I give up!

[Nessism]

I agree! Take the cams and plugs out, you will need to hold the cam chain up with your hand but the engine should turn over quite easily.

[Busafied]

What you recommend I do?
1.take the engine aprt again and stop when I see something wrong?
2/How other than seeing something bent will I know what is wrong?
3.Take it aprt like take the head off,see if it turns over freely at that point.If it doesnt then what?
4.If it does then take the block off and see if it turs over freely then what?
5.teach me,advise me please.
Forward Message

baby steps, take a breath, slow down.. then lets try some things.

Ron, pull the plugs, and cams back out-

Use 2 zip ties to hold the cam chain up, ties them around the middle chassis bar that goes under the gas tank, DO NOT make the too tight~ or the chain cannot freely slip over them, too loose and it will kink under the crank.

Now-

1) Attempt to turn over the motor with your wrench by hand/ atleast 2 revolutions forward and backwards-

1a) was it easy?
1b) feel any tight spots?

One thing that comes to mind, and bothers me, because I have done it before....

When you say the last 1" or so of the cylinder didn't want to go back easily...so you used a block of wood to get it on.

I have had two issues cause that scenario-

A) Trash / was in the Cylinder bolt holes & casued me to have force it down the bolts..

B) Caught the Cylinder on one of my Piston rings. It broke off my lower ring on 1 piston, causing the dragging of the piston when turning it over ...
"Binding it against the cylinder wall..

It does happen-

If you had a Scope, you could send it down each spark plug hole & view the cylinders for drag marks from a broken ring..

Anyways, if you have a tight spot w/o any binding on the cam chain , & your clutch basket if free in neutral, then you will need to pull the head IMHO-

Get back to us-

GL,
Ron

[ron bayless]

i hope to not have to pull the head off.If you have to get the block down by tapping it the last inch or so you would have been far below the rings by then because they are at the top of each piston.I think my whole issue of not turning over good is the cam chain is in a bind.I followed the instructions in the clymer manual but I found out both from chef and nessism that that is not right.I put the tensioner on after i had both cams in time and the cam caps secured tightly.I should have just done the exhaust cam,then the tensioner, the intake cam.That is what i will do next.I appreciate your input.

[Nessism]

i hope to not have to pull the head off.If you have to get the block down by tapping it the last inch or so you would have been far below the rings by then because they are at the top of each piston.I think my whole issue of not turning over good is the cam chain is in a bind.I followed the instructions in the clymer manual but I found out both from chef and nessism that that is not right.I put the tensioner on after i had both cams in time and the cam caps secured tightly.I should have just done the exhaust cam,then the tensioner, the intake cam.That is what i will do next.I appreciate your input.

The tensioner needs to have the plunger pushed back in and the lock nut set before you install it to the head. It doesn't matter when you install it but you don't want to let go of the plunger locknut to remove slack from the chain until both cams are installed.

Pull up on the cam chain in the front to remove the slack and install the exhaust cam. The service manual calls for clamping down on the cam with vice grips to get it to seat down so you can install the caps. After getting the exhaust cam properly positioned, go for the intake. Last thing to do after both cams are installed is release the locknut on the tensioner.

[Suzuki mad]

When I did the GS(X) the barrels needed extra help to go down onto the crank cases. The rear cam chain tensioner was catching in the chain tunnel.

Head gasket on and I put the cylinder head on. Torqued the head up and then the exhaust cam went in. No problem. Doing up the cam caps the socket went down the cam chain tunnel. Fished that out.
Inlet cam on and bolted down so I turned the engine over to check that it was all OK. I'd forgot to install the cam chain tensioner. The chain jumped several teeth so when I came back to the correct timing marks I was out by several teeth.
Next time round I had a kink in the chain on the crank end, forgot to keep the chain tight and I put the inlet cam in first!
Next time I removed the inlet cams chain cog and that didn't work either.

I then found that when I had placed the front chain guide in place I had missed its bottom locating hole so it was locating in the chain.

All the info sounds good these guy's are posting. You're not the first with this sort of problem as these guy's can testify too, expecially from there experience.

With the plugs out and a 19mm socket on the signal generator/points side you should be able to turn the rebuilt engine easily.

Just a thought, did you spread some oil the bore's before installing the pistons?

Keep going M8.

Suzuki mad.

[ron bayless]

When I did the GS(X) the barrels needed extra help to go down onto the crank cases. The rear cam chain tensioner was catching in the chain tunnel.

Head gasket on and I put the cylinder head on. Torqued the head up and then the exhaust cam went in. No problem. Doing up the cam caps the socket went down the cam chain tunnel. Fished that out.
Inlet cam on and bolted down so I turned the engine over to check that it was all OK. I'd forgot to install the cam chain tensioner. The chain jumped several teeth so when I came back to the correct timing marks I was out by several teeth.
Next time round I had a kink in the chain on the crank end, forgot to keep the chain tight and I put the inlet cam in first!
Next time I removed the inlet cams chain cog and that didn't work either.

I then found that when I had placed the front chain guide in place I had missed its bottom locating hole so it was locating in the chain.

All the info sounds good these guy's are posting. You're not the first with this sort of problem as these guy's can testify too, expecially from there experience.

