Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

"Flutter" at approx. 3000 RPM. What's up?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    "Flutter" at approx. 3000 RPM. What's up?

    Bike: 1979 GS1000L, 2 valves per cylinder, w/ 28k miles, compression 135 to 140 lbs on all cylinders.

    Story: Late this past winter, the valve clearances were checked, only 1 of 8 needed any adjustment, the original points-type ignition was removed, a used electronic ignition from a later-model GS was installed, the timing was set and double checked, new plugs were installed (twice), the gas tank was flushed/etched at a radiator shop, an in-line fuel filter was installed, the carbs were pulled off the bike (twice) and were inspected, cleaned, blown out with compressed air, adjusted, and synchronized with mercury sticks. (In the process, #3 carb was found to be trashed beyond repair and was replaced with a clean, functional, used carb from another bike, the float height settings and fuel and air adjustment screw settings were found to be way off and were adjusted, the needles and seats and O-rings were inspected and found to be OK, and the whole kit and kaboodle was put back together and the bike was ridden for 200 miles by the mechanic (I told him "Pretend it's your bike and ride it around for while"), before being turned over to me.

    Current Situation: Certainly, the bike is much, much better than before. However, after the 200 miles with the mechanic, and another 100 or so with me, the plug in cylinder #4 is black, and the other 3 plugs are 3 different shades running from tan-to-brown. The bike seems to "flutter" at engine speeds in the range of 2800 to 3400 RPM, which is where I seem to ride about 80% of the time. The flutter goes away above about 3500 RPM and the bike runs strong at higher RPM. Trouble is, I ride around 3000 RPM most of the time.

    Any ideas what might be wrong? (I'm on good terms with the mechanic, who is puzzled too, and said he'd get it right, no hard feelings, and said although he checked the needles and they looked OK, maybe it's the needles. He also said that the rear wheel sprocket hub might have some play in it which might explain the flutter. That could be, but that doesn't explain the different spark plug colors.

    Is it unreasonable for me to expect a smooth-running bike, on a bike almost 25-years old (but with "only" 28k miles), or to expect 4 cylinders/carb/spark plugs to be all all running the same, and showing the same color on all 4 plugs after a few hundred miles?

    #2
    Brion, two things come to mind. You may have a bad spark plug cap on #4.
    If the electronic ignition retains the original mechanical advance mechanism, the advance may be sticking intermittantly.

    Earl
    Komorebi-The light filtering through the trees.

    I would rather sit on a pumpkin and have it all to myself than be crowded on a velvet cushion. H.D.T.

    Comment


      #3
      Check the plugs, caps, advance etx. If it is fluttering around 3000rpm that is the range where the pilot/carb slide and needles overlap, so make sure pilot mixtures are set right, jet passage clear and needles all the same settings. The standard carbs are fiddly to set up on the pilots due to the fuel and air mixture screws on the pilot circuit - I used a colortune device to set mine, showed up faults and mixtures very quickly.

      Do a check at higher load/revs to see wheter the mixtures are more consistent on the main jets. Then synch the carbs.

      I have a 78 GS1000 with 146,000kms on it that runs well, so no reason wy yours will not!

      Comment


        #4
        #2 carb normally is used as the base, as it has no direct means of adjustment.

        It seems reasonable to believe your mechanic followed this basic procedure.

        Since you still have a problem try this:

        Manually re-set the carbs, using #3 as your base, instead of #2.

        This is done with the carbs off the bike.

        Once the carbs are off, and before adjusting anything , be sure you back off the idle screw entirely. It must be free of all contact.

        After the manual/visual set-up is done, and the carbs re-installed, start the engine and work backwards with the 'manometer until all are balanced.
        Bertrand Russell: 'Men are born ignorant, not stupid. They are made stupid by education.'

        Comment


          #5
          Thanks guys,

          As usual, you are a wealth of precious GS advice. I'm going to print this thread and mail it to the guy who is working on my bike. Not just because he will read this, but because it is really true: He is a great guy, he has been very good to me, and he is very familiar with GS bikes. Between him and his girlfriend I believe he's always got at least 3 GS bikes registered and on the road, and another 2 or 3 parts bikes, and boxes and shelves full of GS stuff in his garage. He's taken a GS 850 to Alaska (from Massachusetts) and has been cross-country on his 850 (or maybe his 1100, I forget which) TOWING A CANOE! I've seen the pictures, it's true!

          Anyway, one final question: What is a colortune device?

          Well, maybe one more question: Any other bright ideas to turn my old slightly rough-running GS into a smooth-purring kitty at around 3000 RPMs?

          Thanks again.

          Comment


            #6
            A colortune screws into the sparkplg hole. It has a clear top on it so you can see the colour of the combustion chamber of a cylinder. The colour tells you lean, rich etc. It basically does the job of a gas analyser but in a visual way. It can tell you what a mixture is doing over particular throttle ranges. It is not supposed to be used under load conditions.

            For example, when I id up my bike I was able to deduce that the pilot jet needed chnaging as the mixture was not consistently right whatever I did with the pilot screw.

            Comment


              #7
              A colortune screws into the sparkplg hole. It has a clear top on it so you can see the colour of the combustion chamber of a cylinder. The colour tells you lean, rich etc. It basically does the job of a gas analyser but in a visual way. It can tell you what a mixture is doing over particular throttle ranges. It is not supposed to be used under load conditions.

              For example, when I id up my bike I was able to deduce that the pilot jet needed chnaging as the mixture was not consistently right whatever I did with the pilot screw.

              Comment


                #8
                A colortune screws into the sparkplg hole. It has a clear top on it so you can see the colour of the combustion chamber of a cylinder. The colour tells you lean, rich etc. It basically does the job of a gas analyser but in a visual way. It can tell you what a mixture is doing over particular throttle ranges. It is not supposed to be used under load conditions.

                For example, when I id up my bike I was able to deduce that the pilot jet needed chnaging as the mixture was not consistently right whatever I did with the pilot screw.

                Comment


                  #9
                  What's a colortone again?
                  Currently bikeless
                  '81 GS 1100EX - "Peace, by superior fire power."
                  '06 FZ1000 - "What we are dealing with here, is a COMPLETE lack of respect for the law."

                  I ride, therefore I am.... constantly buying new tires.

                  "Tell me what kind of an accident you are going to have, and I will tell you which helmet to wear." - Harry Hurt

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I think Hap also had that problem a while back, didn't he? He had a problem with "fluttering" at high speeds. In his case, I think the problem was due to a loose-fitting thong.
                    Frosty (falsely accused of "Thread-Hijacking"!)
                    "Make it idiot proof and someone will make a better idiot."

                    Owner of:
                    1982 GS1100E
                    1995 Triumph Daytona 1200

                    Comment

                    Working...
                    X