Conventional "RACING" oil or not???

[hjfisk]

Honda JP4 is Hondas synthetic blend. I may not be remembering the name right..but anyway, its Hondas synthetic blend racing oil.

I thought JP4 was jet fuel?Ok hadn't read intire post never mind

[mrbill5491]

Its not an "OH OH HERE WE GO"....Its a legitimate question. I know less about modern conventional oil formulations than i do about any other subject on earth. The article from a Classic Yammy mag from back in the day ( written by the guy in charge of the recalls and repair program for Yamaha ) stated that had they had "TODAYS" oil technologies back then there wouldnt have been an issue with the oil foaming and loss of engine lubrication. So this has made me ask myself." Just what does he mean by "TODAYS TECHNOLOGY"? I am asking because i want to understand and gain knowledge and not start a pizzing match. Read this article and then answer...


http://www.classicyams.com/street-bi...750-story.html

Easy up chuck, just saying threads like this garner alot of attention is all.

[SqDancerLynn1]

The Brad Penn oil is what a lot of the HP engine builders use for break in new motors

[Nessism]

just to add and yes off topic but...
rotella has very little zinc left in it due to cat converters on newer vehicles/government regs and such.
rotella is not even close to what it used to be.
now old stock rotella from several or more years ago...thats a diff story.
brad penn oil is loaded with zinc and is the original Kendall green oil formula.
about 8 bucks per quart to your door...good stuff for sure.

Rotella still has a good bit of zinc and phosphorus - about 1200 ppm. The older formula was about 1500 ppm. Auto oil on the other hand is about 800. Oh, and most modern motorcycle oils are 1200 or less these days.

[rapidray]

Brad Penn is what i recommend also. Ray.

[JEEPRUSTY]

Aside from the grammar error in this statement does anyone have trouble believing that a process used to test used oils is any less accurate than one for fresh stuff.

In an effort to clarify any misconception about our product we did our own testing and sent three virgin oil samples (each from the same identical batch) to both Blackstone Lab and Southwest Research Lab for testing. All three Southwest sample results were completely in line with our internal specifications/analysis. The Blackstone zinc and phosphorus results in all three analysis were lower than our internal specifications/analysis and Southwest Research’s lab results. The results for both the Blackstone and Southwest Research analysis are listed below:
Brad Penn Product Blackstone Southwest Research
Penn Grade 1 zinc 1,214 ppm zinc 1,540 ppm
20W-50 #7119 phos 944 ppm phos 1,319 ppm
Penn Grade 1 zinc 1,424 ppm zinc 1,565 ppm
10W-30 #7150 phos 1,139 ppm phos 1,332 ppm
Brad Penn PCMO zinc 689 ppm zinc 1,051 ppm
20W-50 SJ #7123* phos 522 ppm phos 901 ppm
*In some cases we feel our PCMO SAE 20W-50 was sent in for analysis (and not the High Performance Oil SAE 20W-50) which does contain lower Zinc and Phosphorous additive concentration levels.
The difference in results between Blackstone and SRI can be explained by a difference in methodology in analyzing the samples and not differences in the formulation. Blackstone employed measurement techniques more generally employed in analyzing used oils, while SRI employed methods more usually utilized for new multigrade engine oils. The samples provided to both labs were new oils. New oils that have not been subjected to shear often require higher dilution rates in the elemental analysis measured by ICP (Inductively Coupled Plasma) as indicated in method ASTM D5185.

[JEEPRUSTY]

I have Hijacked the thread, Turned it into an oil thread and been a grammar nazi all in one post.

Bow to me!

