headlight

[argonsagas]

Sorry to disagree, Argon, but the H4 equivalent is as Mike says, a 9003. I use 9004 bulbs in my vans and they are NOT the same.

I also have to disagree with the use of blue-tinted bulbs. A true HID bulb generates those colors, so they are true colors. Any of the "pseudo-HID xenon bulbs" that you use actually filter out the useable light to give that blue look, reducing actual light to useless levels.

I got a set of "Plasma White" bulbs a couple of years ago, in 80/100 watt 'brightness', put them in my van and went for a drive. I cut my test ride short so I could get home to change them back to the stock 45/65 watt bulbs. There was not a whole lot of difference in road illumination between my parking lights and the "plasma white" headlights. Looking at the van as an oncoming car, yeah, it looked like it had HID lights, but I don't really care how it looks, I want to SEE.

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You are correct about the number...9003 is correct....

We disagree on the colour, however.

Stock sealed beams put out mostly yellow light., usually with a Kelvin rating of about 2800/3200, with some going higher.

Standard halogen puts out more light quantity, and at a slightly higher colour temperature, but still yellow. They range from 3000k to 4000k

I tried the Sylvania's bulbs and while they are brighter than standard halogen, they were still too yellow. I believe they are rated at 4200k

The xenon bulbs with light blue coating work best for me.

They last just as long as Sylvania, and that colour temperature is closer to the accepted daylight average of 5500k.

Presuming the actual output in lumens is the same, the daylight temperature light provides a superior effect on perception to what yellow achieves.

I have tried the different bulbs on the same road for comparison, and definitely prefer the blue-film bulbs rated at 4800/5400k with max 6000k. I feel most strongly about this on nights with no moonlight while on roads that have no artificial illumination.


Continuing on colour:

I think we do agree that higher Kelvin numbers put out light that is increasingly blue, and, in the same manner that the lower numbers yield light that is yellow, the farther we move into blue the less effective they are for driving perception.



Where there may be a disagreement with others is that the true HID light that has a high colour output temperature falls into the same category of less-usable light produced at lower numbers by incandescent light.....the difference is colour. One is yellow, the other blue, but if they are equidistant from 5500, and of similar actual output, the net effect is similar, although too much blue is probably worse for more people's perception than too much yellow.

There usually is a considerably stronger output from HID than halogen, but if the outputs were the same as halogen then the often much higher colour temperature HID would not, COULD NOT, provide superior visibility to the human eye because of its being blue.

[Steve]

The xenon bulbs with light blue coating work best for me.

There is just no way I can argue that point. It certainly does NOT work for me. As I mentioned earlier, I tried some of the "Plasma White" bulbs that had a rather heavy blue tint, and in spite of being 80/100 watt bulbs, I just could not see.

Presuming the actual output in lumens is the same, the daylight temperature light provides a superior effect on perception to what yellow achieves.

This is the key to the whole thing.

For those that are interested, here is some information from Daniel Stern Lighting.
Look at the menu options in the left column, click on Tech. Then click on Bulbs. Then click on Blue. Read both of those articles.

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[mighty13d]

I ordered two H4 Silverstar bulbs made by Osram from egay the other day. $6 per bulb out of Estonia I think it was. Cost me under $20 for two shipped. Just have to wait for the darn things to get here! The seller was really nice about the whole thing asking how I wanted them packaged and everything. I used the Sylvania ones in one of my old cars and they more than doubled how much I could actually see. I can't wait to throw one in my Bandit. It already has a killer reflector in it!

[dlanes]

You don't really want higher kelvin number, that's the light color not brightness. HID bulbs and halogen blubs are completely different. HID bulbs generate an arc and are much brighter than halogen which require proper housings designed for the light output. Tinted bulbs just generate a different color. Your eyes see red better than blue more clearly. Blue does produce some glare vs yellow. The only bulbs I recall are some GE came out with that cost about $30-$50 a bulb that produced more light at same wattage from the bulb design. Silverstar bulbs are extremely overpriced for tinted bulbs, and from my experience don't last long for some reason. Same with higher wattage bulbs.

[OldVet66]

I'm having real good luck with the Narva Range Power 50 #48861. It is a standard wattage Xenon H4 with no tinting. It is a very bright light, more white than a lot of the Halogen bulbs. 5000 degrees Kelvin is the higher end of the white lights, and they get more yellow as the degrees fall. 1895/1150 Lumens.

[argonsagas]

Originally Posted by argonsagas
The xenon bulbs with light blue coating work best for me.

