Sh775 installed not charging

[Wheelbreak]

So my bike stopped charging about a month ago. I thought it was just the battery, but it turns out it was only getting around 13v at 2k-3k rpms. One of the stator wires to the rr was fried so I thought it might be the rr. I bought the sh775 and installed by soldering extensions to the stator wires and soldering female connectors on them to plug into the rr

-3 wires from stator to the rr,

-positive to the same red that goes into the harness which is getting continuity to the positive terminal on the battery.

-The old rr was just grounded to the frame. I connected the new rr ground to a black with white ground going into the harness which has continuity to the neg terminal of the battery.

I have no charging at all now. Bike runs great just no charging. I checked AC voltage on the stator. I have no idea what rpms because I no longer have a tach, but two connections seemed to go to 50v when revved but one only stayed at 15v. Bad stator I know, but shouldn't it charge a little? Also I went directly to the rr with all of the stator wires because the loop that the green and white wire does that then turns into the red and white looked redundant on the wiring diagram (it didn't actually connect to anything.) I can't remember but I think that was the burnt wire as well.

I just want to know if 2 of the 3 connection types of the stator test are working shouldn't I be getting some charging to the battery? I would like to get whatever else is wrong fixed while I wait for a new stator. Also, recommendations on stators? I see a lot of suggestions on rr's thats why I got the sh775, but not much on stators. I was thinking of just going through z1 unless there are cheaper quality stators out there.

 

[Wheelbreak]

just found this.

http://www.amazon.com/Caltric-CRANK...39342176&sr=1-1&keywords=gs1100+stator+gasket

anyone used one of these?

 

[posplayr]

So my bike stopped charging about a month ago. I thought it was just the battery, but it turns out it was only getting around 13v at 2k-3k rpms. One of the stator wires to the rr was fried so I thought it might be the rr. I bought the sh775 and installed by soldering extensions to the stator wires and soldering female connectors on them to plug into the rr

-3 wires from stator to the rr,

-positive to the same red that goes into the harness which is getting continuity to the positive terminal on the battery.

-The old rr was just grounded to the frame. I connected the new rr ground to a black with white ground going into the harness which has continuity to the neg terminal of the battery.

I have no charging at all now. Bike runs great just no charging. I checked AC voltage on the stator. I have no idea what rpms because I no longer have a tach, but two connections seemed to go to 50v when revved but one only stayed at 15v. Bad stator I know, but shouldn't it charge a little? Also I went directly to the rr with all of the stator wires because the loop that the green and white wire does that then turns into the red and white looked redundant on the wiring diagram (it didn't actually connect to anything.) I can't remember but I think that was the burnt wire as well.

I just want to know if 2 of the 3 connection types of the stator test are working shouldn't I be getting some charging to the battery? I would like to get whatever else is wrong fixed while I wait for a new stator. Also, recommendations on stators? I see a lot of suggestions on rr's thats why I got the sh775, but not much on stators. I was thinking of just going through z1 unless there are cheaper quality stators out there.

You seem to know just enough to be dangerous. There is a wiring diagram in GS Charging Heath, it would probably help and can't be any worse than what you have described that you have done.

 

[Guest]

just found this.

http://www.amazon.com/Caltric-CRANK...39342176&sr=1-1&keywords=gs1100+stator+gasket

anyone used one of these?

Yes, my son put one is his bike along with a honda r/r he bought from a member here called Duneage. Everything working just fine.

Like Posplayr said, and he is the chief resident in charge of electrical, "You seem to know just enough to be dangerous" Follow the steps and you'll be back up and charging very soon

 

[Guest]

Check stator
Create a solid ground on frame and battery

 

[Wheelbreak]

So tomorrow I'll switch the ground to the frame or battery, and order a new stator. I'll also check for voltage drops.

I have it wired up the way the GS charging health diagram shows. That is actually what I based it off when I wired it in the first place. I didn't read the text that said to just ground to the mounting bolt, frame or battery. I just went off the diagram. I saw it in another thread about installing the sh775.

I'm not too hot with electrical theory, but can follow a schematic pretty well. I used to build guitar petals and synths and stuff for fun.

No one ever answered if a failing stator would still produce at least a little power to charging system. I guess it would depend how far gone it was.

