• Required reading for all forum users!!!

    Welcome!
    Register to access the full functionality of the GSResources forum. Until you register and activate your account you will not have full forum access, nor will you be able to post or reply to messages.

    A note to new registrants...
    All new forum registrations must be activated via email before you have full access to the forum.

    A Special Note about Email accounts!
    DO NOT SIGN UP USING hotmail, outlook, gmx, sbcglobal, att, bellsouth or email.com. They delete our forum signup emails.

    A note to old forum members...
    I receive numerous requests from people who can no longer log in because their accounts were deleted. As mentioned in the forum FAQ, user accounts are deleted if you haven't logged in for the past 6 months. If you can't log in, then create a new forum account. If you don't get an error message, then check your email account for an activation message. If you get a message stating that the email address is already in use, then your account still exists so follow the instructions in the forum FAQ for resetting your password.

    Have you forgotten your password or have a new email address? Then read the forum FAQ for details on how to reset it.

    Any email requests for "can't log in anymore" problems or "lost my password" problems will be deleted. Read the forum FAQ and follow the instructions there - that's what we have one for...

  • Returning Visitors

    If you are a returning visitor who never received your confirmation email, then odds are your email provider is blockinig emails from our server. The only thing that can be done to get around this is you will have to try creating another forum account using an email address from another domain.

    If you are a returning visitor to the forum and can't log in using your old forum name and password but used to be able to then chances are your account is deleted. Purges of the databases are done regularly. You will have to create a new forum account and you should be all set.

Newbie needs help - stall/sputter shifting into first

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gs425FridayHarbor
  • Start date Start date
G

Gs425FridayHarbor

Guest
Hi all,

i have a '79 425 that hasn't been that well maintained but had fluids replaced, carbs cleaned, and battery swapped last week. I took her on a maiden run and she rode pretty well.

Yesterday I went out to ride, fired up nicely, but she kept stalling when trying to shift into first. Today is presenting a similar situation but put some new ethanol free gas in and wasn't stalling but was just on the verge and sputter trying to get into first. Got on the street shifted into two nicely but then slowed for a turn and the sputtering returned.

Any thoughts anyone may have would be greatly appreciated, esp since I don't have much experience with bikes.

Thanks
 
OK, I'll be first up with the bad news. You have a 37 year old bike that needs a ton of maintenance and a few $$ from an owner that is willing to learn about his bike and make it a reliable and safe machine. Is this you?
If it is then download the manual from here.
Read this.
And read this and this.
That will get you started, there are no easy fixes, no shortcuts and if you do not do the maintenance you will get problem after problem. Sorry but it's the truth.

Welcome to the forum and put your location in your profile - help might be nearby!
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the reply and the resources. I've got some tools handy and now have some good reading material - thank you. I'm hoping this will be a good bike to learn about maintenance and I appreciate your help.
 
BTW, don't swing your leg over this thing until you've had a look at the brakes. Disk up front, drum on the back? They're probably working at 30% efficiency or less, maybe close to seizing. At the very least the fluid needs replacing, in reality everything needs dismantling, cleaning, rubber boots and seals replaced.
 
All good advice above. What are the rpm's when in dies/sputters? if you give it some throttle does it come out of it? Maybe a remote possibility, but it's possible the idle speed is just set too low. Good luck.
 
Hi John,

i had a bike shop look it over before riding. Brakes were seized up when I took it in and he did something to them and checked fluid. Said they are at 35-45 percent. I've been reading all day and found the newbie thread you sent to be helpful.

I took off the exhaust today because shop thought that the plates seating the exhaust pipes were backwards but they weren't. I did notice a lot of oil in one of the chambers though.

Going to to go through basic maintenance checklist and learn about this bike and its parts before I start riding. Hope it's a good project. Thanks again for the help.
 
Hi Jason,

RPMs are just around 2000. If I keep it closer to 2500-3000 it does a little better. I turned the idle screw about one half turn which did increase the idle rpm from 800 to 1000-1200 but still struggling getting into first. I also noticed that riding in second and third it seems pretty sluggish.

Thanks for your help!
 
