GS1000E Stator, regulator or rectifier fault find

[posplayr]

.

Eventually the voltmeter has arrived and here are my readings with a new battery (lights off)

1) Ignition key off battery charge 12.89v

2) Ignition key on and engine crank - 12.3v

3) 1000rpm engine idle -12.67v

4) At 2500 RPM - 13.70 VDC

5) At 5000 RPM - 13.69 VDC (when revs dropped back down to 2500rpm saw voltage increase to nearly 13.8VDC)

6) Key off - 12.98v

Tested all three stator legs at 5000k rpm and got approx. 75 VAC

The results indicate:

• The battery is good.
• You probably have dirty connections. You can confirm this following instruction in Phase A. Measure voltage drops at 5K RPM. If you did a SPG, then it is probably on the positive side. The voltage increasing at lower RPM is characteristic of dirty connections.
• You did not do a Leg-to-Grd(case) test results at 5K RPM (should be 0 VAC). This is the most important stator test.

[GSthou]

Hi Jim,

Will follow phase A instructions, and measure voltage drops. I have a single point ground using the regulator mounting bolt. Is the leg to ground done by using the +ve probe of the multimeter to each stator leg connector in turn and the -ve probe just touching the engine casing?. Many thanks for your help.

[posplayr]

Hi Jim,

Will follow phase A instructions, and measure voltage drops. I have a single point ground using the regulator mounting bolt. Is the leg to ground done by using the +ve probe of the multimeter to each stator leg connector in turn and the -ve probe just touching the engine casing?. Many thanks for your help.

Yes.

Voltage drops are at 5K RPM. You will probably see them increase with RPM becuase they increase with the amount of current being pushed from the R/R.

The SPG should have very low drops between R/R(-) (0.05V or less) and the battery assuming the connections are good.

[Gorminrider]

I suppose I'm cherry-picking, but it's a little hard to follow some of the logic.

My guess is that you have to pull heat out of a 400 degF stator using soothing bath of 270 degF oil.

https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?258221-GS1000E-Stator-regulator-or-rectifier-fault-find&p=2597605#post2597605

Originally Posted by Rijko

Am i missing something here ?
The oil sprayer would pull heat out of the stator .. warming up the oil, right ?

Obviously NOT! ....

https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?258221-GS1000E-Stator-regulator-or-rectifier-fault-find&p=2598087#post2598087

hmmm. If a fluid sprayed is to cool something, doesn't it necessarily act by transferring heat to itself? Given,of course, that the "something" is hotter than the oil....perhaps you have an oil cooler too?

If the solution is a "series" R/R, is an "oil sprayer" also required? Or, if a shunt R/R is used, would an oil sprayer "do the job"?

[posplayr]

I suppose I'm cherry-picking, but it's a little hard to follow some of the logic.

https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?258221-GS1000E-Stator-regulator-or-rectifier-fault-find&p=2597605#post2597605

Originally Posted by Rijko

https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?258221-GS1000E-Stator-regulator-or-rectifier-fault-find&p=2598087#post2598087

hmmm. If a fluid sprayed is to cool something, doesn't it necessarily act by transferring heat to itself? Given,of course, that the "something" is hotter than the oil....perhaps you have an oil cooler too?

If the solution is a "series" R/R, is an "oil sprayer" also required? Or, if a shunt R/R is used, would an oil sprayer "do the job"?

You selectively ignored the fact that the stator is a constant current device above 3500 RPM.

Most of the relevance of my statements are for the GS1100E's which have more heating problems (same motor as the OP). A sprayer might help the stator but not the Shunt R/R that is killing itself.

What appears confusing is you are ignoring the total power output by the stator is is a direct function of the stator temperature. I made step by step statements with formulas. Read it again.

If you cant follow that, then the essence of the principles involved is that the stator power increases the engine operating temperature. The direct evidence is the drop in GS1100E poeprating temperature observed by several people installing Series R/Rs. Ed will argue the point because it did not work on his GS1000E, but everybody else reported on GS1100E and those with 1166+ Big Blocks.


Before finding the Compufire, i installed a sprayer becuase i found my brand new stator turning brown after 200 miles. See the reported drops in engine temp after the CF installs.

https://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?161397-Compu-Fire-SERIES-R-R-Install&highlight=Compufire

[GSthou]

Hello Jim, just tried to send you a pm my friend, it mentions that your quota is full and cannot accept further messages

[Gorminrider]

You selectively ignored the fact that the stator is a constant current device above 3500 RPM.

yes. as irrelevant to my question...."If the solution is a "series" R/R, is an "oil sprayer" also required? Or, if a shunt R/R is used, would an oil sprayer "do the job"?"

A sprayer might help the stator but not the Shunt R/R that is killing itself.

also irrelevant, but, I haven't killed any of mine that replaced the Suzuki originals. They aren't particularly "hot" or even warm so I haven't any particular fear for their lifespan....

