Tire mounting sealant question.

[GS750GUY]

I'm mounting new tubeless rubber on my GS cast wheels and have a question regarding a sealing solution. I know when tires are mounted on my car the mechanic will swab a solution of water and dish soap liquid to help the rubber slide onto the wheel. I'm also told the dish soap has a thicker, slick, slimy texture to both slow the evaporation of the water and also serves to help seal the rubber tire to the rim. One mechanic told me that the dish soap solution will seal any microscopic variances between the rim and rubber and when the dish soap dries it leaves behind a residue that helps seals against slow leaks. What experiences do all of the rest of you out there have with this subject. Is there any truth to this and do any of you have any tried and true tips and tricks or sealing solutions you have used or conconcted that works for you?
GS750GUY

[chiphead]

For years I've used a dish soap water solution. It's always worked well. I know there are others here that will insist you need the professional tire mounting lube you can buy at auto parts stores but unless you're doing 20 tires a year it doesn't make sense to me. Yes, I'm an economical fellow (cheap prick).
The dish soap solution microscopically sealing the sealing surfaces sounds sketchy to me but what the hell do I know.
I just mounted a Cheng Shin on the rear of my bike and there ALWAYS seems to be one area that just doesn't want to seat, maybe 5-6 inches. About 80 psi and bouncing the tire finally popped it out but my testicles had by that time crawled up around my ears. Do us all a favor and secure the rim so if the tire blows it won't take off your face.8-[

[Boondocks]

"Professional tire mounting lube" is vegetable oil soap and water. Check the ingredients.

The soapy water lubricates the tire bead for easy mounting and seating. I would take the comments about soap having tire sealing qualities with a grain of salt.

[kingofvenus]

Used to use non-hardening gasket sealant on the rear slick of a drag bike I ran, kept it from spinning on the rim, so I would think it would help seal it too.

[jimcor]

"Professional tire mounting lube" is vegetable oil soap and water. Check the ingredients.

The soapy water lubricates the tire bead for easy mounting and seating. I would take the comments about soap having tire sealing qualities with a grain of salt.

I didn't believe it either, but Boondocks is correct. Go to one of the dollar stores and pick up some Murphy Oil Soap. That's the mystery mounting fluid, right there.

Google Murphy Oil Soap and JTM Products it's quite interesting. Murphy's Oil Soap is still made as an automotive/industrial product by JTM (with the 's), while Murphy Oil Soap (no 's) has been sold to Colgate as a home care product. Same thing different bottles/labels.

[ikazuki]

GS750: are you planning on changing the tire yourself or having someone else do it? Make sure the rim is clean of dirt and oxidation. If they are dirty, a good scrubbing with one of those green scotch brand pads should do nicely. Also clean the inside of your tire as well as dry it completely you dont want any beginnings of moisture to start with. Then proceed. Ive used goop hand cleaner to slick up the tire as well as soapy water but all the suggestions are good.
Stay away from fix a flat as Ive heard it really does a number on the rim by deteriorating it. take care and ride safely. ikazuki

[bradleymaynar]

When you have the bare rim, use a wire brush wheel mounted on a drill and go over each side of the rim. It will clear all debris from the are that the tire mounts to.

As I've always understood it, using a soapy solution helps in detecting any leaks once the tire is inflated. Our usual procedure (the guys located around me gather annually to change tires at one member's house) is to inflate the tire once mounted without the valve stem in place. We'll over-inflate the tire to ensure that the bead has set. We'll keep putting the soapy solution on to be sure that their are no leaks around the rim. Once the bead has set, we replace the stem and inflate the tire to spec.

Brad bt

[GS750GUY]

Thanks re:Tire mounting and seal

Thanks guys for the great soulutions. I think I saw a bottle of Murphey's in the cupbord. Also, just as side note about what someone told me about the dish soap creating a sealing kind of film when dry. There just may be something to that. When I got my wife's bottle of Polmolive dish soap out from under this sink I noticed that around the spout some of this stuff had dried on the outside of the spout and cap. In studying it I found that it has a very thick gooey sticky consistancy that appears to possibly have the kind of characteristics that would seal tiny leaks. Very similar to what I would imagine a non-hardening gasket sealer to have.
Thanks again!!
Hey if you live in cold weater winter country........we are half way there......to a new season of bike riding!!!!
GS750GUY.

[bwringer]

If $8 is going to keep you from eating this month and you just HAVE to concoct homemade substitutes for proper tire mounting lube, please remember that there's a world of difference between dish detergent and mild vegetable soap.

Dish detergent is corrosive, nasty stuff that you do NOT want in close contact with your rims for long periods of time. Murphy's Oil Soap and other vegetable oil based soaps are much friendlier.

