Found earth... and a power wire - what could these be for? GSX250e

[angrypants]

hello,

sorry if this is a dumb question, im new to bikes and have no idea about electrics, ive tried reading and colouring the wiring diagrams but still have no idea

im helping restore a 1980 GSX 250e. So far we have front brakes done and petcock serviced and operating properly, starter servcied new relay in and have it running.. which is a surprise - ALL credit goes to this site and basscliffs site's info though.

but im now stumped on finding two "spare /unconnected wires"- all electrics seem to work... seem top work as i i have no idea what is supposed to work nar lights breaks blinkers etc

the wires they come out of that plastic pouch / boot above the igniter / transistor. see pic attached

i have a red wire ( power im sure ) that i dont know where it goes ....and the only other spare wire i can find near it is a black with white / yellow?? stripe that is not connected to anything either (is a earth to the frame i think)

if i connect them they spark and get red hot real quick, and even i know that is bad news


single red wire that come out of the harness and it HAD a single female bullet connector on it (now cut off). and seems to have anotehr connector on it before it goes into the harness

the other spare wire that is a black with white or yellow line on it it had some sort of plug on it too (, the other connector bit was cut and lost before i could check if they matched ??)

here are a couple of pics the earth connects a little way down the harness from where the positive comes out maybe 40mm ..it may or may not have been in the "rubber boot" at some time ? but the red one was definitely in there loose with the plugs / sockets

the red tape on the power was done by me to cover bar wire

as i said i THINK everything works electrically.... should i just ignore them?

ps not sure if its important/ related or not but i think all 3 wires from the stator go to the R/R at least they all disappear behind / into it without anything branching off

here is where they are located where i found the wires.jpg

any ideas

thanks

grant

[angrypants]

SPARE EARTH small.jpg the earth

[angrypants]

spare wire back small.jpgthe power wire

[Steve]

The red wire is likely the one to which the output of the voltage regulator connects.

.

[angrypants]

thanks for that i'll check that this weekend
cheers grant

[Gorminrider]

THAT Red wire ONLY goes from Battery positive to two places. The KEY switch and the regulator. On the way, there is a single fuse inserted. I expect it's been cut out in your case.You should have blown it when you touched red->Black/White stripe...
There is another red wire, a THICK one that goes to the starter solenoid....
(B/W on your diagram) is always ground. A B/W wire runs through your harness and has more than one connection to the frame...On a diagram I have for a 250, I see one at the solenoid and another just screwed on somewhere undefined. It may be up near the horn, or under the seat? or...These end with "ring- eyes" screwed to frame.... there are Other ground paths are through devices... you won't see these as a wire...just the metal casing of them attached to frame but without those B/W wires with "eyes" I described, your neutral green light would have lit up when you touched red to B/W...so I expect you have at least one of the proper ones attached....I don't otherwise know what that B/W you have loose is for. I don't see it on this diagram not yet anyways.

IF it's B/Y Black,yellow stripe it has to do with "ignitor" (TCI transistor controlled ignition...the black box) your bike wouldn't run well without it!

ps I can't actually see your pix. They are too small. You can make them bigger to display...

[angrypants]

Thanks I'll be back to the bike Sunday and get the r/r off and the plate it's on and have a look around
Thought we put it all back last time perfectly ... il report back soon, and work out how to pthe URL linking fir big pics
thanks fir you advice much appreciated
grant

[Gorminrider]

...per pix uploaded direct to the forum from your computer, you can also double click the pic and choose a size instead of the tiny thumbnail that appears otherwise, but you have to have to upload a useful- sized pic in the first place.

IMO "Useful size" is "640x,800x or maximum 1024 wide (I (for one?), hate scrolling around pictures that don't fit easily on the browser screen!)

[angrypants]

ok so i had a much better look now i know what im looking for i have studied the wiring diagram and see that it doenst match up well in many places , maybe its a fluke it still runs. .

thanks for your patience, if i cant work it out with your help i'll have to find a decent bike electrician i guess -- i'll go back and post the initial pics in a "view-able" size first, then show you where everything else goes

here is a larger version of where the red wire comes from - FYI all the other wires form this boot/ here go to the ignitor - see later pics


here is the spare earth , pretty sure it terminates via ring eyes on the frame on the other side (right side) of the bike (similar coloured & melted like it is here ).. . from where it connects to the frame on right side of bike, it soon is taped up with other wires (foot break wires?)that run up to under the seat and join the harness on left side of bike under seat near the boot above the ignitor, but looks like this melted one just pops out immediately after it joins the harness and is the loose one -- the wires into the boot can be seen in the back ground