Hmm, should be idling pretty well about 1000-1200 rpms. Does it start easy on choke and idle OK? Runs better the higher the rpm's but then chokes when you slow down enough to downshift into 1st?
Usual suspects are 1.)carbs are still gummed up, esp. in pilot circuit passages, 2.)valve clearances out of spec.

If you can check compression it will tell you a lot about general health of valves/rings. Does it still have stock airbox/filter and stock exhaust? Sometimes a P.O. will change these and not change carb jetting-- causing issues. What do the spark plugs look like?, that can tell you a lot-- google 'plug chops'. Are both exhaust pipes equally warm at idle; how about after a ride (check carefully!)? Air/idle screws about 1 1/4 turns out from gently seated?

Action steps: 1: dip carbs yourself, verify all passages clear, new gaskets, o-rings, etc.; verify jet sizes are correct; return idle screws to stock positions and adjust as needed 2: Check and adjust valve clearances to spec. 3.) try again. At least you're working on it in winter when the urgency to be on the road isn't as strong!
 
Hi Jason,

Starts with choke after about 6 seconds on the electric starter, needs a little feathering to get it going once it turns over, then idles around 1200. There's a little fluttering in idle but not too bad, and then will rest around 1000. It does run better a little higher and then chokes up when I disengage clutch in 1st gear. If I increase throttle around 2000 RPM it will engage in first but I have to feather to keep it from stalling. Once I'm in second and third she seems okay but doesn't have as much power in 2 and 3 as she did when I brought her home from the shop.

Still stock exhaust and airbox with new filter. When I took the exhaust off yesterday I looked in the top of the head and saw one side had a white bell shaped thing (right side) and left side was oily, not pouring out but present. i recall both pipes being warm after a quick ride.

I will try to check compression and dip carbs myself. is this something you recommend a noob can try - I'd like to do it and learn about my bike but I'm hesitant to dive into that kind of project knowing as little as I do. I've read the manuals and carb rebuild tutorials on the site and I get the general idea but still feeling anxious about it. Is this one of those project I should just dive into and take slowly or tackle after I've done some other work first?

Spark plugs are brand new. I havent pulled them yet but will take a look today.

Thanks for your help, I really appreciate it.

Jamie
 
Update: I just took her out around the block and for the first time heard a whining sound in 3 at 3000 RPM, turned around and went back to garage. I touched the right exhaust pipe (the one that had been a little oily in the chamber where the exhaust goes into the header) and it was barely warm. I (stupidly) touched the other pipe and it was scorching hot. I also noticed significant drop in power riding home - maybe running on one cylinder?

any thought as to what this indicates? Thanks!
 
You can do it, diving in is the hardest part. Just do the reading, make a plan, and start turning wrenches and screws while paying attention, and taking pictures/making notes of assemblies. No one, including most mechanics, will have the motivation and attention to detail that you will need to make your bike reliable and safe.
 
Last edited:
CrazyCloud said:
You can do it, diving in is the hardest part. Just do the reading, make a plan, and start turning wrenches and screws while paying attention, and taking pictures/making notes of assemblies. No one, including most mechanics, will have the motivation and attention to detail that you will need to make your bike reliable and safe.
Click to expand...

Thanks Jason. I'm going to go for it. I'm thinking of doing the carbs and will certainly be paying more attention than anyone else. I was going to run compression test first and then tackle the carbs. Do you think that's a good first and second step or is there something else that I should do before diving into the carbs? also, I was going to use the manuals on basscliff and the carb rebuild tutorial in everyone's signature but that's for a gs1000 - are there better resources for tackling that project?

thanks again for your help. I really appreciate it!
 
Both carbs and valve clearances need to be done before you move on. You can do the valves while the carbs are soaking or while you're waiting on parts, etc. Might as well do them both while you've got it apart.

You'll likely need a new cylinder head cover gasket along with some shims when you do the valve clearances. I would wait on doing a compression test until you do the valves, as it will change your numbers.

I think you have CV carbs (the top of the carbs is held on by 4 screws right?) that link should be fine; you will just have 2 carbs instead of 4. Check out this video also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95nlrP-yn2I
also see http://members.dslextreme.com/users/bikecliff/images/carb_sync_notes.html
 
Last edited:
CrazyCloud said:
Both carbs and valve clearances need to be done before you move on. You can do the valves while the carbs are soaking or while you're waiting on parts, etc. Might as well do them both while you've got it apart.