There is just no way I can argue that point. It certainly does NOT work for me. As I mentioned earlier, I tried some of the "Plasma White" bulbs that had a rather heavy blue tint, and in spite of being 80/100 watt bulbs, I just could not see.

Steve, please read the differences in our respective descriptions....mine says I like the light blue tint, yours says you dislike the heavy blue tint.

Both bulbs are often called plasma white or something similar, but they are not the same.

All incandescent bulbs, including quartz-halogen, use an inert gas that keeps the filament from burning up and all tend to put out a yellow light that can be varied by the intensity of the burn or by adding colour.

When more of any colour is added the resultant light becomes more attuned to that colour, with less of the visible spectrum available as usable light.




The heavy blue tint makes the output considerably more blue, and thus reduces its effectiveness for driving illumination, while the light coating adds some blue to the natural yellow of the filament and this alters/raises the output colour temperature to something closer to daylight, which is more effective than the original yellow.

The total light output from the bulb remains about the same, but its effectiveness is improved.

[Steve]

Steve, please read the differences in our respective descriptions....mine says I like the light blue tint, yours says you dislike the heavy blue tint.

Both bulbs are often called plasma white or something similar, but they are not the same.When more of any colour is added the resultant light becomes more attuned to that colour, with less of the visible spectrum available as usable light.

This is quite true. There is a lot of difference between the light and heavy tints, but any tint is going to filter out some light, it's just a matter of how much.

I have been doing quite a bit of night-time riding on the freeway the last few weekends as I have been riding from my sister's house in North Carolina to where I am staying in South Carolina. I have been watching the color of the lights of oncoming cars and those that are passing me. A couple of them have been well into the purple range, I just don't see how they can see anything with them. The lights that are true HID lights will light up the road about as well as my Wing, but the ones with the blue-tinted bulbs (and I don't know how much they are tinted) almost seem to soak up the light from my bike as they pass. I just can't see anything illuminated from their car as they pass, like I can from a car with standard halogens.

I also find it interesting that the halogens are now called "yellow lights" when they were so much whiter than the sealed beams they replaced.

[argonsagas]

This is quite true. There is a lot of difference between the light and heavy tints, but any tint is going to filter out some light, it's just a matter of how much.

Agreed. The difference is the effective quality of the light delivered on the road. If the colour is close to daylight human perception is improved over what is seen if it is biased towards either yellow or blue.

The little bit of blue that is added does carry a cost, or loss, but the upgradation in light quality more than offsets this, leaving a plus balance.

These bulbs also usually burn with xenon gas inside, which permits a higher operating temperature (with more light) than standard halogen.

I also find it interesting that the halogens are now called "yellow lights" when they were so much whiter than the sealed beams they replaced.

ALL incandescents produce light that is biased towards the yellow side of the visible spectrum.

When the filament in a bulb first begins to glow it is red, and as more current is pushed though it (higher wattage) thermal heat is raised and the colour of the light emitted by the hot filament moves to orange and then yellow.

This would inevitably result in a burning of the filament, literally, if oxygen were present, so oxygen is evacuated and an inert gas is used, to revent the filament from burning up.

Perhaps you never knew Argon's a gas


A sealed beam is essentially a large bulb with a large filament or two inside it....and it gets hot when lit.

Altering the construction into a removable bulb allows for a more concentrated burn/light source, and a higher output of light without burning the outer containment.

Some alteration is required in the bulb construction, to better handle the high temperature, without burning up.....quartz comes into play at that point as the glass and means of contrsuction used in a common light bulb or sealed beam would not accept that heat and would break down quickly.

With the thermal increase the filament emits more brightness and the colour of the light produced moves closer to white.

A filter is usually added, either through a coating or another lens, to reduce ultra-violet.

You can increase the temperature and brightness by having the filament glow even hotter, by moving to a different gas, such as xenon.

(and yes, I did know someone with that actual name, not a screen name)

[Steve]

Perhaps you never knew Argon's a gas

Really??

I thought it was due to long stories by a guy named "Argon", therefore: Argon sagas.

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[Bert Patterson]

I haven’t ridden at night in months. Unfortunately, at the moment I only have high beams. I think the bulb is fine, but the thing it plugs into at some point partly melted and is fairly brittle. I bought a new one, but haven’t installed it yet……..but I have a dream……

[argonsagas]

Really??

I thought it was due to long stories by a guy named "Argon", therefore: Argon sagas.

.

Yup. Them is true words, too.

[Nessism]

Picked up a twin pack of Sylvania Silverstar 9003's for $11.99 shipped. Hard to beat that... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...=STRK:MEWAX:IT