valve clearance and stator/charging question...

[nsbone]

Hi,
I just bought 1984 GSX550ES (16 valve) with famous charging problem.

Well as you all know, it might be R/R or stator coil...

I did some measurement as below:

• R/R output voltage: about 12V at idle, as rpm goes up, it went down..
• Stator voltage (AC): 1-2=120V, 1-3=120V, 2-3=60V... hmm i wonder..

What could this be? maybe i have bad multimeter....??? Now, i am waiting for a stator coil from the US.....

and, does anyone has stator-R/R circuit diagram for 550 ES 16Valve model? i would imagine the stator is star delta config..???

And, is 16Valve model using shim for valves adjustment?

Still waiting for my Haynes to arrived from UK...

thanks in advance,

[rgierer]

There are folks on this forum who really know these 550's. Unfortunately I am not one of them.

I do believe the shim valve adjustments are limited to the 8 valve engines. Yours should be kinder.

[tfb]

GSX -- 16 valve engines -- use screw and locknut to adjust the valve clearances.

Yes, the stator is a 'delta-star' configuration.

From what I know GSX stators are supposed to deliver around 80 volts (AC) when you measure between the phases, ie. total of 3 measurements, as you have done.

So, your figures don't look good.

There are seperate tests for the RR, which you can find on 'The Stator Papers' here on the GSR. Basically you want to check that the diodes in the RR aren't fried (ie. that the unit will rectify the AC coming in, and turn it into DC). You also want to make sure that it regulates, ie. caps the voltage being shoved into your battery at somewhere around 14-15 volts.

Your Haynes manual will be a big help.

[nsbone]

screw and locknut to adjust the valve clearances <= this is a relief!!!

just delta or delta-star winding?

what's the benefit of star, delta, and star-delta? can i interchange them?

BTW, the stator rewind paper VI http://www.thegsresources.com/garage/gs_statorrewind.htm refers to delta connection... so could i follow this method, and convert from star-delta to just delta?

ANyway, since i have one voltage reading out vs the other 2, i am hoping that there's some bad magnet wire mating somewhere, hence i don't have to re-wind...

appreciate for more tips..

Also, i believe i don't have to drain the engine oil to remove the crankcase side cover the gain access the stator coil right? on centre stand?

thanks in advance,
rahman

[tfb]

Ooops, sorry -- I think it's just a STAR winding. My fault for not really being up on the terminology: make sure you check with another lekky-head before proceeding.

But the stators on all GS/GSX bikes are essentially the same... so whatever it says on the stator rewind page will apply to your bike.

You don't have to drain the engine oil IF you lean the RHS of the bike up against a wall, so that the oil drains to the RHS, away from the stator cover. I use a couple of old tyres and a blanket or two to do this, it's easy. Haven't put a scratch on the bike yet.

[Boondocks]

OEM stators use the wye (star) configuration. Delta windings as described in the Stator Papers are not a stock configuration. The wye winding will provide higher voltage at lower engine speeds, and a delta winding will provide greater current at higher engine speeds. There is no hybrid star-delta configuration available for GS bikes or any other motorcyle to my knowledge.

See my post at Stator Windings for more detailed information on the relative advantages of each type. I would rewind a stator in the OEM wye (star) configuration, using the heaviest wire that would allow acceptable voltage output. See the wye configuration rewinding done by Nerobro in the referenced link.

You don't have to drain the engine oil to access the stator, not much will be lost if the bike is on the center stand. If you can safely lean the bike slightly to the right side against a wall or other brace, no oil will be lost.

[nsbone]

Hi Phil,
Thanks for the pointer to your post on the subject... Very Very informative.

Since one of the 3 readings is different (less than 120V AC), then i'd imagine my stator is wound as Delta. If i do the rewind, i'd do Star as it is stock... probably i just locate the bad joint, and resolder or something...

Yup, managed to remove the stator/crankcase cover too on the center stand! Great guys, thanks for the tips.... but i ripped the gasket... hmmm... probably i just use one of those silicone tooth paste type gasket...

Cheers,
rahman

[Boondocks]

Hi Phil,
Thanks for the pointer to your post on the subject... Very Very informative.

Since one of the 3 readings is different (less than 120V AC), then i'd imagine my stator is wound as Delta. If i do the rewind, i'd do Star as it is stock... probably i just locate the bad joint, and resolder or something...

Yup, managed to remove the stator/crankcase cover too on the center stand! Great guys, thanks for the tips.... but i ripped the gasket... hmmm... probably i just use one of those silicone tooth paste type gasket...

Cheers,
rahman

Your stator is most likely a normal wye (star) wound one. The illustrations using 120VAC are examples of U.S.A. household voltage, not motorcycle stator voltage. Most GS motorcycle OEM stators are rated at 80VAC at 5,000 RPM when disconnected from the R/R. Aftermarket stators may be wound differently and be rated as low at 50VAC at 5,000 RPM. The important consideration is that all three legs should put out the same voltage. If the voltage of one leg is lower than the other two, the stator should be replaced.

[7th day]

Schematic

I have a charging system schematic I can send to anyone interested. It's too large to attach here.

[Wheelie]

Rahman,

Please do not use silicone "toothpaste" gasket! This material will eventually get in your engine and mess things up. Purchase an original type gasket. If you cannot get the proper gasket, you can use the same type of sealant that is used for the case halves.

Say no to Silicone!!

Steve

[nsbone]

OK. I just sent the coil to electrical shop... he is charging me about RM100, which is about US$30.. so, i just giving it a try.. plus i don't have time to do rewinding my self at this moment..

I'll cut paper gasket with same shape for the gasket.. it's pretty thin gasket material the have there.. Actually i am tempted to use just a threebond gasket sealant..

[SqDancerLynn1]

Get a thin sheet of gasket material & make a gasket!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The .020 gasket thickness IS IMPORTANT to the starter idler gear

[nsbone]

Hi,

Now, the stator was re-wound by the electrician shop... and got it fixed back to the stator side cover.

check all voltage seems out put off the stator output, all good around 60V or so...

connect to the R/R and measure the battery voltage, but it's around 12V even with revving to 4K or 5K rpm...

after a while, the R/R and stator yellow wire got hot..

i guess.. i need a new R/R.

what do ya all think?

tia,
rahman