Still, from your indirect response, I gather that the sprayer is not required with every series R/R installation. Yet, you have one. So, given the premise (oft repeated hereabouts) that Shunt R/Rs overheat the stator, I think the effect of a sprayer is a fair question. (and yes, I am aware of formulas per heat and the conductivity of copper)

simple question: How much did the oil spray lower the temperature?

[posplayr]

I have to reach back in my memory to about 2010. My gut tells me a sprayer alone was nominally equivalent to series r/r alone. Combined I seemed to have double the effect. I also had an oil cooler but it was one of those small 550 coolers. Before any of the electrical/sprayer mods (but with cooler and before the 1166 kit)the bike would run 260-300 degF depending upon conditions. After it never exceeded 260 and in a cool fog dropped to 220 degF.

and yes I checked the sensor in boiling water it was all in spec.

this was a bored 1166 motor properly jetted (WBO2 sensor) and a wide range of conditions on road trips to northern cal.

[Gorminrider]

Thanks, posplayer- Those are "suprisingly" good results! Seem so to me, anyways. I must look around to see how you constructed it...though I can appreciate that if a "series" regulator is a similar fix for Suzukis, it's much easier to recommend them versus building an oil sprayer re: time and trouble, but I saw it mentioned several places and have been curious...

[posplayr]

Thanks, posplayer- Those are "suprisingly" good results! Seem so to me, anyways. I must look around to see how you constructed it...though I can appreciate that if a "series" regulator is a similar fix for Suzukis, it's much easier to recommend them versus building an oil sprayer re: time and trouble, but I saw it mentioned several places and have been curious...

I spoke with Chef1366 last night. He and I were on a trip through Sequoia Nat park. Our bikes 1100/16V were very similar except he had 1229 and I had 1166 otherwise same carbs, same cams. There was traffic in the park and we were lugging up a long hill. I had the mods and was running 250 deg. He was pushing well over 300 defF (measured with a oil filled VDO analog gauge). He might have even hit 320 before we hit the top of the hill and could pickup speed on the way down.

He thinks he dropped 30 degrees operating temp from the Compufire.

[GSthou]

Just thought i would give everyone an update. The help I have received from Jim (posplayr) has been very much appreciated. I decided to opt for a new stator as it looked like the previous stator was on its last legs. Received the new stator (Electrosport model) got it all buttoned up and connected. Got 12.8 VAC at 2500rpm and no increase in VAC at 5000rpm. Tested the new stator on paired legs and one phase only kicking out 2VAC !!!., on disconnecting the wires after the test one of the poorly crimped connectors came away (shoddy unit). So have removed the new stator and sent back to supplier and awaiting a replacement.

In the meantime after reading through all the posts and recommendations I started looking around for a SH775 r/r to replace the separate regulator/rectifier setup on the GS. Near on no availability in the UK, but managed to get a secondhand original unit from the US for $70 (shipping + customs tax included), just need to wait 3 weeks

for delivery.

Then next started looking for the Triumph T2500676 connector lead to compliment the SH775, again scarce as "rocking horse poo" in the UK, mailed 20 Triumph breakers all wanting to sell me a full harness (no thanks!). Eventually found a dealer who was out of stock and is going to put in a back order for the link leads approx. £30 (estimated 2 week delivery). So in the meantime I have split a cleaned every connector on bike hoping that once my new stator and SH775 r/r are fitted we are back to full glory.

Just out of interest guys presumably you all cut off the end connectors on the T2500676 to attach the stator wires and positive and negative connections what is your preference for making the connections?

[posplayr]

You want to inspect all connectors and crimps on the R/R, and personally I like to flow a little solder it. It sounds like Electrosport is not using mil-spec crimpers in their production work.

[GSthou]

You want to inspect all connectors and crimps on the R/R, and personally I like to flow a little solder it. It sounds like Electrosport is not using mil-spec crimpers in their production work.

Many thanks Jim

[GSthou]

Any of you guys used the Triumph T2500676 leads for your SH775 r/r, just wondering if you have managed to find a connector so that the 3 stator wires plug straight into the connector on the original lead. My T2500676 lead has not arrived yet so not sure on the configuration of the connector

[fastbysuzuki]

This is how I have done mine

This is using the Triumph link lead


Triumph part# T2500676.


Cut off the two small plugs then carefully split the harness so you have one plug with two brown and two black wires twist the Browns together likewise with the blacks so you now have a plug with one brown and one black so to speak.
The brown connects to the red wire in the bikes harness where the original rectifier/regulator red connected to, know as the T connection on various posts on here.
The black connects to the single point ground see many posts on here or just use the search facility for information.
The three blacks on the other plug connect to the three wires that come from the stator it does not matter which wire connects to which ( there is no polarity)
All joints where twisted together soldered and shrink wrapped.
The two left over wires in the bikes harness can be taped up and tucked away as they were for the handle bar loop and are not in use now.