GS450L wiring issues

[pete]

Just caught up with this one... been there done that!

Firstly, make sure the ground for your ignitor is 100% good.

Measure the impedance (resistance on the multimeter) of each signal generator coil, they should be 60 - 80ohms each.

As the guys say you must have voltage on the orange/white wire of both coils *all the time* when the ignition and kill switch are on.

There are tests in the manuals for all of the above and also for the ignitor.

Given how difficult it is to find a good working ignitor for these, do the tests first, and if it proves the ignitor is faulty, then go the Dynatek DS3-3C route.

This will bolt straight in but when you buy it, ask for the spacer as well otherwise you will have the rotor flapping about on the bolt due to it being designed for the earlier points setups. They should know what you're talking about, tell them Pete from the GS Resources told you to get the spacer

You will need to run an oil pressure sensor wire in addition to this as it sits under the timing cover.

Also, make sure you run the Dynatek coils, the stock ones are a no go with it.

I found the harness on the Dynatek about 2 inches shorter than I'd like so I made a mini harness to join the coils, and the coils are also larger than stock so some creative routing is needed there.

Once she's up and running, do the charging system checks first thing to ensure you're not just going to overcharge and fail it all again...

[phillipjohnw]

Ok, so I got out the old electrometer and tested the coils. The battery read just under 11 volts while cranking. The coils again had proper resistance. Pete where would I measure the signal generator resistance? I looked in my clymer manual but can't find where to measure it at. Thanks for all the help guys.

ps. Pete how much would the entire dyna system cost?

[pete]

To test the signal generator coils, you need to disconnect the four pin plug from the rest of the harness. The harness for the signal generator comes from the timing cover on the right.

You'll want page 178 in the Clymer for the testing procedures for this and the ignitor.

With the signal generator test, the Clymer diagram is a bit misleading. Don't test between Green and ground and Blue and ground, instead you'll see there's (I think from memory) a black wire common to both coils on the signal generator plate. Test between Green and Black then Blue and Black.

The fourth wire under there (Green with yellow tracer) is for the oil pressure sensor switch. This is the extra wire you'll need to run if you do end up going the Dynatek route.

As for the Dynatek, you guys get 'em cheap... $309.99 on their website, and you'll need some plug wires as well.

[phillipjohnw]

Well that sucks, I had typed up a long thing about what happened, but the computer decided not to post it. Here's the quick run down.

I did the S/G tests, both how the book said and how Pete said. Both showed an open or break somewhere between the generator and the ignitor unit. Does anyone know if there are any fuses possibly hidden in the wiring between the two? Or is it the signal genny that's toast?

As for the dyna system, I think thats out of the budget. That's over half of what I paid for the bike. Is there anything that I can adapt from another bike to make this heap run? If not I think this bike may be destined for the classified parts listings.

[koolaid_kid]

There are no fuses.
The signal generator seldom goes out.
There is a connector between your signal generator and your igniter. I would trace the wire, paying special attention to the connector.

[pete]

If it's only your signal generator, you could have just dodged a bullet... I've seen them on eBay quite cheaply.

So if you measure directly on the signal generator coils do they test ok? And when you test across the plug connections they're not ok?

Like George said, no fuses, and definitely check out the connector.

I also should've mentioned all the ignitor options that I'm aware of:

1. Brand new ignitor from Suzuki. Twice the price of the Dynatek but still available.
2. Second hand ignitor from eBay or a wrecker. Same age, no guarantees it won't fail again.
3. Dynatek DS3-3C.
4. A later '83 and onwards GS450 or GS500 ignition setup including signal generator and ignitor. I have seen reports of this working but never seen it proven yet. '83 and later have electronic advance.
5. Retrofit a 400/425 points setup. Seen it done and it works, but it's ugly.

[phillipjohnw]

Pete you seem to be the man with the plan. What do you suggest to fix my problems? I really can't afford the dyna system however nice it may be. I do like the idea of fitting an 83+ ignition rather than retrofitting old technology. On the other hand from what I've read once you get the old points set up they are pretty easy to maintain. As for ease and cost which do you feel would be best?

I don't know if it mattered or not, but when I measured the resistance of the S/G I did it through the plug that goes to the igniter. The actual leads going to the S/G were covered with that rubber epoxy that Suzuki used.