[dagreatgatsby]

I don't think you need to buy "racing oil" or even "motorcycle oil". According to Peter Verdone (knowledgeable guy) and Motorcycle News Consumer, the correct car motor oil can be used on motorcycles. Just make sure that the bottle doesn't say "resources conserving". Read this and see what I mean:

http://www.peterverdone.com/archive/motoroil.htm

and

http://www.ducatimeccanica.com/oil.html

[Nessism]

I don't think you need to buy "racing oil" or even "motorcycle oil". According to Peter Verdone (knowledgeable guy) and Motorcycle News Consumer, the correct car motor oil can be used on motorcycles. Just make sure that the bottle doesn't say "resources conserving". Read this and see what I mean:

http://www.peterverdone.com/archive/motoroil.htm

and

http://www.ducatimeccanica.com/oil.html

Modern auto oil has greatly reduced high pressure additives like zinc and phosphorus compared to older formulations, and diesel oil. It's a bad choice for GS bikes.

[dagreatgatsby]

Nessism, it sounds like what you're saying is that we need zinc and phosphorus in our motor oil. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the information I gleaned from reading these articles is that we don't want zinc or phosphorus in our oil. I understand that zinc and phosphorus has cleaning properties but is also what causes the sludge. Therefore, in "racing oils", there is added zinc, phosphorus, and other additives but only because it is frequently changed. However, road bikes don't get oil changes as often and the extra zinc and phosphorus would actually be detrimental. And, also, it seems friction modifiers in racing oils are harmful to wet clutches. So, wouldn't it be okay to use "basic" synthetic car motor oil in our bikes?

[Nessism]

Nessism, it sounds like what you're saying is that we need zinc and phosphorus in our motor oil. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the information I gleaned from reading these articles is that we don't want zinc or phosphorus in our oil. I understand that zinc and phosphorus has cleaning properties but is also what causes the sludge. Therefore, in "racing oils", there is added zinc, phosphorus, and other additives but only because it is frequently changed. However, road bikes don't get oil changes as often and the extra zinc and phosphorus would actually be detrimental. And, also, it seems friction modifiers in racing oils are harmful to wet clutches. So, wouldn't it be okay to use "basic" synthetic car motor oil in our bikes?

Motor oil is a combination of base oil + additive package. Without additives the oil would be ill-suited for use in an engine. Zinc and Phosphorus are additives to protect metal parts from coming in contact with each other in high pressure areas. Parts like the transmission gears and camshafts need this zinc and phosphorus to reduce wear in the engine.

These high pressure additives work great at reducing wear, but they are bad for catalytic converters, thus the newer oil formulations have far less zinc and phosphorus then oils of old. This is why it's best to use diesel or motorcycle oil in your GS. These oils have more of these additives and offer better protection which equates to less wear.

[1_v8_merc]

Was there some kind of "oil forensics" class that I missed in high school?

Just put ****in diesel oil in the thing and Go! lol

[dagreatgatsby]

I've found another article called "the truth about motorcycle oils":

http://www.post610.org/truth_about_motorcycle_oils.htm

It basically says that Nessism is right regarding the fact that zinc and phosphorus provides engine protection. But it also mentions that the right car oil can be used in motorcycles. Especially the 10w40 and 20w50 weights because those weights are exempt from the new API standards and may contain more zinc and phosphorus than the 5w30 oils. Well, I just bought a bunch of Valvoline 20w50 synthetic oil for 50% off at O'Reilly's and am reluctant to return it. I'm going to try it out.

[mrbill5491]

I've found another article called "the truth about motorcycle oils":

http://www.post610.org/truth_about_motorcycle_oils.htm

It basically says that Nessism is right regarding the fact that zinc and phosphorus provides engine protection. But it also mentions that the right car oil can be used in motorcycles. Especially the 10w40 and 20w50 weights because those weights are exempt from the new API standards and may contain more zinc and phosphorus than the 5w30 oils. Well, I just bought a bunch of Valvoline 20w50 synthetic oil for 50% off at O'Reilly's and am reluctant to return it. I'm going to try it out.

Very good article. That makes me happy with my choice of oil for my bike. Royal Purple MX 10w-40 with a K&N oil filter. Hmm maybe I can get rid of those 1100 clutch springs?

[Agemax]

watch this video. i am not sure if it is a load of promotional bu11$h1t or how much truth is in it. it is very interesting regarding "racing" oil........

http://www.brocksperformance.com/brocknm/templates/bpp1.aspx?articleid=432&zoneid=22