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In searching the Technical Forum and "Old Q&A", I have noticed that there are questions and answers that deal with aspects of clutch work but not really a complete set of answers or descriptions of common clutch servicing tasks. Since my 1983 GS750ES now has the fairly common clutch rattle (at idle with clutch lever out, but not with lever pulled in, or at higher rpm's). I have developed a direct interest in the "clutch experience" of our members. Some of the previous answers leave unanswered some fairly basic questions about clutch servicing but even these simple aspects can be daunting to the "clutch newbie". Therefore, I have listed below a series of questions in an attempt to pull all or most of this information into a single thread. I think that it would be a great help to all of us GS owners if those of our members with clutch work experience would contribute their knowledge for the "clutch ignorant" (of whom I am a prominent example). Even if you only have experience or opinions on some of the questions, your selective answers would be of great benefit. So here are the questions (quite a number of them):
1) Do our clutch experts think that the common clutch rattle (described above) is caused by worn/broken rivets and/or damper springs in the clutch basket? Could a worn thrust washer also be to blame?
2) Can clutch work be performed by an owner with average mechanical skills and commonly-available tools?
3) Can the work be performed with the bike on the sidestand without first draining the engine oil? Would you just lose about a quart of oil this way when removing the clutch cover?
4) My service manual mentions using a "special tool" (a "conrod holder", which assumes the top end of the engine is disassembled?) when removing the 4 clutch spring mounting bolts. Is this to stop the clutch assembly rotating? How does one do this without the use of a special tool? What common tool can one use?
5) After removing "the spring, pressure plate, push piece, thrust bearing, drive plate and driven plate", then the "clutch sleeve hub nut and lock washer", my service manual then instructs to remove the "clutch sleeve hub" using another special tool ("clutch sleeve hub holder"). Again, can the clutch sleeve hub be removed without a special tool? Can you just put the bike in gear and have someone stand on the rear brake? Is there a better way?
6) After removing the clutch sleeve hub, and pushing the spacer and bearing backwards, my service manual says the "clutch housing with oil pump drive gear" can be removed. Is this "clutch housing" the "primary driven gear" referred to in many parts diagrams/fiche? Is it also what is commonly called the "clutch basket"?
7) I cannot find a separate part number for the "damper springs" in the clutch basket on BikeBandit.com. Can one just buy the springs, rather than the whole basket?
8 ) Are the springs easy to remove and replace? Is there a special technique or use of a common tool to do this?
9) If the rivets are worn, can they usually be drilled out and replaced? What sort of place can usually do this locally, without having the delay of sending the basket off somewhere to get this done?
10) Is just buying a new basket ($153 from Ron Ayers for my 1983 GS750ES) a reasonable alternative in terms of cost? Would a new basket usually include the damper springs, or are these a separate item normally?
11) While the clutch is apart, would you recommend replacing the metal and friction discs/plates and clutch springs as a routine procedure if the clutch has had over 30,000 miles of use? Any preference for OE Suzuki plates and springs vs. Barnett vs. Vesrah vs. EBC equivalents?
12) Would you also replace the thrust washer as standard routine procedure?
13) When reinstalling the clutch hub, the service manual notes to "check that the rubber damper plug is in position behind the clutch hub". What is this "rubber damper plug"? Does it get worn by use and should it be replaced as standard procedure? I can find no picture showing this part in the manual or on the parts diagrams.
14) Should one use a new tongued/tabbed lock washer when reinstalling the clutch hub and nut?
15) I understand that new friction plates should be left to soak in clean engine oil for a period of time before installing. For what period of time should this be done?
16) I know that the metal and friction plates have to reinstalled in a particular order. Is there any orientation of the individual plates that should be used? I assume that it is a good idea to keep the original "pack" of plates together as a "go by".
17) I note that the clutch spring bolts should be tightened diagonally, and by degrees, to a fairly low torque level (8.0 ? 9.5 lb-ft for my bike). I assume a standard, large torque wrench (17" length. 150lb-ft limit) is too big/inaccurate for this task. Would you recommend getting a smaller torque wrench for this task? Where is a good place to get one and what do they typically cost? I am concerned about this because I assume that even torque on all 4 bolts is important and I am also aware that some members have stripped these bolts or the plate (no names!).
18 ) I assume that a new gasket is usually necessary when replacing the clutch cover. I can't find a part number for this gasket on BikeBandit. Would BikeBandit or Ron Ayers normally carry them, or is this a "dealer only" item?
19) My manual also specifies using "Suzuki Bond No. 1207B" on part of the cover mating surface. I assume this is a gasket cement/compound. Does anyone have a brand of compound they prefer, and where can you usually buy it.
