synthetic oil

[dadgummit]

I have heard in the past not to use synthetic oil in bikes because it would mess up the clutch? Is this true? The bike in question is an 82 gs650. Thanks.

[scotty]

oh oh:-D-------------------------

[distraction628]

DO A SEARCH<<<<<THIS HAS BEEN COVERED SO MANY TIMES!!!
BTW I only run Synthetic AmsOil 10/40

[Nessism]

I have heard in the past not to use synthetic oil in bikes because it would mess up the clutch? Is this true? The bike in question is an 82 gs650. Thanks.

No NOT true. Synthetic oil is not more "slippery" than regular oil, it just lasts longer and hold up to killer high heat better. The oils that are bad for wet clutches are those that have the "energy star" rating which means they have "friction modifiers" (what ever that means). These energy conserving oils are almost exclusively limited to lighter weight oils like 5W-30 and the like so you don't need to concern yourself since GS engines should be run on thicker oils (Suzuki lists 10W-40 as the recommended default oil).

[dadgummit]

sore subject huh? I'll do a search I'm just lazy.

[KGB]

No not true.

I have a wet clutch in my Triumph.
Almost 20,000 miles no problems with only synth oil.

It's the energy star types that cause us problems.

[KGB]

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?p=693185&posted=1#post693185

[N56629]

No NOT true. Synthetic oil is not more "slippery" than regular oil, it just lasts longer and hold up to killer high heat better. The oils that are bad for wet clutches are those that have the "energy star" rating which means they have "friction modifiers" (what ever that means). These energy conserving oils are almost exclusively limited to lighter weight oils like 5W-30 and the like so you don't need to concern yourself since GS engines should be run on thicker oils (Suzuki lists 10W-40 as the recommended default oil).

"Friction modifiers" are primarily used in limited slip differentials (rear ends.) The energy savings comes from using the lighter oils 5w-20 vs. 10w-30 etc. Most new engines use closer tolerances which allow them to work with a thinner film of oil. Some of today's cars can run on Ow-20.

If you want to run synthetic, stick with the 10w-40 or even 20w-50 in older engines or hotter weather. You will still realize a slightly better mileage increase and added engine protection.

The molecular structure of synthetics is more uniform and this is one of the things that give better lubricating characteristics (read slippery.)

[Nessism]

"Friction modifiers" are primarily used in limited slip differentials (rear ends.) The energy savings comes from using the lighter oils 5w-20 vs. 10w-30 etc. Most new engines use closer tolerances which allow them to work with a thinner film of oil. Some of today's cars can run on Ow-20.

If you want to run synthetic, stick with the 10w-40 or even 20w-50 in older engines or hotter weather. You will still realize a slightly better mileage increase and added engine protection.

The molecular structure of synthetics is more uniform and this is one of the things that give better lubricating characteristics (read slippery.)

I don't think the "energy conserving" label is a result of using low viscosity oil since some oils with the same viscosity have the label and others don't. There is some additive in the oil which allows it to pass some test...and can cause wet clutches to slip. I don't know what kind of additive is involved - I just threw the "friction modifiers" comment in there which with hindsight is not the proper term to use. Thanks for straighting me out on that one.

For more info about "energy conserving" I found the following link on the API web site:

Energy Conserving Designations

The bottom of the donut tells whether the oil has energy conserving properties when compared with a reference oil in an engine test.

Oils labeled as "Energy Conserving" have passed the test that measures an oil's ability to conserve energy. Widespread use of engine oils with this designation should result in an overall saving of fuel in the vehicle fleet as a whole, but a particular vehicle operator may not experience a fuel savings as a result of using these oils.

http://new.api.org/aboutoilgas/motoroil/api-quality-marks.cfm

[N56629]

Nessism, looks like I learned something new. The term "friction modifier" is used in two different ways or directions. The can be used to enhance the ability for clutches to grab (clutches in differentials) or enhance lubrication (slippery) in engines. My only experience was with adding "friction modifiers" to differentials. Live and learn I guess.

What I found so far is that whatever syn oil you use it should be rated JASO MA/MA2. This generally means it has no "friction modifiers." I guess if you are going to go with syn oil you need to do your research.

[Steve]

I use Rotella Synthetic in the BLUE jug in everything but the GS. Not because of any wet clutch issues, but because of a small oil leak. I use the Rotella in my Wing, my son's Yamaha Venture Royale and all my 4-wheeled vehicles. Just to slow down the leak(s) in the GS, I use Castrol 20w-50.

Oh, and I'm not saying that the synthetic oil will cause any leaks, either.
It's just that it's thinner oil and flows easier through the existing leaks.

.

[82Shafty]

I threw Rotella 5-40 syn in my ol GS and she hasn't sprung any leaks and the clutch works the same.

Looks like it will be blue jug for me.

[Steve]

I don't think the "energy conserving" label is a result of using low viscosity oil since some oils with the same viscosity have the label and others don't.

True, not all light-weight oils are "energy conserving", but I have never seen any "EC" oils thicker than 10w-30. If you use ANYTHINGw-40 and above, you should be OK. This includes 10w-40, 20w-50 (dino oils), 5w-40, 15w-40 (synthetics) and other, thicker stuff.


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