 

[Guest]

Check the AC output of the stator before ordering a new one.

 

[posplayr]

So tomorrow I'll switch the ground to the frame or battery, and order a new stator. I'll also check for voltage drops.

I have it wired up the way the GS charging health diagram shows. That is actually what I based it off when I wired it in the first place. I didn't read the text that said to just ground to the mounting bolt, frame or battery. I just went off the diagram. I saw it in another thread about installing the sh775.

I'm not too hot with electrical theory, but can follow a schematic pretty well. I used to build guitar petals and synths and stuff for fun.

No one ever answered if a failing stator would still produce at least a little power to charging system. I guess it would depend how far gone it was.

I'm sorry if I misinterpreted your statements, it appeared that the B/W was the only connection you had made to the R/R(-).

If you followed the diagram and have clean connections you are much better off.

I would start with the Quick test before jumping into the stator tests(all of the measurements are important). Since you do not have a tach, and the leg to leg VAC out is proportional to RPM you ca n see how you might have a problem making comparative measurements. All is not lost, teh best test is Leg to Ground tests also described in the stator pages and takes at some high RPM and should show ZERO VAC.

You are correct that depending on the damage to the stator it may still be enough to charge. Remember the older GS completely removed a leg when the headlight was off.

I dont know what you did but it sounds like all of your connections that you previously had were replaced with the SH-775 install and they are all black? Without pictures it is hard to assess, but something is wrong. Poor crimps, poor connections, MOSFET R/R not a SH-775 I don't know.

 

[Weapon]

in his first post he states two legs are at 50v and one is at 15v. I haven't read through the troubleshoot lately but doesn't that indicate one leg of the stator is done? that coupled with the indication of the headlight bypass wire being all melty and is probably what pooched the stator in the first place?

 

[posplayr]

in his first post he states two legs are at 50v and one is at 15v. I haven't read through the troubleshoot lately but doesn't that indicate one leg of the stator is done? that coupled with the indication of the headlight bypass wire being all melty and is probably what pooched the stator in the first place?

OP said he knew the stator was bad not just how bad. So is it done? We don't know without a tachometer to check the AC voltage if the stator can sustain a charging voltage. Further, it appeared as if OP did not have the R/R very well grounded but now claims to have followed the SPG grounding recommendations. The "proof will be in the pudding" when he reports Phase A test results. Because the OP did not provide a full set of measurements for the Quick tests for all we know his battery could just be dead loading down his R/R voltage not allowing the remaining two legs to work effectively.


As usual it takes several tries to get a complete answer to make an assessment of what is going on.

 

[Wheelbreak]

I just bought a new battery because I wanted to be sure that wasn't the problem. The battery is good. It's just not charging. The ac test I did on the stator indicated a rise on 2 of the 3 combinations of the wires coming out of the stator both to around 50v when I increased the throttle with one holding steady at 15v. I used this test because it is what is suggested in the clymer manual. I thought the rr was well grounded. The ground wire I connected it to showed good continuity to the negative terminal on the battery. I just am going to connect it either straight to the battery or to the frame for extra insurance. I figure if 1 of the 3 parts of the stator are not working I will need one anyway so I ordered one. I am just worried something else isn't right. Do I need to reconnect the green and white to the loop that turns it into red and white? On my bike the wiring diagram has it literally connected to nothing. I felt like this was just more wiring that could be bad so skipped it. I have a gs1100ex (1981) BTW. I'll take pics tomorrow if you think it will help, but feel I have described exactly what I have done on this thread.



One more thing I should probably add is it has always since I bought it charged slightly on the low side (around 13.7v @2000rpm), but was sufficient to make batteries last for over a year with out taking the battery off to charge it. I ride all year long at least 4-5 days a week. I recently removed the stock instrument panel and that's when the problem started getting worse. I replaced the stock panel with a koso but since I killed the battery I have removed the koso trying to isolate the problem. Is there something in the instrument panel that could be killing the charging system? The charging system is now wired completely isolated from the panel so I feel like it shouldn't, but you never know. I went through other peoples instrument panel to koso replacement threads on the site and no one else seems to have this problem.

 

[posplayr]

I just erased s post because I just do not know how to respond to this thread. You know the stator is bad but you are trying to determine how bad but not following the specific directions? Good luck.

