confused on my ignition relay for headlight shut off

[Guest]

I hooked up a relay to have the headlight turn off while starting. Here what I did first of all I used a four post relay hooked up 30 to straight battery power through a fuse, 87 is hooked to headlight power going to the headlight switch. 85 is hooked to a negative or ground wire and 86 is hooked to the ss2 or starter selinoid post side of the starter. So when I turn the key on the headlight doesn't come on, hit the start button it comes on just opposite to what I want it to do. Where did I go wrong wiring gurus?

[Steve]

It would be better if you had a FIVE-terminal relay, but the fifth terminal has to be 87a.

If you don't have one available, it's still possible to use the one you have. Move the wire you now have connected to a ground to a switched wire (like the headlight fuse) and leave the other one on the starter terminal on the solenoid.

If you can find a five-pin relay, connect it just as you have it now, but have your output to your headlight connected to 87a, instead of 87.

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[Redman]

........ Where did I go wrong wiring gurus?

You got a relay that can turn ON something when something else is ON.
But, you want to turn OFF something when something else is on...right?

A relay that turns off something is a relay that has the 87A, like Steve is saying.
So where you went wrong (as you asked) is the type of relay you got. You have it connected correctly, except use the 87A rather than 87.

Typically to get a relay with the 87A (normally closed) will be the 5 pin relay (Single Pole double throw. What you have is single pole single throw normally open).

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[Rockgs1000]

The operation of a relay has me confused I have the
on study the wiring diagram to figure it out. When I get a 5 pin relay what goes on the 87 pin.

[Steve]

When I get a 5 pin relay what goes on the 87 pin.

NOTHING.


A relay is really quite simple. It's just a remotely-controlled switch. When you turn one switch on, it activates the relay.

In this case, you don't want the relay to turn anything ON, you want it to turn something OFF. In the 5-pin relay, there is usually a connection from pin 30 to 87a. It is making connection right NOW, with the relay still sitting on the store shelf. When you apply power across 85 and 86 (either direction), you will activate the switch, which will then move the connection to 30 and 87. Since there will be nothing connected to 87, and there is no longer any power coming from 30 to 87a, the light that is connected to 87a goes OFF.

Here is a diagram that I drew up a while ago, maybe the visual will help.



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[Steve]

Also note, when interrupting the headlamp circuit, I prefer to use the ground wire, easier to work with, plus this will prevent either the high or low beam to be on when starting. ... No offense to previous replies, not implying anything is incorrect, I just have a different way of doing this that I find to be simpler, and a little more easier to comprehend for those who truly get lost easy around the wiring of these bikes.

Your way will work just fine, but if you interrupt the power line between the fuse and the HIGH/LOW beam selector switch, it will also prevent either the high or low beam to be on when starting.

I know that, electrically, it's the same concept: break the circuit, current stops flowing, but many are already intimidated by playing with the electrics on the power side. Also mentioning the possibility of interrupting the ground side could be even more comfuzzling.

When I have done this, I usually pull the orange/red wire out of the 4-pin connector near the fuse panel. This can put the relay near the source and keep all the wiring at a minimum.

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[Steve]

Steve, correct me if I'm wrong, I believe this is what you were talking about, if not, just another way to skin a ......

That is almost identical to what I have done.

That block that is just under the fuse box is the "4-pin connector" on my bikes. (Note that the G models that I have might be different than other bikes.) Instead of cutting the wire after the connector, I actually removed the pins from the connector and ran the wires to the relay, instead.

The other difference between your drawing and what I did is the feed for pin 85 on the relay. Instead of tapping into the orange/white wire, I simply added a wire with a ring terminal to the starter post on the solenoid. That would be the LEFT solid black dot on your diagram. You can see my additional wire in the picture below.

It's not much of a difference that way. The only operational difference that I can see is that if you forget to pull your clutch lever and hit the starter, it will still kill the headlight. The way I wired it, the headlight will only be turned off while the starter is actually being activated. A petty difference, indeed.

Just took another look at your diagram before posting this. That is very accurate for an early GS that has a functioning headlight switch. On later models that can not turn off the light, there will be another connector near the top of your diagram, where you have the O/R label. At that connector will be a yellow/white wire that will go to the Y/W terminal on the beam selector switch just to the left of your headlamp ON/OFF switch. Again, just a small difference, but for someone that is looking for that headlamp ON/OFF switch on a later bike, it could be rather important.

This is how it can fit under the side cover on my wife's 850GL. There are TWO relays, one is for the headlamp cut-off, the other one prrovides switched power to the accessories.


This mess of wiring will be cleaned up a bit when I install the Eastern Beaver fuse box before next riding season.

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[sedelen]

It might help us to know what model and year your bike is. I looked up your old posts and saw it a GS1000L, as for the year, I guess it's a pre '80, as I was looking at pic's of your left hand controls.

Since I'm assuming it's a pre '80, and it has the same switching unit as my '79 GS1000E, there's a simple mod you can do without modifying the stock electronics. There's a head light switch that doesn't move. It's because the light switch knob was modified to keep it in the on position. If you remove the knob you will see a physical stop on the knob that keeps it in place. If you trim off that plastic the switch willl operate the lights on and off. I did this with my first '78 GS1000E and with my '79 GS1000E. I can turn off my lights and start the bike and then when I want to turn them on just flip on the switch.

[ShaggyRider]

Just reviving an old thread. Very helpful modification, should have done this much sooner. Never did mak much sense to me why the headlight would stay on while starting. I swear though when it comes electrical these bikes need all the help they can get. Lol

[posplayr]

Just reviving an old thread. Very helpful modification, should have done this much sooner. Never did mak much sense to me why the headlight would stay on while starting. I swear though when it comes electrical these bikes need all the help they can get. Lol

Here is yet another quite similar as it only used a single relay, but it provides two functions (normally requiring two relays) to 1.) provide direct power to the Headlamp Switch on O/R and 12.) perform the cutout.

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?218985-Simple-headlamp-relay-with-start-cutout&highlight=

What Steve's schematic fails to show, but what is shown in the Old_Skool's schematic is that power must still be distributed from battery, to ignition switch through the fuse box and then finally from the O/R there the Relay is powered.

You get more voltage to the headlamp if the relay is powered direct from the "T"(through an inline fuse). The described modification does that as well as cutout