Normal Operation of a starter clutch

[hamr1965]

OK,
I am a complete mechanical newbie. I can change my tires and my oil on my cars, and I worked as a pipe fitter & plumber for years, but that's it. So I am still trying to understand the correct operation of my stupid starter clutch from hell.

So here is how mine works - this is from viewing it with the left stator cover off so I can view how everything turns.

Pressing the starter button causes the starter motor to turn, turning the first smallest gear counter-clockwise. This turns the idler gear clockwise, and the the large gear counterclockwise. This counterclockwise spinning locks the rotor onto the gear, spinning it also. Now as I watch this action with the stator cover off, the idler gear appears to want to ride up it's shaft and disengage from the teeth of the large gear. I do not know if it can do this with the cover on, or if it is supposed to do this.

With the stator cover on - the engine tries to catch, but first the idler pin starts making a racket. I looked closely at the opening in the stator cover where the idler pin sits, and it is actually cracked!

I posted on another thread that my bike sounded awful when you start it, and that it sounds as if the starter isn't disengaging. Someone recommended I replace the starter clutch and gear, which I have done. However, both the old and the new starter clutchs appear to work properly. They both spin freely to the left (counterclockwise if you are looking at the gear, clutch, and rotor as they would be mounted on the bike), and lock down, preventing rotation to the right (clockwise). Is the idler gear supposed to lift out of the way of the large gear teeth once the engine starts? Should the rotor still spin freely to the left even after being tightened onto the crankshaft? I have read that the engine rotation is so much faster than the starter motor's that it "overtakes" the starter motor, but how do the gears 'disengage'?

I am sorry for so many questions, I truly have been reading and reading and reading - but I am totally perplexed as to why my starter won't disengage after my engine starts.

Thank you for any assistance or knowledge you might have.

AMR

[posplayr]

Pressing the starter button causes the starter motor to turn, turning the first smallest gear counter-clockwise. This turns the idler gear clockwise, and the the large gear counterclockwise. This counterclockwise spinning locks the rotor onto the gear, spinning it also. Now as I watch this action with the stator cover off, the idler gear appears to want to ride up it's shaft and disengage from the teeth of the large gear. I do not know if it can do this with the cover on, or if it is supposed to do this.

With the stator cover on - the engine tries to catch, but first the idler pin starts making a racket. I looked closely at the opening in the stator cover where the idler pin sits, and it is actually cracked!

Without a picture to confirm what you are saying, I would simply say this. The idler gear "pin" should not move. It should within tolerances be essentially stationary. It doesn't even need to spin for that matter. The idler gear spins on it. The pin is held in place between two holes one in the case and one in the stator cover. If either is cracked or it this moves you have a problem and it will likely clack as it starts to disengage while the starter is Trying to drive the idler and it is nothing to do with the clutch.

I would probably swap out the cracked part; hopefully that is your stator cover and the the cases. If your cases are cracked. you have problems, that even JB weld might not fix. There is a aluminum welding repair rod that might work but it will take alot of heat to heat a set of cases.

Pos

[Nessism]

Yea, sounds like you are missing the shaft/pin that the idler gear spins on. One end of the pin is held by the cover and the other by a hole in the engine. I have a spare pin for a 1000 if you need one.

[Killer2600]

Should the rotor still spin freely to the left even after being tightened onto the crankshaft? I have read that the engine rotation is so much faster than the starter motor's that it "overtakes" the starter motor, but how do the gears 'disengage'?

The one-way freewheel is normal and correct operation. The "gears" don't disengage, the "clutch" as in starter clutch does. The way it all works is the starter can turn the engine (as long as the engine is turning slower than the starter) but the engine can't turn the starter. To understand it better just toy around with the rotor that "still spin freely to the left" but not the right. Just picture how in one direction you can turn the crank along with it (it doesn't freewheel) but if you held the rotor still and the crank continued to turn by itself it wouldn't drag the rotor with it. In essence, the rotor would be turning in the freewheel direction if the crank started turning itself after you took the rotor and "cranked" the crank.

Hope this sheds some light on the workings of it all. Basically what I'm saying is if your starter starts the bike and the starter clutch works the way it's supposed to (which by your testimony it does) then your starter isn't dragging. The noise is likely something else like maybe a clutch rattle or cam chain rattle.

Btw you gotta get that pin fixed, cracks aren't good, and they don't get better by themselves they can only get worse.

[hamr1965]

Thank you for the quick responses. I finally got it. When the engine takes over, the crankshaft and the rotor spin up faster then the starter, thus releasing the bearings from locking on the hub of the large gear, and then the gear stops being spun. So. Now I am troubled. This means the racket the bike is making after it starts has NOTHING TO DO with the starter. Something else in the engine has locked up while the bike has been sitting - mostly laid over on it's right side - for the last 8 months.

Well, thank you so much - at least I completely understand this one aspect of my bike now. I think I will need to take it to a mechanic next, as I took 8 months just working on the starter clutch . Thank you all again.