 

[tom203]

"No one ever answered if a failing stator would still produce at least a little power to charging system. I guess it would depend how far gone it was."

My failing stator produced just enough to keep bike going.I ran it this way for about 30 hours with msny restarts. Upon removal one stator lead had cooked and was shorting out on its frame.
Nothing in your koso gizmo would interfere with charging provided you wire all 3 stator leads direct to r//r and follow the gs health grounding guidelines.
When you get your new ststor, make sure you do a QuickTest to confirm all is well.

 

[posplayr]

"No one ever answered if a failing stator would still produce at least a little power to charging system. I guess it would depend how far gone it was."

My failing stator produced just enough to keep bike going.I ran it this way for about 30 hours with msny restarts. Upon removal one stator lead had cooked and was shorting out on its frame.
Nothing in your koso gizmo would interfere with charging provided you wire all 3 stator leads direct to r//r and follow the gs health grounding guidelines.
When you get your new ststor, make sure you do a QuickTest to confirm all is well.

I believe the loss have a high current draw that tends to drain batteries

 

[Weapon]

no do not reconnect the green white again. it just goes up to the headlight and comes back down again going through plugs and gaining resistance along the way. at the headlight there is a small wire loop where it come out on the plug and goes straight back in. iirc it is a leftover from when there was a switch to turn off your headlight. I don't have any electronics background to back this up but I have a feeling based on what I have read that this wire and the resistance it causes, will take out your stator slowly.
also based on what you have said in all your posts so far, I would be replacing the stator without hesitation.
I would be inclined to go over the bikes connectors with some non explosive contact cleaner. unplug, spray, re-grease (dielectric grease that is), plug back in. resistance in these plugs makes wires hot and increases resistance even further, causing real problems.
once again no electronics background. POSPLAYER is your man for that, this advice is just what I have learned dealing with my own charging issues last year and reading threads on this site.

 

[posplayr]

no do not reconnect the green white again. it just goes up to the headlight and comes back down again going through plugs and gaining resistance along the way. at the headlight there is a small wire loop where it come out on the plug and goes straight back in. iirc it is a leftover from when there was a switch to turn off your headlight. I don't have any electronics background to back this up but I have a feeling based on what I have read that this wire and the resistance it causes, will take out your stator slowly.
also based on what you have said in all your posts so far, I would be replacing the stator without hesitation.
I would be inclined to go over the bikes connectors with some non explosive contact cleaner. unplug, spray, re-grease (dielectric grease that is), plug back in. resistance in these plugs makes wires hot and increases resistance even further, causing real problems.
once again no electronics background. POSPLAYER is your man for that, this advice is just what I have learned dealing with my own charging issues last year and reading threads on this site.

I don't think resistance on the AC side will take out the stator, it simply is a place for heat to get generated and melt wires. Of course the stator resistance is on the order of 1 ohm and so if you have say 1 ohm resistance in connections then the output voltage will be only 1/2. Note this is not something you measure when you do open circuit tests. The 80VAC at 5000 RPM is not affected by nor can it detect high resistance in the stator leads. It will reduce your charging ability. If you clean the contacts to get back to say only 0.1 ohms then you would only be losing less power heating your wiring.

There are bigger problems with SHUNT R/R and high resistance on the primary DC wires. As you probably remember, the current running between the R/R and the battery causes voltage drops if there is any resistance at all. (that is what the Phase A tests are measuring). Basically the battery voltage is always less than the R/R output reference that is 14.25-14.5V. The difference between battery and R/R is a function of how much resistance. Remember when teh R/R's reach their setpoint they start to regulate. The SHUNT SHORTS and the SERIES OPENS. So when there is high resistance with a SHUNT it tends to start SHORTING immediately as it thinks that there is a high voltage at teh battery that needs to be regulated. This can leave the SHUNT on all the time which will heat up both R/R and the stator and drain the battery. With a SERIES R/R the R/R will just open but it will still drain the battery.

Regardless of the theory, all connections between the battery and R/R need to be cleaned. And the stator should be connected direct to the R/R. If a connector is used, tin all of the contact/crimps to make sure that corrosion does not get into the crimps and use some anti corrosion product to make sure contacts stay in good shape. I recommend a chemical clean with Naval jelly(or similar) and the treatment with DeOxit. You can also use dielectric grease instead of DeOxit.

