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**bwringer** · 11-04-2009, 08:16 PM

Hoooooooo boy, this is gonna be good...

Before the offended howling starts, my advice would be to get the bike running and working as well as possible in its present form and ride it a while before mutilating it.

Without experience in riding or with the bike, you have absolutely no basis at the moment for making any of the profound engineering decisions you're considering.

**TheCafeKid** · 11-04-2009, 08:28 PM

Geeeeez Edith.... I will tell you what. I could go off in a tyrade about how you have no business making that bike ( or any bike for that matter) a "cafe racer"
considering multiple facts regarding that bike (it's a shaft drive which IMO has no business being a cafe etcetera etc ) or that you should NOT be modifying a damn thing considering you have neither ridden the bike in it's stock form to know what you want or need to change, nor can (apparently since you took it to a mechanic to clean the carbs, something which you should be learning to do yourself if you plan on doing anything else mechanicly to the bike. And you took it to a SHADY mech on that??? Cmon man) you work on the bike itself.

My suggestion? Sell it take the money and go buy a Carpy cafe if you want one so badly. Or... Get it running yourself. Learn about it. Learn to ride it work on it love it or hate it etc.... THEN decide how you want to make it not only LOOK cool but actually perform better as well. Yeah I'm an ass hole. Deal with it.

But I will save all that and say "Welcome to the GSR and good
luck with your project!"

**Dave8338** · 11-04-2009, 08:32 PM

A $1,000 budget is not a whole lot to get a custom bike built, even if you're doing all the work yourself.

It can be done, but it requires you to have the ability, facility, tools (the list is too long to detail but requires more than a hack saw), and strong knowledge of mechanical skills. The last one is a must, at the very least!

The fact that you had the carbs rebuilt and didn't do them yourself, somewhat tells a story in itself.

Go for it!!!!!

**kinnet** · 11-04-2009, 08:39 PM

Geez guys... What a lovely and warm welcome to the new guy with questions.
At least he asked before he got his sawzall out. I think that in and of itself also speaks volumes.

You have to start somewhere, right? Why can't his first bike be made into a cafe racer while he learns along the way?

Anyhaps, new guy... Good luck!

**tkent02** · 11-04-2009, 08:42 PM

"I am a complete amateur who barely knows how to ride"
Don't you think a stock 850 is fast enough for you?
I think you need a hack saw.
Off with everything that doesn't look like a cafe racer.
Try to fix it until you get sick of not knowing how to make it work.
Sell the dead hulk on Craigslist.

**midnightcafe** · 11-04-2009, 09:38 PM

Dude,

I understand that you bought the bike because it was an opportune buy, probably cheap and now you want to ride something with more balls. If you were limited by budget in your purchase of the bike, you really shouldn't be thinking about putting a heap more money into it to transform it into a bike you wish you bought. There are plenty of examples on craigslist of overpriced "cafe" bikes, owned by individuals who lost interest after embarking on the cafe transformation only to end up with a stock bike that looks goofy and doesn't ride as well as stock.

Sure, you can buy a universal fiberglass pillion, clubman bars, chrome doodads, but that adds up quick. How limited is your budget? Post pictures of your bike so we can get an idea of what you have.

Yes, the first thing you need to do is get it running again. Next you need an owner's manual, so next time you can clean the carbs yourself and save some money. I don't know what your bike is worth, but hypothetically I would lower the fronk forks 0.5-1" in the triple tree. If you already have a 4-1 exhaust, paint the headers flat black. You'd need rearsets if you plan on dragging knee, so no. With stock footpegs, clubmans would make for an akward riding position. Get a pair of superbike bars and a single bar end mirror. The lower handlebars might need a shorter front brake line plus creative placement of cables. Don't cut the frame, you'll be excommunicated from the greater GSR forum. That and you lose all resale value. If you can't clean the carbs than stay away from air pod filters! If you want cafe, then don't worry about carrying a passenger-look into a fiberglass tail piece, like this:

Page not found – Vintage Fiberglass Motorcycle Seats

http://www.hotwingglass.com/seats/road-race-1.shtml

of course with this tail you have to fabricate the mounts, have it painted and upholstered, etc. It's much easier said than done. Honestly your list seems a bit out of your abilities, you'd be better off keeping it stock with minor mods to have a fresh look.

**Baatfam** · 11-04-2009, 09:45 PM

Originally posted by TheCafeKid View Post

I could go off in a tyrade about how you have no business making that bike ( or any bike for that matter) a "cafe racer"...

You? You go off on a tirade about cafe racers...??

I don't believe that for a minute...not you....some other guy maybe, but not you....

**salty_monk** · 11-04-2009, 09:45 PM

Couple of 650G cafe style bikes lurking here....

First off lets see pictures of what you've got!

2nd - if you mess with the engine (as in pods & pipes) you're going to need to learn how to work on those carbs yourself to make jetting changes. It's a good place to start to learn I reckon... go get your bike back, you'll save a bunch of money right at the start I expect.

3rd - You say you can barely ride. Do the MSF course & get yourself some good gear. http://www.newenough.com come highly recommended.

Now to your list:

Suspension-I think the front forks are a bit long and therefore take away from the low/squat look of the traditional cafe.
1)What are my options for shortening the front end and how will shorter forks affect handling? - Lower the fork tubes in the triple trees an inch (bars & clearance at full compression govern how much lower you can go. Make sure you get it exact both sides). You'll quicken the steering unless you also fit shorter rear shock to match & decrease ground clearance (could be an issue with 4:1 pipe)
2)I'm 6'0, 190 lbs, and I'd like to have my suspension dialed in properly. Can you guys suggest what type of shocks/springs would best fit my size? Progressive suspension front springs & Ikon or Progressive rear Shock. http://www.z1enterprises.com is a good source.