With the plugs out and a 19mm socket on the signal generator/points side you should be able to turn the rebuilt engine easily.

Just a thought, did you spread some oil the bore's before installing the pistons?

Keep going M8.

Suzuki mad.

NO I DIDNT POUR ANY OIL IN AND NOW DONT KNOW HOW I COULD GET SOME DOWN THERE.bUT,i AM HOPING SINCE I HAVE THE VALVE COVER OFF I could pour some over all the head and cam jounal valleys and maybe some would get down into the bores that way.

[ron bayless]

The tensioner needs to have the plunger pushed back in and the lock nut set before you install it to the head. It doesn't matter when you install it but you don't want to let go of the plunger locknut to remove slack from the chain until both cams are installed.

Pull up on the cam chain in the front to remove the slack and install the exhaust cam. The service manual calls for clamping down on the cam with vice grips to get it to seat down so you can install the caps. After getting the exhaust cam properly positioned, go for the intake. Last thing to do after both cams are installed is release the locknut on the tensioner.

Yes, that clamping down tip you gave me made the impossible possible.It is impossible to tighten down 4 cam caps,hold the cam in place and push down on the tappets all at the same time.The clamping procedure lets you have both hands free.Great thing to know.

[Suzuki mad]

Oiling bore's.

NO I DIDNT POUR ANY OIL IN AND NOW DONT KNOW HOW I COULD GET SOME DOWN THERE.bUT,i AM HOPING SINCE I HAVE THE VALVE COVER OFF I could pour some over all the head and cam jounal valleys and maybe some would get down into the bores that way.

I was only asking if you had put some lubrictaion to the bores where the rings will run. It would aid the movement prior to the oil pump pushing oil around the engine.

Suzuki mad

[ron bayless]

I was only asking if you had put some lubrictaion to the bores where the rings will run. It would aid the movement prior to the oil pump pushing oil around the engine.

Suzuki mad

PLEASE excuse the capital letters.I was not yelling.I am at work(dont tell anybody) and we use all capital letters here.I forget to unlock the keys sometimes.I appreciate your input.

[robertbarr]

The tensioner needs to have the plunger pushed back in and the lock nut set before you install it to the head. .

It's my theory that omitting this was what started all of this.

That tensioner shaft just doesn't back out, and installing it (without locking the plunger back) forces the slipper against the chain with much more force than it would ever exert in normal operation. You don't notice this force because there's very little 'feedback' when you tighten up the tensioner mounting bolts.

[omaharj]

I have nothing technical to add. I'm just thankful I'm not strong enough to pick a GS up and throw it at a wall because I'm sure I've been frustrated enough to do it. I admire your tenacity and I'm sure you'll get it figured out. What a success story that'll be! Keep plugging away! Those of us with less knowledge are pulling for you too.

[ron bayless]

It's my theory that omitting this was what started all of this.

That tensioner shaft just doesn't back out, and installing it (without locking the plunger back) forces the slipper against the chain with much more force than it would ever exert in normal operation. You don't notice this force because there's very little 'feedback' when you tighten up the tensioner mounting bolts.

i agree with you.I only recently fund out you can make the spring tithten up even more by rotating the knurled knob counterclockwise.I am going to try it both ways,put the tensioner in in a fully "cocked-unreleased" position and then the intake cam, and then if that doesnt work have both cams on then put the tensioner on in a fully cocked position.I would say if the engine turns over faster with the tensioner spring fully compressed then that was the problem.I am not going what to do if one of those trials doesnt work.

[ron bayless]

I have nothing technical to add. I'm just thankful I'm not strong enough to pick a GS up and throw it at a wall because I'm sure I've been frustrated enough to do it. I admire your tenacity and I'm sure you'll get it figured out. What a success story that'll be! Keep plugging away! Those of us with less knowledge are pulling for you too.

Thanks man.I would like to have another gs 1000 or 1100 to work on and fix just for the satisfaction of doing it.But not my daily rider like this one is.I will really be so happy and proud of myself when i can post here that i got it started.I bet i could start from scratch and in an hour and a half have it tore down t0 the lower crankcase now.I have never worked on a motorcycle engine before in my life.This has been a pain in the ass,but i am looking forward to success.

[MelodicMetalGod]

Just a bit of encouragement...

Sounds like you've got a challenge and a puzzle. Just remember, there's lot's of puzzle solvers on this site and they love to lend a hand.

I just got my bike back on the road for the first time since I bought it and after two months of having it in bits around the garage.

1985 GS550ES - Free - Gifted from uncle (lucky me!)
Air Filter - $20
Spark Plugs - $20
New Tools - $300-$400
Set of "parts" carbs - $60
Getting it back together and taking that first test ride around the block and realizing that you've made the bike better than when you received it with your own hands - Now THAT is priceless.

Anything that comes easy is usually not appreciated and Anything worth having is worth working for.

Stay the course, man! I'll be rootin' for ya.

[ron bayless]

Anything that comes easy is usually not appreciated and Anything worth having is worth working for.



Yep,i agree with you.grease in my sink,fight with wife,having her willingly help me....priceless.