[angrypants]

and yes there was no fuse -2 battery wires went to the went starter relay and the other into the harness in the direction of the tank

so here is the macro view - and it seems it doesn't match the gsx250e diagram. in a few places

all three wires from stator go to the R/R - however the yellow wire from the stator goes into a connector that comes out with two wire and into the R/R one of these is red the other is mainly white, i can recall nor see what stripe it had

the only thing coming out or the R/R to anywhere is brown which goes to the signal generator (joining with an orange wire into one side of the plug - the connector here broke, so been fixed with a female spade by us ) the other wire leaving the R/R is a black earth that earths via a ring eye on the R/R itself where it bolts to the bike.



close up here of the join where the yellow comes out as two before entering the R/R


close up here, ive taken the RR off. it shows what connects to the R/R brown to signal , black earth , nothing else going anywhere, just the wires from the stator -- is the red wire here that comes out of the yellow in the wrong place ? and maybe the earth should have gone in where the red is?? and the red connects to the "spare red wire"???

[angrypants]

here is the ignitor - everything from that boot under the seat from the connector goes into it ( except that spare red).
is there a wire missing there seems to be an extra hole ? there is a brown wire at the rear, you can see it in the macro view a few posts earlier, but it doesn't go to the signal generator like on the diagram.. the one to the signal comes from the R/R as shown above ( im so confused )


here is the melted earth on other side of the frame , which i think is the one that is the spare noted earlier ( comparing it to other wires its black/ white not b/y)




it starts, runs and all lights and blinkers work. i don't know if it charges though, its only be started 10 time sand been around the car park a couple of times.

i would guess 1st job is to put a new fuse in between the battery and where the red wire runs into the frame ( there is an existing bullet join there so should be easy )

thanks again and sorry for the long winded posts i am hoping more info will make it easier for people to assist, i am very grateful.

cheers
grant

[Gorminrider]

looks like a mess alright...
first, the ignitor box should have 6 wires coming out. From the top picture at the connector, these seem to be there.

second, the picture showing red attaching to yellow is very wrong...... the red wire from the R/R should go to another red wire....as prev mentioned, "red" only goes two places...a big one from battery to the solenoid bolt (where the solenoid will send it direct to starter-no fuse)
and secondly, from the battery and charge system ...(that is the wire you show from the R/R) ....through a fuse to the key where the key, switched on will allow it's power to all the lights,ignition,horn...through Orange...orange and striped orange wires are all power that is only "live" when key on.
The fuse in this red wire, is close to the battery and "before " the R/R's red wire taps into it on its way to the key....it's not all that crucial per fuse but is "best practise".

They came with a 15 amp glass fuse, But you are advised to replace with a blade fuse holder...they are easier to find nowadays.15 amps is all you need.

the three white striped wires that come out of the r/r connect to the three wires that come from the stator....UNLESS a) you want the bike to be exactly stock b) you have a headlight that turns off and on and c) you pay close attention to the wiring diagram...this is because the original R/R only regulates by grounding the excess power of ONE stator leg. It does this ONLY when the headlight is on. If your headlight does not have an off/on switch, youneedn't puzzle the diagram except to connect the three wires from the stator to the three wires from the regulator. at stator, one will be yellow, one will be White/Blue stripe, one will be White/Green stripe...connect these to the three whitish wires I see in your pix. The yellow has space for two connections but one is supposed to be empty!!

as to Black/white stripe grounds, replace/repair (TRY to maintain the colour code If Not, at least get close and Label the wires with wrong colours.....and screw to frame...as mentioned, the solenoid shell is a convenenient spot but any clean piece of frame will do. Naturally, any ground to the frame relies on a VeryGoodConnection from the battery's negative post to the frame...clean up any nasty looking ground.

PS. Hopefully, your bike still has a functioning charging system...when rewired correctly, get a multimeter (You NEED one), turn to Voltage DC 20 volts or more and test battery voltage at battery posts. When the bike is running, the meter should show 13.8 to 14.8 volts. Also take care of your battery. They do not suffer abuse well but if you can, don't buy a new one until the charging system is known-good...a not-too-bad car battery is a common and useful thing to use while trouble shooting, rather than executing a brand new m/c battery.

[angrypants]

thanks Gorminrider,
ill get into that on the weekend, and get a multi-meter first.

thanks for taking the time to help

gm

[angrypants]

hooked up the red from R/R to battery and put in a fuse, did all the checks and all seems in order and battery is charging. thanks again
grant