Possible Substitute Igniter?

[koolaid_kid]

PM me, I might be able to help with some repair info.

I looked on your site this morning for a possible "Ignitor Repair" write up, but did not see one.

[Matchless]

I looked on your site this morning for a possible "Ignitor Repair" write up, but did not see one.

I only have the GS1000G up there : http://www.mediafire.com/?mmmoluy1yev

I may have a schematic for the GS450 (32900-47020), but need to redraw it. I also have a schematic for building a replacement type for the twins. Non are my own work and thus not proven or tested, but may help with fault finding and repairing. I will try and do the schematic asap, just need some time to draw it up properly. If the twins still have electromechanical advance it may even be possible to adapt the Chevy HEI moodules to do the work. although I have not done it myself, only for testing the GS1000G again.

[blowerbike]

So if I installed a "big" signal generator, which one would I need to look for ?

a large plate will not fit your bike...there's a huge difference between the large and small plates.
and to answer a question posted to me earlier...
the only difference i assume is in how these parts are wired.
i tried different model's boxes that directly plugged in and even looked identical except for the part numbers and the bike still had no spark.
the boxes i tried was known good boxes for 700/750/1150 models.
could these boxes have there wiring changed around to work on the 83-86 550???...maybe.
i never went that far.

[User]

I have found a box for a 1993 Honda Nighthawk 550. From what I can tell, the bike has the same type of ignition system. Air cooled, 4 cylinder, 57x cc....closest match I could find to the 1985 GS 550. Any reason I couldn't figure out the wire routing/positioning. Place the wires in the corresponding positions and hope for a spark? Any bets on the outcome? I don't see a reason that the two boxes wouldn't be very similar in production. I have been trying to find a wiring diagram for the 1983 Honda 550, but haven't had any luck. I also haven't been able to get the honda igniter out of the box like I did the one for my bike.

I tested the new box in the same "table" form that the manual suggests for the stock box. I made a table just like to one that was built in my service manual and compared. The wire configuration is obviously different, but I can't follow the patterns close enough to figure it out. I also think that where the Suzuki box has one ground wire on the plug that goes to the signal generator, the Honda box has two. I don't see another ground being a problem though. Other than that, I don't see how different they could be. However, I don't know anything about process that is going on inside that damn box either......

Advice?

[koolaid_kid]

Thanks, Matchless. I missed it the first time through. It just seemed like something you would have on your site.

[blowerbike]

I have found a box for a 1993 Honda Nighthawk 550. From what I can tell, the bike has the same type of ignition system. Air cooled, 4 cylinder, 57x cc....closest match I could find to the 1985 GS 550. Any reason I couldn't figure out the wire routing/positioning. Place the wires in the corresponding positions and hope for a spark? Any bets on the outcome? I don't see a reason that the two boxes wouldn't be very similar in production. I have been trying to find a wiring diagram for the 1983 Honda 550, but haven't had any luck. I also haven't been able to get the honda igniter out of the box like I did the one for my bike.

I tested the new box in the same "table" form that the manual suggests for the stock box. I made a table just like to one that was built in my service manual and compared. The wire configuration is obviously different, but I can't follow the patterns close enough to figure it out. I also think that where the Suzuki box has one ground wire on the plug that goes to the signal generator, the Honda box has two. I don't see another ground being a problem though. Other than that, I don't see how different they could be. However, I don't know anything about process that is going on inside that damn box either......

Advice?

may the force be with you as you sail through these unchartered waters

[User]

may the force be with you as you sail through these unchartered waters

Surely someone else has tried this? Or something similar? I will let you guys know what happens if anything at all. I have to try something while I wait for something else to happen, or I can stumble on a replacement that doesn't cost hundreds of dollars. This bike was just a winter project to tinker, not an investment. I have a guy looking at the original box from the scoot right now, I will see if he can fix it. In the meantime, I will be tinkering with this honda box....maybe. I need a wiring diagram from a 1983 550 Nighthawk.....I think that was the only year they made the 550, other than the CB 550's, but those are different I think. Anyone have one that could answer some wire color/placement questions for me?

Regards,

User

[koolaid_kid]

All we ask is that you videotape it and post it on you-tube when it explodes.

[User]

All we ask is that you videotape it and post it on you-tube when it explodes.

Not too handy with videos, but I will take a few still shots if possible. Hard to do with a beer in one hand a tool in the other.

[tom203]

Well, at the very least I'd try to determine the coil amp draw on the Honda, just to make sure you don't get in the habit of smoking ignitor boxes. Maybe, go on honda forum and ask nicely!

[koolaid_kid]

Not too handy with videos, but I will take a few still shots if possible. Hard to do with a beer in one hand a tool in the other.

LOL! That is where Bubba comes in handy. "Hold my beer Bubba, and watch this."

[User]

Well, at the very least I'd try to determine the coil amp draw on the Honda, just to make sure you don't get in the habit of smoking ignitor boxes. Maybe, go on honda forum and ask nicely!

Anyone elaborate on this point a little? I'm not sure how to go about finding out this information, or what it means. I'm less than educated in the area of electricity.

[koolaid_kid]

The ignitor is used to trigger the coils. There will be some small current draw to activate this trigger. There is also an impedance in the circuit which plays a part, since I = V/R (current = voltage divided by impedance). Voltage is constant at 12V, so if the impedance of the circuit is smaller on the Honda circuit the current draw will increase, which will tax the ignitor circuitry.

Just to clarify the gist of these 3 pages of postings, here is what you have/need:
You have an ignition system with an electronic advance. This electronic advance is built into the ignitor. This curve will vary model to model. For example, if you use an ignitor from another model with an electronic advance (I won't even go into using one from another brand) then the advance curve will be different. I put an 85 GPz ignitor on my 83 GPz because the advance curve offers better performance overalll.
What you need is an ignitor from another Suzuki that also had an electronic advance. I would strongly suggest another mid-sized GS, as this would increase the likelihood that the curve would be "close enough".
Have you tried fleabay?

[User]

Have you tried fleabay?

I have an a**load of saved searches looking and emailing me daily if anything that matches shows up. Fleabay is exhausted at the moment. There is one on there that matches the one for my bike, but would cost me more than I have in the rest of the bike. Not willing to do that.

Something will open up, I'm sure of it.

[cowboyup3371]

Just for my own curiosity, how much would that one cost? Unfortunately, these old bikes will not have parts that can be bought cheap if you are trying to get it running. I'm not saying to go out and spend $500 but $50 or $100 is not that bad considering some parts are not going to be found.

When I say that please don't think I have money to blow. Trust me, I'm about as broke as the next guy and I have a laundry list of things I need to get to ensure my bike stays roadworthy. Unfortunately though, I understand some of them are expensive and I'll pay the price when the money frees up (hopefully after my court case I'm starting).