mobile phone charger

[ukjules]

Thanks again.
Doing all the test now .
Will report.

[ukjules]

Quick update.

Battery when connected to headlight for 5
mins remains bright.

Also:
Removed starter motor , cleaned the filthy compartment, tested
on bench. It spun when connected to battery but sounded odd.
Connected to bike and tested again isolating it
direct to battery - nothing.
Removed , back on bench , connected up , nothing.

Dismantled the motor , was filthy inside and magnets
in bits coming away from sides !

Coincidence:
So by simply putting a mobile charger on I uncovered all this
all at the same time.

So I am assuming the battery might be ok and I am looking
for a new starter motor. ( no matter what else is wrong )

ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO GET ONE IN UK ?
THEY ALL SEEM TO BE IN USA.

[posplayr]

This is a perfect example of why using standard electrical loads for a built in battery load test is do much more reliable than using the starter as a load.

The he quick test uses typical 10a loads which are very unlikely to be failed vs a starter motor that could easily be on it 's way out .

the quick test could have diagnosed the op issue in about 5 min using just a volt meter.
that is because the first thing it confirms is whether battery is good. Is starter will not spin with a good battery and shorted solenoid doesn't take imagination to conclude starter is bad.

[mmattockx]

Voltage means nothing, you can easily have 12 volts but not enough power to turn the engine over, in other words no amperage.

I don't think it's possible to have a battery hold a voltage under load and not have the amps to carry that load. If the battery is bad it won't maintain voltage under load and the measured voltage collapses as I said.


Mark

[posplayr]

I don't think it's possible to have a battery hold a voltage under load and not have the amps to carry that load. If the battery is bad it won't maintain voltage under load and the measured voltage collapses as I said.


Mark

That is exactly correct. State of charge can be directly inferred from what is called internal resistance. Internal resistance is how far the voltage drops as a function of the current delivered.

in round numbers if you drop 1v to deliver 10 amps that in 0.1 ohms of internal resistance and state of charge is probsbly about 80%.

if you drop 4v to deliver the same current then that resistance is now 0.4 ohms and the State of charge is probably horrible like 20%.

This how engineers think about batteries and most of the mystery disappears.

it is also why that is the first step in the Quick Test.

having low state of charge does not mean a battery is unfit for service. But after you charge that battery and it fails a similar test ; this is termed " won't hold a charge" and battery is due to be replaced.

[ukjules]

Dont know what all that means but the status now is:

Battery is on trickle charge at 0.6amps.
I am going to assume it is ok as it lit a headlight for 5 mins and shows good voltage.

I will assume that the mobile charger being put in and a day after the starting issue showing up
was simply that a coincidence.
The only other difference was that for the first time for ages i had taken the bike on a long run
at constant medium speed. How this would effect the starter i dont know.

The blip where the starter worked in front of my eyes on the bench and then not in the bike will
have to be a blip as when removed it had disintegrated and must have been like that for a while - and worked !
Remember there was no spark when bridging the solenoid posts prior to my tests today.

Now looking for a starter motor and will then report.

i amit the battery must be good as no amount of jumping, using other good batteries made a difference.

Anyone know where to get a starter motor in uk ?

[posplayr]

Dont know what all that means ?

well good luck then ; seems like you will figure it out eventually

[ukjules]

Luck ? I certainly wont need luck to fix this !
Is that how you do it ?
I use a methodical approach to fix things.

I won't bother with this thread anymore.
Argue amongst yourselves .

[mmattockx]

Dont know what all that means

well good luck then ; seems like you will figure it out eventually

I won't bother with this thread anymore.
Argue amongst yourselves .

Wow, seems to be lots of thin skin around here today. It seems to me that people looking for advice/help on things they don't understand shouldn't be getting p!ssy with those who can help them solve their problems.


Mark

[Brendan W]

Wow, seems to be lots of thin skin around here today. It seems to me that people looking for advice/help on things they don't understand shouldn't be getting p!ssy with those who can help them solve their problems.


Mark

Indeed. Frankly I'm surprised that there isn't more outright warfare on the Forum. We are spread across the globe communicating in various versions of english so it's quite something that anything useful gets communicated at all.
Those who pretend to know about human interaction claim that 65% of it is body language, another 30% is tone and the remaining 5% is the actual words. Small wonder that from time to time the words fall, like toast, butter side down.
Everyone here is here to help or learn. Our abilities in both these arenas vary. There will always be irritations and niggles. It's called family

[AMK]

Luck ? I certainly wont need luck to fix this !
Is that how you do it ?
I use a methodical approach to fix things.

I won't bother with this thread anymore.
Argue amongst yourselves .

Wow, this really was an informative thread. I saw nothing wrong till this. You guys keep talking and I'll be glad to keep learning.

[Gorminrider]

I hope ukjules will retitle the thread. Anyone looking for ideas on mobile phone chargers will fall into a sinkhole on this one....

[AMK]

I hope ukjules will retitle the thread. Anyone looking for ideas on mobile phone chargers will fall into a sinkhole on this one....

Unless we finish it on a positive note.
I installed a cigarette lighter style adapter directly to the battery and charged my phone and ran my GPS. I didn't have a problem with battery drain but I did see a reaction on my GPS screen.
It looked like noise in the electrical system but it came and went. After reading this thread I think I'm going to wire it through the signal system as Steve says.
I'm concerned more about what the system may do to the devices than what my devices may do to the system. Is there a filter of some sort that would clean up the power?

[Gorminrider]

"Came and went" sounds like maybe your phone/gps battery charging system reaching full charge and then not....switching back and forth is going to take time- there is going to be some cushion in the circuit...or you might see this as "flashing" (my gps gets brighter when on 12v, dims when on internal battery as an example...) OR you have all kinds of stuff in the 1981 motorcycle that is not adapted to modern technology...AM radio noise was the biggest worry then, not the Black boxes everything has now....
.....sometimes a simple diode in series on the power to your charge adapter will help remove spurious noise from the line. It lowers the voltage available to the charge adapter but it should still work fine...otherwise you can try electrolytic capacitor in parallel but this is more complicated and you get into "noise filters" generally see: "searching on the internet" and "Google"

My objection to cheapo usb chargers is an experience where it burned out when starting. The "burn out" created a short.

[posplayr]

I hope ukjules will retitle the thread. Anyone looking for ideas on mobile phone chargers will fall into a sinkhole on this one....

And people wonder why I get a little sarcastic with some posters.

This thread IS a real detriment to the forum. People come on virtually ignoring everything that is common knowledge, or specific recommendations that several people make. They proceed on the basis that they can use pure logic with zero practical or theoretical understanding and after fumbling around for a week declare "Eureka look what I have discovered". Even my attempted spoonfeeding in this thread was tossed off like so many anchovies from a pizza.

While there is nothing in the forum rules against it, I'm not going to support this posters in diminishing the forum with this kind of self centered - self learning at forum expense. This is not an example for anyone to follow on how to solve problems.