On a side note, do you guys know any GS wrenchers in the Charleston, SC area? There doesn't even seem to be good junkyards here.

[barnbiketom]

the test is check ohms between each wire to ground. unplugged from the ignitor that is. you are to be checking the circuits to the signal generator on each wire.. unhook the blue and green from the ignitor. using the ohm meter check each wire to ground. each wire to a ground should be 60 to 80 ohms. if you get a lot higher than that i'd look at all the connectors leading to the ignitor if there are any. one may be corroded/unhooked. lets hope it's an open wire!!!

even if it's the s/g they are abundunt and cheep on EBAY. Personally, if it were the s/g i'd get another one. but if it's the ignitor which it sounds like it is not..

I'd go with points hahahahahah \\but i'm old school

[phillipjohnw]

Ok, I did some lurking on the ebay. There was only one signal generator for a 450 and it was $125. There was bunch of cheaper ones for larger GS's, would a larger GS fit my 450?

[barnbiketom]

not sure but you can try babbits or Boulevard suzuki online to compare part #s.


i don't even know for SURE if you can do the point conversion. as no one has confirmed that it is an easy bolt - in..

perhaps someone will chime in with answers to these questions.

all I know is, my GS400 has points and I'm not scared to ride it ANYWHERE but my GS450 has the electronic and with everyone saying they are hard to find and expensive, it really makes me wonder. I already dodged a bullet when my rectifier regulator was charging 20 volts , boiled out the water in the battery, and blew the hi beam outa my headlight. all in a couple weeks things can go BOOM it might as easily blew my ignition unit you know?

[pete]

The points can definitely be retrofitted... no idea where the thread is here but there was a guy who had it done from a 400 or 425. You'll need to get... advance plate, points plate, points cam and bolt. You'll also need the right coils with condensors. Oh, and you'll still need to run the extra oil pressure sensor switch wire as the 400/425's don't have it under the timing cover.

Tom's right, points will definitely be more resilient to things like overcharging, but they do take some maintenance and the bike will run pretty crappy if you don't get the points adjusted right or if a condensor fails.

As for the overcharging, that's why I spent the $10 or whatever it was for the single LED charging indicator from the UK, tells me exactly what's going on and told me immediately when my cheap junk Taiwanese R/R gave up the ghost. Didn't want the Dynatek going bye bye due to a dodgy charging circuit! Or my Acewell gauge for that matter...

I ain't afraid to ride my 450 anywhere now

So, as for ease and cost of the different setups... my guess is there's going to be equal difficulty retrofitting the points as there will be fitting a newer 450 or 500 setup, so cost is probably going to be the defining factor there.

The later ignition components will still be available from Suzuki as they used them right up to the later 500's I believe, so that may bring the price down somewhat. As for points, I've never looked so don't know what sort of $$ you'd be up for there...

And in case you're wondering... I got my engine rebuild done and half my bike rebuilt before discovering my ignitor was toast after sitting around for quite a few years... this is why I did a lot of research into this stuff and why I ended up with the Dynatek

Dynatek customer service is awesome by the way... they helped me out immensely via email when I was trying to determine compatibility, and they even went as far as searching and finding my thread on here after just one short email conversation... plug over now

[phillipjohnw]

I don't know what to do. You have all been more than helpful and for that I thank you, I just can't see myself spending a couple hundred dollars trying to fit or retrofit something that may or may not work. even though its expensive the dyna system may be the way to go. I just hate shoveling out so much money for a 30 year old motorcycle. I'm also leaning towards the idea of turning it into someone else's problem.

[barnbiketom]

well by your own test it is the signal generator or wiring. why not just get a replacement? keep looking on ebay. search for one for gs425 and 450. thats what i'd do first!!

[barnbiketom]

i turned this one up in less than a minute!! 49 bucks

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Suzuki-GS450-GS-450-2412-Ignition-Pickup-Pulser-Pulsing-Coils-/360497352667?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53ef510fdb&vxp=mtr

also search GS450 ignition etc

[phillipjohnw]

Thanks for the find Tom. I really don't know how I missed that. I bid on it and hopefully it ends my worries.