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    #31
    Originally posted by t3rmin View Post
    Well obviously the bike is running (isn't it?), so there has to be voltage to the coils. I'm not sure what to tell you. I suppose the colors could be different on your bike. Regardless of what color, we're talking about the wires that feed the coils. Not the plug wires, but the wires on the other side of the coils. There will be two wires to each coil. Hold the black meter lead on the neg battery terminal and put the red lead on all of the wires going to the coils (one at a time). With the ignition on, one of the two wires going to each coil should have voltage.

    If you're disconnecting the wires from the coil before testing them, make sure you test the correct side. If you test the coil side after it's been disconnected you won't get anything. If you test the other side (the side coming from the wire harness), it'll still work. I just tested mine without disconnecting anything by jamming the lead under the rubber/plastic sheath until I hit metal. It sounds like you're basically doing that, too, but I just wanted to make sure...
    Yup, that's exactly what I'm doing. Guess I'll just keep trying.

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      #32
      Make sure the kill switch is set to run, too, not just the key.

      Comment


        #33
        Originally posted by t3rmin View Post
        Make sure the kill switch is set to run, too, not just the key.
        That seems to have accounted for it.

        9.7v on the left coil
        9.9v on the right

        I told you to treat me like a complete moron. Seems a bit low to me, eh?
        Last edited by Guest; 10-03-2006, 05:46 PM.

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          #34
          Ahh ok, now you've got it! ;-)

          Voltage is too low, though! You're in the same range (actually a little lower) I had when I was having a bunch of trouble. And the voltage may even be getting worse once things heat up (sometimes questionable connections get worse with heat). If you can't go through the wiring harness, ignition switch, and kill switch, and clean up the connectors enough to get 12+ volts, install a relay with a direct wire from the battery like I did. Made a HUGE difference.

          You *need* to have 12+volts to those coils!

          You'll find relay(s) at the auto parts store in the lighting/electrical section. It'll look like a small box with 4 or 5 prongs coming out of the bottom. Open up your car hood and look in the fuse/relay box for an example. The relay install took me about 30 min. and I'd be happy to walk you through it if you go that route.
          Last edited by Guest; 10-03-2006, 05:57 PM.

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            #35
            Originally posted by t3rmin View Post
            Ahh ok, now you've got it! ;-)

            Voltage is too low, though! You're in the same range (actually a little lower) I was when I was having a bunch of trouble. And the voltage may even be going down for you once things heat up (sometimes questionable connections get worse with heat). If you can't go through the wiring harness, ignition switch, and kill switch, and clean up the connectors enough to get 12+ volts, install a relay with a direct wire from the battery like I did. Made a HUGE difference. You *need* to have 12+volts to those coils.
            You'd recommend this rather than buying new coils?

            I'm assuming if corrosion in the ignition switch and kill switch are robbing me of voltage, it's going to be the same issue even with new coils, right?

            Would that entail just taking apart the right hand control and cleaning it up?

            As for the wiring harness, what exactly am I cleaning? I've been wanting to clean all my connections of corrosion and slap some dielectric grease on there for some time, but I could never get a good enough step-by-step to figure out what it is I'm trying to clean.

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              #36
              New coils won't help you with the voltage thing. You may *also* have bad coils, but I'd worry about getting 12+v there first and seeing how it runs.

              To clean connectors start in the back by the regulator/starter/fuse block, find every connector, pull it apart, spray WD-40 in, and put it back together. Dialectric grease would be good also. Tug on every wire in the plastic multi-connectors (if it comes out easy, redo it) and twist every "bullet" connector around good to scrape off corrosion. Any burnt/melted connectors should be replaced. Do the same for all the connectors in the headlight bucket. Also pull the fuse block off and clean all the connections in the back. Replace the fuses, even if they look good. Rip into the ignition (key) switch and kill switch and clean/grease everything.

              This is alot of work to do correctly. I didn't even bother to tear into the ignition and kill switches and do a super thorough job. I just did a cursory cleaning of connectors and replaced all the burnt ones I found. Then I just went the relay route since it was much easier and I felt more comfortable with a nice solid direct wire from the battery to the coils.

              The relay is just a switch. The "trigger" to the switch is the original orange wire. It (the relay) completes the circuit of the direct line from the battery to the coils only when it sees voltage on the original orange wire. That way you bypass all the old shoddy wiring but the coils are still only powered when the ignition is on.
              Last edited by Guest; 10-03-2006, 08:53 PM.

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                #37
                I felt more comfortable with a nice solid direct wire from the battery to the coils.
                That is what I did also for my gs850g after many inexplicable running problems. I managed to suspect also carburetors, valve clearances and vacuum leaks etc...

                I even tried to clean connections and switches twice including key switch. Somehow voltage dropped always. I could not ever find the place with bad connection. (I should have used testlamp instead of multimeter, because only on heavy load bad connection would show up)

                Finally I jumped temporary wire (with fuse) from battery to coils. Same time I also installed a new battery, plugs and caps - the problem was gone!