You'll likely need a new cylinder head cover gasket along with some shims when you do the valve clearances. I would wait on doing a compression test until you do the valves, as it will change your numbers.

I think you have CV carbs (the top of the carbs is held on by 4 screws right?) that link should be fine; you will just have 2 carbs instead of 4. Check out this video also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95nlrP-yn2I
also see http://members.dslextreme.com/users/bikecliff/images/carb_sync_notes.html
Click to expand...


Thanks Jason, and John, I'm going to gear up to tackle the carbs and valves this month. I'm going to keep reading as much as I can before pulling the trigger but hope to start soon. I have basic tools but nothing fancy or specialized at this point. Any idea what it costs to make it through projects like these (understanding that the answer will probably depend upon conditions), but just wondering generally. Also what's the best place to find parts for a '79 Suzuki GS425?

I do have CV carbs so I will start with the links you refer to and the GS1000 guide and get going. Thanks again to you both for all your help, I really appreciate it.

Thanks
jamie
 
Tools/misc:
You will need metric sockets & a ratchet (or wrenches) of course & a set of good screwdrivers/bits (JIS is nice, but not a must). Test carefully to see which of the bits fits the fastener best each time.
You can do valves the using big zip ties as an improvised tool instead of the specialty tool that costs $15-20, see http://members.dslextreme.com/users/bikecliff/images/valve_tool_zip_tie.pdf
Small tub of good quality grease on hand for packing bearings, holding things in place, coating gaskets, etc.
A hand impact tool comes in really handy, almost a must have. Something along these lines http://www.amazon.com/Lisle-29200-H..._UL160_SR160,160_&refRID=04RMJ1FYD5XEA6CVA1HC
It is really, really nice to have a torque wrench, but not a downright necessity. I have this one and like it a lot http://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-24330-...&qid=1453097752&sr=1-2&keywords=torque+wrench.

Parts:
Shop around for parts. I like Parts Outlaw a lot for things that I want new/OEM. Prices usually very competitive and use the code 'BANG' at checkout and shipping is (normally) greatly reduced. There are some good comparison threads for the different vendors. Brake parts and all cables I would go with OEM.
E-bay--Some parts are not available new any longer from Suzuki, folks with spare OEM stuff often sell it cheaper on ebay. Also, in many instances a used part is perfectly functional and will save significant $$. Use the 'also fits' function of the online parts fiche you like to find out what other models and years used the part you are looking for to broaden your search on e-bay.

For your current job (carbs and valves) you can likely get shims dirt cheap using the 'shim club' here http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?122394-GS-Valve-Shim-Club
The rest you will have to shop around,price it out, add it up. To get you started:
head cover gasket ~$15-20?
Carb o-rings + intake boot o-rings from cycleorings.com highly recommended ~$25?
Carb gaskets?? guesstimate under $20 (I know nothing about cv's)
Berrymans carb dip ~$20
So ballpark guess is under $100 in parts + whatever you need for tools.
 
the oily valve, the bell shaped thingy, is likely from a dried out valve guide seal. nothing to really worry about for the time being until you get this thing dialed in. I'm on the main land in mt Vernon if you're ever in the area. also pro-tip, if you ever need to lay the bike up for an extended amount of time, add fuel stabilizer. the alchohol in modern fuels absorbs the moisture from the air in our neck of the woods and turns into gel that plugs everything that you're cleaning now, or will be cleaning. and listen to what these guys have to say, get the stuff done now so you don't have to get antsy when our short season pops up. for removing what looks like a Philips screw, which is really a JIS screw, I've found the Philips #2 bits in the multi-bit driver kits work really well. if you start stripping out the head of the screw, stop! grab a 1/4" drive ratchet and more than likely the 1/4" socket, or which ever the bit fits snuggly in, and put the bit in and give the screw just a hair of a turn tighter, and I mean just a hair, and then see if it will start backing out while applying plenty of pressure. I've gotten a lot of the JIS screws off my gs650g out that way.
 
Don't worry about checking the compression. It means nothing until you have the valve clearances adjusted, and it always goes up in the first thousand or so miles of riding.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top