Going, Going, Barely....Help Plz

[ssanderson1]

Hey guys, I need your input. I was riding my 650G home from work the other day and had a bit of a problem. It had been running great for quite some time. Everything seemed fine on the ride home. I was approaching an intersection to turn right. As such, I was down shifting from 4th to 3rd to 2nd. As soon as I shifted into second the exhaust sounded muffled and the bike lost all power. I was able to turn and keep it running long enough to get home (only if the RPM's were way up). I got home, parked it for the night, tried to start it the next morning....wouldn't start. I only tried to start it a few times before the battery went dead (nearly new battery, closed cell gel). I charged the battery, gave the carbs a quick run through(checked and cleaned the jets), and tried to start it back up. Nothing! It cranks and cranks, but never starts. I've tried pop starting it too...no luck.

Any ideas?? I haven't checked spark plugs yet, but they've only got like 200 miles on them. I can see about an inch of gas in the tank.

 

[tkent02]

Got Spark?

Got Gas?

Got Compression?

 

[BassCliff]

Hey Steve,

Is that you? Long time, no see.

Let's start here: How's your spark? Take a spare spark plug and, one at a time, pull the wires off of the plugs in the engine and connect them to the loose plug. Lay the plug on the head to ground it, crank the motor, look for a good blue spark on the electrode.

Have you moved yet? Are you still in Fullerton?

Take care,

Cliff

 

[ssanderson1]

Hey Steve,

Is that you? Long time, no see.

Let's start here: How's your spark? Take a spare spark plug and, one at a time, pull the wires off of the plugs in the engine and connect them to the loose plug. Lay the plug on the head to ground it, crank the motor, look for a good blue spark on the electrode.

Have you moved yet? Are you still in Fullerton?

Take care,

Cliff

It's me! Ha. Haven't moved yet...Still in Fullerton. I start my rotations in August.

I believe it has compression. When trying to pop start it (I got up to ~10mph before dropping the clutch in 1st gear, tried it in 2nd too), the rear tire would screech on the asphalt when I dropped the clutch.

I'll go check the plugs and report back. Thanks for the help.

 

[koolaid_kid]

An inch of fuel? Is that enough for even Reserve to work?

 

[tkent02]

MIght be, if Reserve works. The screen for reserve is lower in the tank, could get clogged up before the regular one does.

 

[chuck hahn]

Set it to PRIme and start it.. Then on REServe and take it around the block and see if the response is back. If so, then theres your sign.

 

[tkent02]

Or you could put some gas in the gas tank.

 

[BassCliff]

Steve,

Yes, I seem to recall we had that sort of an issue with the low fuel level. Perhaps the petcock screen is really gummed up at the lower level and not allowing the reserve or prime settings to work properly.

Thank you for your indulgence,

Cliff

 

[koolaid_kid]

or you could put some gas in the gas tank.

ding! ding! ding!
That is so marginal you really need to eliminate it as a possible issue first and foremost.

 

[ssanderson1]

ding! ding! ding!
That is so marginal you really need to eliminate it as a possible issue first and foremost.

Haha. You guys are funny. I'll add some gas and hope for the best! If that solves the problem....I'll have to leave the forum for good out of devastating embarrassment.

Cliff, I just checked the plugs...I'm getting a spark from all 4 coils(I used a new plug for this test). I decided to pull all 4 plugs and take a look at them. They were all pretty dirty and none of them were dry. It seems like they should all be bone dry, but they all had junk on them. The spacing on all 4 is at about .030". Here's a pic of one of them...
This is after I wiped it off...

 

[tkent02]

Don't worry, we've all done the gas thing.
You plug looks oil fouled, but you need to take it for a good run and then look.

 

[ssanderson1]

Don't worry, we've all done the gas thing.
You plug looks oil fouled, but you need to take it for a good run and then look.

If the plugs are oil fouled....I'll need to replace them before it'll start, right?

You guys being super familiar with these bikes, why would my plugs oil foul? (obviously oil) Think it's a valve clearance problem? I think when Cliff and I shimmed the valves we left them pretty loose...I've been hearing them click since we worked on them a year and a half ago.

 

[tkent02]

No, no and no…..


If they are still sparking it will let the bike run just fine.


Get it running well and then look at the plugs.

Did you get any gasoline yet?

 

[BigD_83]

My 650G acted fuel starved with more than an inch of fuel left on the tank with the original petcock. The new petcock lets it get lower than that, although I am now in the habit of filling up when the fuel gauge is at 1/4 tank.

 

[TheCafeKid]

I have found the baffling in most of these tanks prevents that last 1/4-1/2 gallon from being available before the petcock is sucking air.
Just my experience.

You mentioned that you tried cranking it over a few times and it killed the battery...is it possible you have charging issues and the battery wasn't providing enough juice to fire the coils anymore??

 

[Steel Toed Tank]

the bike lost all power. I was able to turn and keep it running long enough to get home (only if the RPM's were way up). I got home

Sounds like fuel starvation to me.

Without a working gas gauge or speedometer, this is something i encountered several times early on in the season.

 

[tom203]

Ssanderson1 said....."I can see about an inch of gas in the tank"

Yeah , looking at right side of tank but petcock can't find it! Similar to BigD83 , I had problems with original petcock running down hills, bike would cut out and need to be pointed uphill for restart. New petcock actually allows bike to run in RES at 1/4 gauge mark in hilly terrain.

put gas in- your plugs look ugly, have you been adding much oil ?

 

[TheCafeKid]

Sounds like fuel starvation to me.

Without a working gas gauge or speedometer, this is something i encountered several times early on in the season.

I agree that it sounds like a possibility, but having been stranded on the side of the road a couple of times by my GSes faulty charging system, I can also say that this sounds like charging issues as well. If the reg/rec croaks, and isn't passing charge to the battery, or if a leg of the stator is dead, and the battery isn't getting enough voltage, the bike is running solely on what the battery has left in the tank. No pun intended. Eventually the battery just doesn't have enough left to fire the coils anymore and the bike stalls out.

The Stator papers will show you how to test the components to see if you're getting any/adequate charging. Keep in mind that even if the battery shows a good charge while sitting, putting a load on it may reveal that it's crapping out with the load on it.

 

[koolaid_kid]

It would not be the first time there were multiple issues with a GS. Fortunately, putting more fuel in the tank is a quick fix. The stator papers take a bit longer.