NAPA sells two kinds of tire mounting lube -- there's a thick blue goop for about $8 that's basically KY Jelly (mostly glycerin) with an anti-corrosive ingedient, and there's Ru-Glyde for about $14 a gallon, which is based on a mild soap. I'm not sure if it includes an anti-corrosive. I've also seen pink soap-based stuff from other vendors.

So please -- don't use dish detergent. If you've just got to be cheap, use a mild soap like a solution of Murphy's.

[GS750GUY]

Tire mounting

Took your advice and got some of the tire mounting sealant from the auto parts store. Much better than the dish soap.
Does anyone have any tricks or tips to mounting a new tire to the rim youself? Without a fancy tire machine and just doing it by hand is like trying wrestle a greased grizzly bear, pull his tail, tongue, and teeth all at the same time.
GS750Guy

[fgh]

Took your advice and got some of the tire mounting sealant from the auto parts store. Much better than the dish soap.
Does anyone have any tricks or tips to mounting a new tire to the rim youself? Without a fancy tire machine and just doing it by hand is like trying wrestle a greased grizzly bear, pull his tail, tongue, and teeth all at the same time.
GS750Guy

Well what I use is an old 14" auto rim, a pair of 15" (or so) tire spoons and a pair of rim protectors. The auto rim is to hold the bike wheel still. Wrap some tape around the rim's edge to protect the wheel. Strap the wheel on the rim with one or two of those nylon straps used to hold stuff down. Some use PVC pipe for rim protectors or you can buy a pair. Soap up the beads on the tires and slide one on as far as possible. Then take the spoons and pull the remaining bead over. Make sure the bead already on slides up into the center of the rim. The beads really don't stretch at all so you have to have one side in the center to pull the other side over the rim.

If your new tire had something wrapped around one place that is causing the beads to sit close together it will be #$%^ to get it to bead. Stuff something in there as long as possible to get the beads apart. If you still can't get it to bead get a stick and piece of rope and make a tourniquet. Put the rope around the tire tread and then tighten to get the beads to the rim.

LOL!

[bwringer]

Here's the standard tutorial on changing motorcycle tires:

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/tire-changing.html

Getting beads to seat on our narrow GS tires and rims is usually not a problem. The tutorial is based on wider sportbike tires, which need a litle help. I've only needed a strap once with a tire that was a little out of shape from a packing strap, as noted above.

I break the beads with two large wooden clamps. Simple and very unlikely to damage anything. There are all sorts of homemade methods to break beads with huge levers, pickup bumpers, and such, but I prefer a method that doesn't place stress on the wheel, and that won't create a disaster if something slips or breaks.

[DaveDanger]

A note on inflating freshly installed tires with no valve core installed, to help seat the bead. It's an easy way to do that, but be cautious... with the valve core out of the stem, air pressure goes into that tire MUCH faster than normally. It's very easy to overinflate the tire and blow it off the rim, causing damage and possible injury.

My preferred method to mount the new tire on the wheel, I simply take the wheel hub in my left hand, the tire in my right.... think about the boy my daughter is going out with.... then (reminiscent of the guy in the marching band with the two huge cymbals) slam the tire and rim together causing a desirous melding of form and function allowing inflation and traction to take place. I use a large shop fan to blow away the smoke resulting from the friction by-products.

If I'm in a good mood, I use the old auto rim, and tire spoons with heat-shrink to protect the wheel finish. I have typically used isopropanol alcohol to sweet-talk the tire bead over the rim edge. It evaporates quickly and leaves no residue of any sort that will encourage the tire to ever spin or slip under acceleration or braking. Alcohol also works well for handgrips and handlebars. It's an old trick I picked up from frequent replacements of the rubber tubes on my Wrist-Rocket® slingshots (I was much younger once).

[bwringer]

A note on inflating freshly installed tires with no valve core installed, to help seat the bead. It's an easy way to do that, but be cautious... with the valve core out of the stem, air pressure goes into that tire MUCH faster than normally. It's very easy to overinflate the tire and blow it off the rim, causing damage and possible injury.

I usually set the regulator on my air compressor to about 50 - 60 psi for the bead seating phase of the festivities. This gives you less of a rush of air, though, so it might not work with a reluctant tire.

The tutorial I linked to above includes a shortcut where you can sometimes get one side of the tire over the rim by lubing things up and slamming it on at an angle. I think this only works with radial tires, which are a lot more flexible. I've tried it with the far stiffer bias ply GS tires a few times, with no results.

[GS750GUY]

Tire mounting thanks!!

Thanks guys!! All of your tips have been very helpful. With your help and that of the tutorial I successfully have changed my first new tire. And I might add ........all by myself.......no 2nd pair of hands were used. I think I lost 10 lbs in the process but got it done. The best part of the whole process is the satisfaction of knowing that the Suzuki dealer in my area did not get into my pockets for the astronomical price they charge just to change and balance a tire.
Thanks again!!
Harold (GS750GUY)