Maybe it's not the clutch after all

[john S]

About a month ago I posted a thread asking where to get Suzuki GS 850G clutch parts. I recieved a lot of help, thanks. Among the responses I got was that the springs were probably weak and to check the spring and plate specs. The plates were in spec (if I was reading the mike correctly) the springs weren't. I ordered new springs which were longer (1/16" to 1/8" or so) there was no sign or smell of burnt friction plates. However the cogs on the friction plates showed signs of scraping possibly from the weak springs. I've linked to a couple of photos showing the cog wear and the mike reading on a friction plate. However I'm not sure the problem here is in just the clutch. The situation was that when I thought the clutch let go it went all at once.(like something broke somewhere). Prior to the loss of power there was no discernable clutch slippage. I was accelerating quickly to enter the freeway, when I hit 2nd gear, popped the clutch, the clutch grabbed then the engine suddenly did a free rev. However there seemed to be some clutch left that enabled me to maintain some momentum to go about a mile further along the berm to get off at the next exit. After exiting the freeway each time I slowed I was unable to pick up any speed due to what I thought was clutch slippage so I finally stopped and pushed the bike the final 1.5 mi to work (at 5:30am) Anyway after replacing the springs the net result was that there was still no connection from the engine to the rear wheel, another words when I turned the rear wheel with the bike in gear the engine was not turning over. On a whim I went over to the driveshaft to see if it was turning which it was, I clamped my hand down by the front boot and could feel the driveshaft knuckle turning. When I clamped my hand tighter around the front knuckle the drive shaft quit turning even though I was still turning the rear wheel. I would have thought since the driveshaft is a direct connection to the rear drive it should forcibly turn if the rear wheel is turning. the final drive is turning the driveshaft untill there is any load and then the driveshaft will quit turning even though the wheel is still turning. Please excuse my ingorance and correct me if I'm worng. but as I said before I think as long as the rear wheel is turning the driveshaft should keep turning also and any disengagement of the drive shaft would take place at the transmission. I can't figure what would allow the driveshaft to turn some and then quit turning when a load is placed on the assembly. About 5 years ago I had the driveshaft and swingarm disassembled when the rear driveshaft tube weld failed. I would think if I did something wrong in re-assembling the driveshaft/swingarm it wouldn't have lasted 5 years. I wouldn't think any of the splines would strip out at the propeller shaft and drivegear couplings. I don't run the bike that hard. Just trying to get an indication of what the problem might be before I start disassembling the rear of the bike. Any ideas??

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/Harley1/Clutch-Plate-scrape.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/Harley1/Clutch-plate-spec.jpg

[chef1366]

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/search.php?searchid=633267

[BassCliff]

Hi Mr. john S,

I sounds like you may need a new spline in your rear wheel hub. Hopefully it's not the final drive unit itself. Look on page 12 of my "Rear Wheel Removal" guide here.

Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

[SqDancerLynn1]

You got bit by those pesky wheel splines. Easy fix

[john S]

Thanks for the link, I checked it out. Never thought to check those splines when I had it apart before. It always concerns me when anything goes wrong with such an old bike because many parts for it are hard to find.

[john S]

I feel really bad that I never greased those splines I've had that wheel off a few times....rats!!

[JayH]

Thanks for the link, I checked it out. Never thought to check those splines when I had it apart before. It always concerns me when anything goes wrong with such an old bike because many parts for it are hard to find.

That is an even better reason to maintain it better. You should still be able to get new rear wheel splines from Suzuki.

Honda moly lube paste is good stuff to use on the splines. At a minimum you should clean and lube the splines when you replace the rear tire.

[john S]

Well, I took off the rear wheel today. What I found was not good. When I first looked at the hub I saw the splines, then I looked at the final drive and saw there were splines there. I got down and eyeballed the wheel splines and almost fell over from shock, aside from a tiny portion of the splines remaining on the outer part of the hub the rest of the splines were Gone. My second reaction was, at least it's the wheel hub splines. Looking at the final drive splines I could see they were still there. It was hard to see how worn they were so I got my camera and took a close up "macro" shot. Unfortunately, the close up photo revealed very worn splines on the final drive. I guess that would be expected since the hub splines were completely ground away. With new hub splines the bike may be driveable, but who knows for how long. I would be afraid to take a trip on it with those worn final drive splines. Since I had regulated the Suzuki as my daily rain or shine drive to work bike and I only live a few miles from work I would probably be ok with that. I will try to get the hub spline plate from my local Suzuki dealer put it back together and see what happens. After that I have to decide what I want to do for the long term. I probably will look to pick up another final drive (lots of luck with that) or possibly look for a parts bike. I did know someone who had an 82 GS850GL who is unable to ride anymore maybe he still has it. Tomorrow I will post the gruesome photos of the hub and final drive splines.
You know I have had my 82 GS850G since new and in all these years I have never wound it out. I have to wonder how long those splines would have lasted by someone who was regularly hotrodding their bike. Considering having the final drive rebuilt is probably not an option. The dealers around here won't work on a bike more than 10 years old.

[Nessism]

Rear ends are common on ebay for pretty reasonable prices. Wheel splines are still available from the dealer but from what I hear, the '79 and '80 splines are the ones to get since they are made from a harder material.

http://motors.shop.ebay.com/_Motorcycle-Parts-Accessories__gs850-final-drive_W0QQMake247a0eZSuzuki944c335bQQ_nkwZgs850Q20finalQ20driveQQ_fxdZ1QQ_ptasZ1

Good luck.

[Steve]

If I recall correctly, bwringer had a post some time ago saying that the current splines used in the Intruder and Volusia lines are the same splines.
They look a bit different, evidently they have 'improved' them again.

[john S]

Here is a shot of the Drive splines, very worn probably unservicable.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v128/Harley1/Driven-Hub-wear.jpg

Thanks Nessism for the link. I've already seen a few rear ends on ebay. I hate to spend the money on a new driven plate and put it in with the current rear end. It would probably end up ruining the new driven plate. This bike is definately gonna be put back together because I don't ever plan on getting rid of it or parting it out. Since I've had this bike since new it has a lot of sentimental value.

[chef1366]

Where are you at in NE Ohio? I'm from the Canton-Akron area. (Canal Fulton)

[john S]

Cleveland, West Side.

[Nessism]

Little hard to tell but those splines don't look all that bad. Not sure though.

BTW, where on the West Side? I lived in Lorain out by Amherst for 8 years and miss the area quite a bit this time of year.

[chef1366]

Little hard to tell but those splines don't look all that bad. Not sure though.

BTW, where on the West Side? I lived in Lorain out by Amherst for 8 years and miss the area quite a bit this time of year.

I didn't know you were an Ohio boy Ed.