                Symptoms were so wierd! First cylinder 2 was failing (cylinder 3 occassionally too).
                If I removed plug caps from 1 and 4 THEN cylinder 2 worked fine! Now, I know it was just not enough to fire all 4 cylinders properly. EDIT: FYI: I swapped each other coils, wires, plugs and everything but symptom did not move from cylinder 2 anywhere.. That was what made me desperate and think of carbs and other non-electric related.

                Meanwhile I even changed to electronic ignition and new coils from the breaker points ('79). The problem was gone for a while until voltage dropped enough again. It happened so many things that afterwards it surely looks obvious, but when problems occured and pinpointing did not make clear answer I was too confused..


                UncleMike, relay controlled extra feed to the coils is better for long run (or new wire harness), but in the beginning if you don't have spare relay at home you could just test it with temporary wire straight from battery. Just be careful not to ground accidentally that hot wire anywhere.
                Last edited by Guest; 10-04-2006, 03:47 AM.

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                  #38
                  Mike,

                  That voltage at the coils is exactly what I get and mine runs AOK. I think your ok there, but if the relay add on worked for others go for it. With voltage at the coils we have Identified a NON-CDI system. Make sure you have 3 ohm Non-cdi coils. The Accel web site offers good troubleshooting tips. Good Luck. The Accel coils you need are 140403 (NON-CDI)



                  Did you put the new spark plug caps on ?
                  82 1100 EZ (red)

                  "You co-opting words of KV only thickens the scent of your BS. A thief and a putter-on of airs most foul. " JEEPRUSTY

                  Comment


                    #39
                    That kind of voltage may or may not work depending on whether it gets worse when hot, the condition of your coils/wires/caps/plugs, the tuning of your carbs, etc. etc. Also, aftermarket coils may still be able to generate more of a decent spark with 9+v than stockers.

                    BUT, you will _never_ get as hot/thick of a spark with 9+v as you would with 12+v. Buying Accel coils will not fix the problem. It may or may not cover it up, but the fact remains you've got some crappy wiring somewhere in your ignition, which is not something I'd ignore!

                    Svahnm gave some good avice. If you want to see how it'd run with the relay trick in place, just temporarily run some wire direct from the battery to the coils (just use some wire nuts to connect the wires). This isn't a long term solution since you don't want to power the coils while the bike is off, but you can see whether or not it'll make a difference.

                    For my money, once I saw low voltage at the coils, there was no question whether I'd wire up a relay if I couldn't get it cleared up by cleaning connections. Even if it's not causing problems now, it'll just get worse as time goes on and you _WILL_ be impacted by it in the future if you don't fix it now.

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Don't worry, guys. Any job worth doin' is worth doin' right.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Originally posted by t3rmin View Post
                        That kind of voltage may or may not work depending on whether it gets worse when hot, the condition of your coils/wires/caps/plugs, the tuning of your carbs, etc. etc.
                        I agree, mine happened like that. I had initially approx. 9v on the coils (after cleaning raised it better). Turning ignition on drops battery voltage quite much, so they require power. On high revs it charges coils even more frequently.

                        I threw away breaker points (installed transistorized ignition) and even bought new coils for sure. This made my bike work fine for 1000km, but after failure came back again. (very hot summer day). It was just so long time time that I even suspected cam chain etc. Specially because I was able to ride below 3000rpm gently trottle.

                        Boyer's aftermarket ignition sparks all the cylinders every 180 degrees, so it requires power for 4 sparks at the time, and now afterwards it is obvious why removing cyl 1&4 helped sparking number 2 and 3.

                        Back to issue:
                        actually I missed the point, what was the symptom in the first place what made you checking coils etc. I mean knowing what is going on, keep us focused on your problem better. I just wanted to share some experiences of my gs850g mystical case which seemed to be after all quite simple when it was resolved..

                        First time when my problem occured:
                        This forum contains old posts which may have information which may be useful. It is a closed forum in that you can not post here any longer. Please post your questions in the other technical forums.


                        Here it happened again...
                        This forum contains old posts which may have information which may be useful. It is a closed forum in that you can not post here any longer. Please post your questions in the other technical forums.

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                          #42
                          Thanks. Any input is appreciated.

                          I'm diving into the headlight bucket today to check all those connections. I'll let you guys know how it turns out.

                          ~Mike

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                            #43
                            Headlight bucket has two terminations with no connection.

                            There is one with two brown wires connected to the female end of a bullet connector, and it's not attached to anything.

                            Second is two black wires with white stripes, also connected to the female end of a bullet connector and not attached to anything.

                            What the hell?

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                              #44
                              Into the kill switch/starter now and it's open but there doesn't seem to be anything to clean. All the connections are soldered.

                              Anyone wanna attempt a step-by-step for an idiot?

                              Comment


                                #45
                                That's it. There's nothing more to be done if you've cleaned all the connectors in the back, in the headlight bucket, and in the ignition switch and kill switch. If there's nothing to clean in the ignition or kill switch then there's nothing to clean...

                                Short of replacing the entire wiring harness, if you haven't got 12v to the coils now, you'll need to go the relay route.

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