Valve Tappet too Small 1.6-1.8mm?

[Roland]

Persistance is paying off

O.k. first the update on clearances. Followed by responses to all of today's helpful advice.

I made another trip back to my local shop swapped around my shims.
This is shim size is actual measured size not labeled size because I found the labeled sizes were not accurate enough and were pushing me just beyond spec on one side or the other 2.55x= measured 2.61mm, 2.70x=measured2.75. One more swap for #1 and I am going to seal it up and go for a nice long relaxing ride. I have been tied up in the car for 2 weeks now.
Exhaust--Shim--Gap
#1-------2.61---.o4 = too tight I am guessing it is between .02-.03
#2-------2.61---.09 = close enough at this point
#3-------2.70---.04
#4-------2.63---.07

Intake---Shim---Gap
#1------2.02----.04
#2------2.75----.04
#3------2.90----.04
#4------2.70----.04

Compression
#1 = 136
#2 = 117
#3 = 115
#4 = 120

Now for the most important, I really do appreciate all the advice and assistance and time everyone has given me on this. I know none of you have to and the only reason you do is because you are all passionate about these bikes as I am.

Nessism

such a shim indicates an extremely sunk valve. Either the valve is mushroomed and smashed , the valve is severely sunk into the valve seat, or the cam journal is worn to the point where the cam has moved closer to the valve.

As an engineer my brain and thought patterns are completely unable to accept giving up on fixing a problem until I know exactly the cause. I also can not accept "it's junk" whether true or not unless I also know why it is junk. Until then, I fix what I can in a very methodical manner in an attempt to cure the problem.

The sunk in valve idea makes extremely good sense and would appear to the most likely scenario that would cause the tappet clearance to go beyond specification. This in turn would cause the Top Journal Cap to become worn which caused the journal gap that I initially came across. It took 2 weeks get to this result but it really does make sense.

If the engine does or doesn't make it to the winter I will be certain to let you all know, but I very much suspect it will be a very nice summer at which time I will hopefully make a much smaller post of a simple head rebuild and replacement.

Thanks Ghost for the Shim Offer. I just read through your posts on the Shim Exchange. I didn't know anyone was doing this very nice. I am almost done now and I will send you my extras for the kit.
I noticed on May 1, 2008 you posted you were going to retire and would no longer have access to the machine shop. I have access to an exceptionally good Mechanical Engineering machine shop at the college that I work. If you need any of the shims ground down to precision I can get it done to an accuracy somewhere around .00001mm. The only draw back is they do not have a tempering area.

Thanks Dan
The head looks like a good buy <fingers crossed>I did just purchase that head. It should be here in about 9 days. If I have trouble before the winter then I will install it then otherwise I will disassemble it and get it ready for my winter rebuild.

Subtotal:US $19.99
Shipping & handling:US $27.88
Total:US $47.87

Sorry Chef I know you are not normally negative and you have tried to help it was just the "Junk" comment when I have been working so long and hard to complete what should have been a simple singe afternoon project. I'm a guy that rides 7 days a week rain or shine and I guess not riding is starting to get to me.

I have been on the forums for longer than you guys may know. I think it has been at least 3-4 years now. I do a lot more reading than I do posting well at least until this project. Unfortunately I had an exceptionally bad year last year which put me off the forums for about 8 months and all my previous posts appear to have been deleted.

[first timer]

I just want to restate it is not a good idea to grind shims, it removes the tempered shell.

Secondly you don't have to be supper anal with your shims sizes it's better to be loose on a shim (with in reason) then tight, sometimes there just isn't a shim that gets you right in the middle. If I was you I would error on the side of the looser spec according to Suzuki.

what cause a loose shim is the top of the valve stem wearing down and letting the bucket go deeper in the head. what causes a tight shim is valve edge surface wearing or valve guide surface wearing or both and the valve spring pushing the valve stem closer to the cam lobe.

What nessim is just saying is logically speaking if your shim size is so small some thing has happened either the valve seat/guide is worn and pushing the valve stem closer to the cam or your cam has been pushed closer to the valve stem. Either way both Nessim and myself who are also engineers are concerned because what ever has happened has caused the head to go beyond designed specs which is not a good thing in the engineering world.

Your engine will still work probably it just won't be at top performance and things will just wear at a exponential rate since it is no longer in tolerance.

Enjoy your summer just do yourself a favor and keep checking your clearances every 500 miles so you don't damage anything else so you can do the head replacement in the winter.

Cover both sides of your oem valve gasket with some good grease – this will let you keep reusing it.

[gearhead13]

Cover both sides of your oem valve gasket with some good grease – this will let you keep reusing it.

My way of doing this is to use silicone on the cover to hold the gasket in place on the cover, then next time you remove it it sticks to the cover in perfect position.
Richard

[first timer]

My way of doing this is to use silicone on the cover to hold the gasket in place on the cover, then next time you remove it it sticks to the cover in perfect position.
Richard

I am sorry but me and many others will agree; silicone is just a bad idea, it makes a mess and can break apart and clog oil ports. If yo uuse wheel bearing grease, it is tacky enough to hold the gasket in place and there is no need for silicone, rtv or what ever you call it.

[Nessism]

My way of doing this is to use silicone on the cover to hold the gasket in place on the cover, then next time you remove it it sticks to the cover in perfect position.
Richard

I think this is a good idea only Threebond 1184 is preferred over silicone and make sure to only use it on the cover side.

[gearhead13]

I am sorry but me and many others will agree; silicone is just a bad idea, it makes a mess and can break apart and clog oil ports. If yo uuse wheel bearing grease, it is tacky enough to hold the gasket in place and there is no need for silicone, rtv or what ever you call it.

Welp, first, you dont use HUGE gobs of the stuff like many people do. Just enough to stick it to the cover. Whatever you use, threebond, silicone whatever, the idea is to stick it to one side or the other. I think grease is a bad idea because the gasket will try to squirm out of place.