Front Running Lights on 850G?

[Toy3zve]

I'm in the process of converting my '81 850G from a Windjammer fairing to a windshield. I've got most of the parts in (headlight bucket, turn signals, ears, bolts, etc.), now I'm just waiting on a couple of misc. mounting bolts. But I have noticed that the turn signals are two-wire, not three. The turn signals in the Windjammer doubled as running lights. I was wondering if the stock, turn-signal equipped 850/1000G bikes ('80/'81 vintage) had front running lights or not.

Thanks...

[Dave8338]

No sir...just the blinkies!

Welcome the the GSR...best Suzie site in the world (GS related), great people and a few even know what they're talking about.

[Tracer]

Good question, and I am in the process of learning what is and isn't wired for running lights & turn signals.

My 81 GS1000GL that I bought this summer came with front turn signals that were also wired as running lights (3 wire, if you include ground). However, it was clear that they must have been added by someone, because the connections in the light bucket were aftermarket (wiring nuts ).

I disconnected them and moved them to the back so I could have running lights and turn signals in the back, and because the stock location of the front signals was in the way of my windscreen. Up front I put Harley turn signals on the handlebars and I've wired them for running lights and turn signals too.

In my Clymers manual, the wiring diagrams indicate that running lights up front were not stock on my bike, but were the next year ('82) I think. However, if you go the parts schematics for the 1981 GS1000GL(X) model at www.crotchrocket.com and www.bikemandit.com, it shows that front turn signals are set up as running lights too and have 3 wires including ground.

So as far as my 81 GS is concerned, I don't know what the right answer is. But I also know you can convert turn signals to running lights too if you want, either by your own scrounging or stock replacement parts you can buy online.

Good luck

[bwringer]

As I understand it, only the later models ('82+ or '83+) had running lights.

Here's my '83:


Those aren't the stock signals (I removed a ratty Vetter, and had to replace them), but they're wired the same.

[BassCliff]

Greetings and Salutations!

Hi Mr. Toy3zve,

You'll have to install some three-wire blinkers if you want running lights too. I'm thinking of doing that for my '80 850G. Feel free to visit my website (link below) for lots of 850G lovin'. Here's your mega-welcome!


Let it be known that on this day you are cordially and formally welcomed to the GSR Forum as a Junior Member in good standing with all the rights and privileges thereof. Further let it be known that your good standing can be improved with pictures (not you, your bike)!

Perhaps you've already seen these, but I like to remind all the new members. In addition to the carb rebuild series, I recommend visiting the In The Garage section via the GSR Homepage and check out the Stator Papers. There's also a lot of great information in the Old Q&A section. I have some documentation on my little BikeCliff website to help get you familiar with doing routine maintenance tasks (note that it is 850G-specific but many tasks are common to all GS bikes). Other "user contributed" informational sites include those of Mr. bwringer, Mr. tfb and Mr. robertbarr. And if your bike uses shims for valve adjustments, send an email to Mr. Steve requesting a copy of his Excel spreadsheet that helps you keep track of clearances, shim sizes and other service work.

These are some edited quotes from one of our dear beloved gurus, Mr. bwringer, with ideas on basic needs (depending on initial condition), parts, and accessories.

***********Quoted from Mr. bwringer************
Every GS850 [and most other models] has (or had) a set of well-known issues that MUST be addressed before you have a solid baseline for further troubleshooting. It's a vintage bike, and it's quite common (as in, every single GS850 I have had contact with) that there are multiple problems that have crept up and slowly gotten worse over the years. It's not like a newer vehicle, where there's generally one problem at a time.

These common issues are:

1. Intake O-rings (install NEW OEM or Viton only - common nitrile O-rings will quickly deteriorate from heat)
2. Intake Boots (install NEW -- these cannot be repaired)
3. Valve clearances (more important than most people think)
4. Carb/airbox boots
5. Airbox sealing
6. Air filter sealing
7. Petcock (install a NEW one)
8. On '79 models, install new points or Dyna electronic ignition (or at least verify that the old points are working correctly)
9. On all models, it's fairly common to have problems with the spark plug caps. These are $3 or $4 each, and often worth replacing if you're keeping the stock coils/wires.
10. Stock exhaust with NO leaks or holes -- good seals at the head and at the junctions underneath.

Carburetor maintenance:

Replace the intake boot o-rings, and possibly the intake boots. Here's the procedure:

http://bwringer.com/gs/intakeorings.html

Here's an overview of what happens with this particular problem:

http://cycleorings.com/intake.html

You'll also want to examine the boots between the carbs and the airbox. There's a good chance these are OK, but check them over.
And finally, if things still aren't exactly right, you'll want to order a set of o-rings for BS carbs from the GS owner's best friend, Robert Barr:

http://cycleorings.com

Once you receive these rare rings of delight, then you'll want to thoroughly clean and rebuild your carburetors. Here are step-by-step instructions that make this simple:

http://thegsresources.com/gs_carbrebuild.htm

OEM Parts/Online Fiches:

I would definitely double and triple the recommendations to use Cycle Recycle II and Z1 Enterprises as much as possible. These guys are priceless resources. Z1 tends to have slightly better prices, CRC2 has a wider range of goodies available. If you're near Indy and can bring in an old part to match, CRC2 has a vast inventory of used parts.
http://denniskirk.com - Put in your bike model and see what they have.
http://oldbikebarn.com - seems to be slowly regaining a decent reputation, but it's still caveat emptor. They don't have anything you can't get elsewhere at a better price anyway.
http://www.babbittsonline.com/ - Decent parts prices. Spendy shipping. Don't give you part numbers at all. Useful cross-reference if you obtain a part number elsewhere. Efficient service.
http://bikebandit.com - Fastest. Middlin' prices. Uses their own parts numbering system to obfuscate price comparisons -- can be very confusing for large orders. Cheapest shipping, so total cost usually isn't too bad.
http://flatoutmotorcycles.com - Slow. Cheapest parts prices, crazy shipping costs. Don't expect progress updates or much communication. Real Suzuki part numbers.
http://alpha-sports.com - Exorbitant parts prices. Different type of fiche interface that's quite useful at times, especially with superceded part numbers. Real parts numbers. Shipping cost and speed unknown due to insane, unholy pricing.

