogs pretty tight to eliminate chain snatch and slop.

Oils are a bit contentious, but the universal choice seems to be Shell Rotella. I don't use it, but it's hard to fault from a price/performance standpoint. That said, on the twins you have a different gearbox and in my experience the synthetics work better in them. They are thinner when cold and it takes a long time for a twin to get almost the same amount of oil up to temperature. In fact, on long mountain downhills you can end up with pretty thick oil by the time you get to the bottom. Good motorcycle synthetics will not cause any clutch or engine problems, but they are pretty expensive; if you have a clean running motor you can leave them in quite a bit longer tho.

I haven't used them in a very long while, but back when I used to, I found that automotive oils would crap out in less than a thousand miles and my clutch would get grabby and I'd start missing shifts. The transmission gears just destroy the stuff. The recommendation is for 10w-40 and Rotella [an oil made for diesel engines] is 15w-40 so it's a bit thicker when cold; there is also a not too expensive synthetic Rotella in 5w-40 which could be just the ticket for a six speed. I've been happy with Motul 10w-40 5100 or 7100 synthetic but it's spendy. On the other hand you can leave it in for ages and the shifting and clutch performance is stable so you can change it for non gearbox reasons.

There are friction reducing compounds added to m/c oils that are nasty to automotive catalytic converters so they don't put much in auto oils. If you haven't been running something like Rotella it may take a few hundred miles to get things slick in there again.

[tkent02]

Not carb/ fuel/exhaust problem but I've noticed lately that my bike has been having a delay after I shift and release clutchthere is a delay before it goes into gear... Seems to go away after riding for a while. Always worse when motors cold. Not sure if its a clutch or transmission issue

Can you explain what you mean a little more clearly? Is it slow to go into gear, as in a pause before your shift lever will move all the way into the next gear? Or is it slow for the clutch to hook back up after you release it? Is it the same in any gear? Same upshifting or downshifting? What happens if you shift without using the clutch? Do you mean the RPM stays higher for a bit like the clutch is slipping?

I think we are all picturing different problems here.

[John Park]

Can you explain what you mean a little more clearly? Is it slow to go into gear, as in a pause before your shift lever will move all the way into the next gear? Or is it slow for the clutch to hook back up after you release it? Is it the same in any gear? Same upshifting or downshifting? What happens if you shift without using the clutch? Do you mean the RPM stays higher for a bit like the clutch is slipping?

I think we are all picturing different problems here.

If it's clutch slip when cold it could be due to the throwout mechanism being too tight. Clutch plate wear over time could do that if not enough slack was left in the throwout adjustment. When the block heats up it loosens that adjustment. Easy to check.

[tkent02]

And if it's not going into gear it could be something else. He needs to explain it a little better before we go into our guessing games.

[kylemanley1]

Hey, sorry it's hard to explain.... What happens, and I only notice it upshifting, is when I shift up the shift lever shifts fine but after I let out the clutch its like its not in totally in gear and rpms will go up some until it catches

[kylemanley1]

The six speed is rather different in its habits compared to the 5 speeds. I'm not sure exactly why the symptom you're having occurs, but it's a common 'feature' of the breed. There is a spring cam mechanism which - once past the halfway point - pulls the drum into the next gear. If the spring is getting weak, which is probably universal by now, any resistance to turning the drum or sliding the dogs and gears on the shafts will be enough to hang it up. Commonly, it's sixth that is the worst because they made the engagement dogs pretty tight to eliminate chain snatch and slop.

Oils are a bit contentious, but the universal choice seems to be Shell Rotella. I don't use it, but it's hard to fault from a price/performance standpoint. That said, on the twins you have a different gearbox and in my experience the synthetics work better in them. They are thinner when cold and it takes a long time for a twin to get almost the same amount of oil up to temperature. In fact, on long mountain downhills you can end up with pretty thick oil by the time you get to the bottom. Good motorcycle synthetics will not cause any clutch or engine problems, but they are pretty expensive; if you have a clean running motor you can leave them in quite a bit longer tho.

I haven't used them in a very long while, but back when I used to, I found that automotive oils would crap out in less than a thousand miles and my clutch would get grabby and I'd start missing shifts. The transmission gears just destroy the stuff. The recommendation is for 10w-40 and Rotella [an oil made for diesel engines] is 15w-40 so it's a bit thicker when cold; there is also a not too expensive synthetic Rotella in 5w-40 which could be just the ticket for a six speed. I've been happy with Motul 10w-40 5100 or 7100 synthetic but it's spendy. On the other hand you can leave it in for ages and the shifting and clutch performance is stable so you can change it for non gearbox reasons.

There are friction reducing compounds added to m/c oils that are nasty to automotive catalytic converters so they don't put much in auto oils. If you haven't been running something like Rotella it may take a few hundred miles to get things slick in there again.

Wow I never would have even guessed motor oil could be it but makes sense. I started noticing it only since I changed oil. I had the recommended 10w 40 motorcycle oil before. But when I changed it I got some mobile delvac 1300 super 15w40 diesel oil from Walmart (in hindsight probably not the best stuff) just seemed like from alot of what I've read on here I thought any diesel oil would be good

[OldVet66]

I would change over to Rotella-T or back to what you were using before. It sure sounds like the clutch is slipping before it grabs unless it's that 6 speed glitch. I have used both types of Rotella-t and they work fine synthetic or natural..

[tkent02]

What happens, and I only notice it upshifting,

I started noticing it only since I changed oil.

These are both kind of like the additional information we need. What else you got?

[kylemanley1]

Can you explain what you mean a little more clearly? Is it slow to go into gear, as in a pause before your shift lever will move all the way into the next gear? Or is it slow for the clutch to hook back up after you release it? Is it the same in any gear? Same upshifting or downshifting? What happens if you shift without using the clutch? Do you mean the RPM stays higher for a bit like the clutch is slipping?

I think we are all picturing different problems here.

Its not the shift lever. Its more severe in 2nd through 5th gear. I tried shifting without clutch and it was the same. Just put rotella synthetic 5w 40 in it and took it for a short ride, 10 min and didn't notice much improvement. Don't notice it at all when downshifting

[OldVet66]

If it was an oil additive related problem, driving it a while may eventually make it better but a 10 minute drive wouldn't be long enough. Take it for a long drive and see if you have noticed improvement by the end of the day.

[kylemanley1]

Definitely an improvement since the oil change but still a problem. Now I notice it slip when for instance I'm just driving around and I give it a full throttle it will slip out of gear until I let off throttle