The SPG is the most direct way of guaranteeing that all of the return currents get to the R/R while minimizing the current flow between the battery(-) and the R/R(-).It should be obvious that for a given resistance in the connections, the less current on this wire the the less voltage drop and the closer the battery voltage will track the R/R output setpoint. That is the reason for different wires going to the SPG.

For example if you have a Dyna-S, the coil return currents now ground out through the Dyn-S to the engine block. From the engine block the currents most likely path is to go from the battery grounding strap to the battery(-) and then travel back to the R/R(-). That means that teh current on this battery ground wire is about twice what it would be if the Dyna-S was not grounding through the engine. If fact from a grounding perspective, it would be best to run a ground from the Dyna-S all the way back to the SPG. Of course nobody does this. So as a compromise, I suggest the frame ground so in the event that the frame and battery strap ground get dirty, you can hope to pick up Dyna-S ground through the frame and pull those currents away from the Battery(-) post.

 

[Matchless]

Many stators that give an acceptable AC output when floating (unplugged from the R/R). This can lead you to assume erroneously that the stator is working correctly!
But you should also test for AC between any stator lead and ground. If any AC is measured to ground then the stator windings are shorted to ground! If you could see the exact schematic (internals) of your regulator coupled to a grounded stator, it will show how severely the circuit is changed.
I assume you did the static resistance test between any AC wire from the stator and to ground which should show no continuity?

 

[posplayr]

Many stators that give an acceptable AC output when floating (unplugged from the R/R). This can lead you to assume erroneously that the stator is working correctly!
But you should also test for AC between any stator lead and ground. If any AC is measured to ground then the stator windings are shorted to ground! If you could see the exact schematic (internals) of your regulator coupled to a grounded stator, it will show how severely the circuit is changed.
I assume you did the static resistance test between any AC wire from the stator and to ground which should show no continuity?

Hi Andre,
As per the facts of your description, I was promoted to post this thread.

http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...ECOND-LAW-of-Stator-testing&highlight=phase+B

FIRST LAW OF STATOR TESTS:
ANY POSITIVE RESULT of a STATOR TEST HAS AN AMBIGUITY PROPORTIONAL TO THE UNTESTED OPERATIONAL STRESS.

SECOND LAW OF STATOR TESTS:
ANY NEGATIVE RESULT of a STATOR TEST IS A NECESSARY AND SUFFICIENT CONDITION TO DECLARE A STATOR BAD.

Also waiting for someone to actually use a AC Current clamp to do a loaded tests and diagnose or fault isolate a stator.
http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...LE-and-CHEAP-STATOR-TESTING&highlight=phase+B

 

[Matchless]

Hi Jim,
You are 100% correct and your guides are in my view exceptional! I just meant to highlight a specific test that is sometimes overlooked or misinterpreted. Your first and second law of a stator test is so true, but better understood by a novice once he/she has actually seen the type of faults and the results they lead to.
A while back I was planning to make up a plugable dummy load with 4 x 100W bulbs, the 4th one to ground, but 110V bulbs are not available here, so it never happened. Then a quick go/nogo test can be set up without the use of a multimeter, 3 yellow bulbs on, show stator OK and red on shows fault.
Keep well.

 

[posplayr]

Hi Jim,
You are 100% correct and your guides are in my view exceptional! I just meant to highlight a specific test that is sometimes overlooked or misinterpreted. Your first and second law of a stator test is so true, but better understood by a novice once he/she has actually seen the type of faults and the results they lead to.
A while back I was planning to make up a plugable dummy load with 4 x 100W bulbs, the 4th one to ground, but 110V bulbs are not available here, so it never happened. Then a quick go/nogo test can be set up without the use of a multimeter, 3 yellow bulbs on, show stator OK and red on shows fault.
Keep well.

See the last link in the last post on using an AC Amps Clamp meter. They are very cheap and even cheaper than any of the dummy load setups and do not require and disconnections.

Also waiting for someone to actually use a AC Current clamp to do a loaded tests and diagnose or fault isolate a stator.
http://www.thegsresources.com/_foru...LE-and-CHEAP-STATOR-TESTING&highlight=phase+B