Stainless Bolts, Viton o-rings, metric taps, dies, assorted hard-to-find supplies and materials, etc:

http://mcmaster.com - Fast, cheap shipping, good prices. No order minimum, but many items like bolts come in packs of 25 or 50. Excellent resource.
http://motorcycleseatcovers.com - Great quality, perfect fit (on original seat foam), and available for pretty much every bike ever made. Avoid the textured vinyl -- it's perforated.
http://newenough.com - You DO have riding gear, don't you? Great clearances, always outstanding prices and impeccable service.
***************End Quote**********************

Additional parts/info links:

GSR Forum member Mr. duaneage has great used upgraded Honda regulator/rectifiers for our bikes. Send him a PM.
New electrical parts:
http://stores.ebay.com/RMSTATOR or http://www.rmstator.com/

http://www.ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/index.php

http://www.electrosport.com/

For valve cover and breather gaskets, I recommend Real Gaskets (reusable silicon):

http://www.realgaskets.com

Carolina Cycle

http://www.carolinacycle.com

Ron Ayers Motorsports

http://www.ronayers.com

MR Cycles

http://www.mrcycles.com

Moto Grid

http://www.motogrid.com

Salvage/Used

http://www.ricepaddymotorcycles.com

http://www.ozpowersports.com/

If all else fails, try this:

http://www.used-motorcycle-parts.org/

Used bike buying checklists:

http://www.amadirectlink.com/roadride/Riderresc/checklist.asp

http://www.clarity.net/~adam/buying-bike.html

Lots of good info/pictures here:

http://www.suzukicycles.org

http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/Motorcycle_Wiki

http://www.bikepics.com
Basic motorcycle maintenance/repair:
http://www.dansmc.com/mc_repaircourse.htm
Online Clymer manuals:
http://search.ebscohost.com/ Click on "Small Engine Repair" then "Motorcycles". User=library, password=library. Note: This link may not work if you are on a school campus.


Thanks for joining us. Keep us informed of your progress. There's lots of good folk with good experience here.


Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff
(The unofficial GSR greeter)

Click here to visit BikeCliff's website.

[Steve]

Rather than count the wires, take a bulb out and look at the contacts.

I have some signal housings that only have two wires coming out of them, but they have running lights, too. The ground wire attaches via a large ring terminal around the mounting stem. The two wires coming through the stem are both hot wires, one for running lights, the other for the signal.

.

[BassCliff]

Rather than count the wires, take a bulb out and look at the contacts.

I have some signal housings that only have two wires coming out of them, but they have running lights, too. The ground wire attaches via a large ring terminal around the mounting stem. The two wires coming through the stem are both hot wires, one for running lights, the other for the signal.

Oh yeah, there's that kind too. (But that still sounds like a three wire system.) In addition to double contacts in the socket, bulbs with running and blinker lights will have 2 filaments too. Forgive me for picking nits.


Thank you for your indulgence,

BassCliff

[twr1776]

My 81 1000GLX and 83 1100GLD both have running lights. My 82 850GLZ does not. The 81 has a two wire connection. I am not sure about the others.

[Tracer]

Ditto on Steve's and Basscliff's comments.

My stock front signals (that I moved to the back) have two hot wires running from the light socket and through the turn signal housing, and they use bulbs with two contact points and filaments. The ground wire attaches to the end of the turn signal housing where it mounts to the frame, and it then connects with the other ground wires in the harness between the fender and the battery box. The running light leads I spliced into the brown wire that runs to the tail light running light. And the turn signal leads I just plugged back into the harness where they belong (black leads, I think).

For the front signals, which are on my handlebars and are from HD, I had to find at a salvage yard 2 turn signal sockets that had the two contacts in their base, and then move that base with two wires into the sockets on the HD turn signals. (The original HD sockets only had one contact and couldn't serve as running lights.) These salvaged turn signal sockets came from an older (1980s?) Dodge pickup.

The ground wire for these sockets was a ring that sat under the spring in the turn signal's socket. (That's the spring you compress when you push the turn signal bulb into the socket, and then turn it to lock it in place.) This ring was connected to a wire that then ran out the bottom of the light socket, and then to ground. So out of each socket up front, I have three wires coming out of the bottom for the front turn signals.

If anyone's interested, I'll take some pictures and try to post them.

Good luck!

[Tracer]

I should add that my previous bike was a 1981 Honda CB900 Custom with a Hondaline fairing upfront. It had running lights in the turn signals up front too. It also had the running light/turn signal combination in the back I think.

After selling the CB900 and getting the GS1000, I was eager to put some running lights onto it. I figure that the more (tastefully done) lights you have, the safer. I suppose that extra lighting beyond tastful can increase safety too, but then you have light kluge!