20) Are there any items or "gotcha's" that I have missed, and need a warning here?
21) Finally, how long might the whole clutch servicing job take? Given my painstaking methods, I shall probably multiply any answer by at least 2 or 3!
I know that this is a long list of questions but I think it would be good for our members to have all this information on a single thread. My thanks in advance to our clutch experts who take the time to provide these much needed answers.
Simon Waters
1) Do our clutch experts think that the common clutch rattle (described above) is caused by worn/broken rivets and/or damper springs in the clutch basket? Could a worn thrust washer also be to blame?
2) Can clutch work be performed by an owner with average mechanical skills and commonly-available tools?
3) Can the work be performed with the bike on the sidestand without first draining the engine oil? Would you just lose about a quart of oil this way when removing the clutch cover?
4) My service manual mentions using a "special tool" (a "conrod holder", which assumes the top end of the engine is disassembled?) when removing the 4 clutch spring mounting bolts. Is this to stop the clutch assembly rotating? How does one do this without the use of a special tool? What common tool can one use?
5) After removing "the spring, pressure plate, push piece, thrust bearing, drive plate and driven plate", then the "clutch sleeve hub nut and lock washer", my service manual then instructs to remove the "clutch sleeve hub" using another special tool ("clutch sleeve hub holder"). Again, can the clutch sleeve hub be removed without a special tool? Can you just put the bike in gear and have someone stand on the rear brake? Is there a better way?
6) After removing the clutch sleeve hub, and pushing the spacer and bearing backwards, my service manual says the "clutch housing with oil pump drive gear" can be removed. Is this "clutch housing" the "primary driven gear" referred to in many parts diagrams/fiche? Is it also what is commonly called the "clutch basket"?
7) I cannot find a separate part number for the "damper springs" in the clutch basket on BikeBandit.com. Can one just buy the springs, rather than the whole basket?
8 ) Are the springs easy to remove and replace? Is there a special technique or use of a common tool to do this?
9) If the rivets are worn, can they usually be drilled out and replaced? What sort of place can usually do this locally, without having the delay of sending the basket off somewhere to get this done?
10) Is just buying a new basket ($153 from Ron Ayers for my 1983 GS750ES) a reasonable alternative in terms of cost? Would a new basket usually include the damper springs, or are these a separate item normally?
11) While the clutch is apart, would you recommend replacing the metal and friction discs/plates and clutch springs as a routine procedure if the clutch has had over 30,000 miles of use? Any preference for OE Suzuki plates and springs vs. Barnett vs. Vesrah vs. EBC equivalents?
12) Would you also replace the thrust washer as standard routine procedure?
13) When reinstalling the clutch hub, the service manual notes to "check that the rubber damper plug is in position behind the clutch hub". What is this "rubber damper plug"? Does it get worn by use and should it be replaced as standard procedure? I can find no picture showing this part in the manual or on the parts diagrams.
14) Should one use a new tongued/tabbed lock washer when reinstalling the clutch hub and nut?
15) I understand that new friction plates should be left to soak in clean engine oil for a period of time before installing. For what period of time should this be done?
16) I know that the metal and friction plates have to reinstalled in a particular order. Is there any orientation of the individual plates that should be used? I assume that it is a good idea to keep the original "pack" of plates together as a "go by".
17) I note that the clutch spring bolts should be tightened diagonally, and by degrees, to a fairly low torque level (8.0 ? 9.5 lb-ft for my bike). I assume a standard, large torque wrench (17" length. 150lb-ft limit) is too big/inaccurate for this task. Would you recommend getting a smaller torque wrench for this task? Where is a good place to get one and what do they typically cost? I am concerned about this because I assume that even torque on all 4 bolts is important and I am also aware that some members have stripped these bolts or the plate (no names!).
18 ) I assume that a new gasket is usually necessary when replacing the clutch cover. I can't find a part number for this gasket on BikeBandit. Would BikeBandit or Ron Ayers normally carry them, or is this a "dealer only" item?
19) My manual also specifies using "Suzuki Bond No. 1207B" on part of the cover mating surface. I assume this is a gasket cement/compound. Does anyone have a brand of compound they prefer, and where can you usually buy it.
20) Are there any items or "gotcha's" that I have missed, and need a warning here?
21) Finally, how long might the whole clutch servicing job take? Given my painstaking methods, I shall probably multiply any answer by at least 2 or 3!
I know that this is a long list of questions but I think it would be good for our members to have all this information on a single thread. My thanks in advance to our clutch experts who take the time to provide these much needed answers.
Simon Waters
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