Aesthetics-I'd like to get rid of the rear fender and light assembly in order to give the bike the classic cafe rear end (rounded and preferably REMOVABLE seat cowl so that my lady can ride too). I want the entire project to reflect the spirit of the old style cafe's.
1)Is there a ready-made solution for the rear fender/light delete? If so, where can I find it? Not really - you'll have to buy a "cafe" tailight from Ebay or one of many sources & fabricate some brackets. You could use an L model rear fender or a cut down front fender as a starting point for your rear.
2)Will the fender delete require me to cut the frame?
3)What options do I have in terms of a ready-made cafe seat for the GS? - Ebay or a bunch of other places. Do a google search there are loads of fibreglass seats. You'll have to fabricate the seat pan (even wood will do for this) & yes you'll prob have to cut the frame.
4)Do you have any specific suggestions for clubman bars? What about grips? Clubmans might require you to make a change to the steerer stops as they could hit the tank. Bikemaster are the usual brand. You can get them at Z1. There are adjustable ones out there too.
5)I find the instrument cluster quite ugly, any suggestions for replacement? Get a Tach & Speedo Kit from Dennis Kirk & bolt to the bar. You lose all the idiot lights though...

Performance-Being a bare bones fellow, my aim is to drop as much unnecessary weight as possible while making the most inexpensive improvements that I can afford. I hope to keep the entire project beneath the $1000 mark, but I'd still like to get some significant bang for my buck!
1)What parts should I definitely toss?
2)What kind of rearsets should I pick up? Are they even necessary? - Tarozzi is about the only brand unless you fabricate adapter brackets for a GSXR set. http://www.fastfromthepast.com - pick yourself up a fork brace whilst you're there...
3)The headers are rusted, what kind should I replace them with? - 4:2, not much, look for a good stock set. 4:1 - Vance & Hines is the usual. Expect to pay about $300 +shipping. You will probably have to make some jetting changes in the carbs to get it to run right.
4)What about megaphones? I'm looking at these:
http://www.jcwhitney.com/DUNSTALL_ST...;2006467;0;0;Y - might fit if you fabricate brackets but I thought your headers were shot?
5)Are there any other mods worth doing that would give me great return on investment? - The usual is K&N Pod filters & a Dynojet jet Kit. About $130 & $120 respectively. Then you have to pull the carbs apart & fit it. Also replace the O rings behind the carb intake boots (I doubt slim shady mechanic will have done that...)
6)Should I go 4-1 or 4-2? Is there a significant performance difference between the two? Not really. 4-1 is about the only aftermarket option, you may find a MAC 4:2 on ebay but their quality is not up to much...
7)Brake pad brand for front and rear? Are braided brake lines worth the cost? Brake pads - EBC or similar. Braided lines - Yes! For real performance fit some twin pot calipers & a set of Honda CBR rotors - search my username for more details of that, I have a kit I can sell you.

Good luck... expect your bike to be off the road for a minimum 6mths maybe a year.

You'll want a decent set of tires too (when were they replaced?) Avon Roadriders or Pirelli Sport demons are the usual choices.

Dan

**KiwiGS** · 11-04-2009, 10:07 PM

Well done Salty, It is a shame that everybodies questions are not answered in such a helpful way here....

**JuniorRap** · 11-04-2009, 11:27 PM

Great feedback

Hey guys,

I'm super happy about all the feedback!!! I just got home for the evening and I was so excited to have so many responses already. I was nervous about whether you guys would even respond and I'm glad you did. I'm not sensitive and I really do want to learn how to work on the bike myself. I like getting my hands dirty and I certainly don't mind listening to those older and wiser than myself (I'm 25). In fact, I welcome correction so if I'm wrong and/or misguided, please help me get where I need to be.

I desperately wanted to embark on the carb rebuilding myself but I travel almost every weekend for work which doesn't leave much time for tinkering. Moreover, I must admit that I felt intimidated about taking the engine apart by myself without any semblance of working knowledge of the bike. But despite my apprehension, I'd worked out a deal for my shady mechanic to allow me to work in his shop on the weekends that I'm in town so I'll be there early Saturday morning to learn a couple of things.

What attracted me to this site is the wealth of knowledge and mechanical know-how of the membership and I am taking all of your collective comments into consideration. With that said, I will make getting to know my bike PRIORITY NUMBER ONE!! Thanks for your comments and keep them coming. I'll post some pics up this weekend.

More History: I received the bike gratis and up until last weekend it had been sitting in my garage for the past year and a half. I'm embarrassed to say it, but I felt a small sense of accomplishment by getting it out of the garage and into the shop. But I know firsthand the satisfaction that comes from putting real sweat equity into a project. And I hear what you guys are saying but fiberglass, fabrication, fork adjustments, and f***in' up a perfectly good bike all scare me but then again, no pain, no gain.

I've already ordered Avon RoadRunners and they'll be arriving Friday. Special thanks to Salty_Monk for answering my questions point for point. Special thanks to everyone else for honesty and a needed reality check!! Your responses have me more excited than I was before I posted!!

**JuniorRap** · 11-04-2009, 11:35 PM

Cost

and money isn't a big issue, i'm just kind of cheap. i figured that it would be a great thing to score a free bike and make it something special for less than 1K! but i'm realizing that perhaps my mind should have been on paying some dues before trying to stomp with the big dogs.

also, i've seen plenty of bikes with pod filters but i've read numerous posts about keeping the stock airbox in place and even more posts about the difficulties that arise when trying to get the jetting just right. again, keep the feedback coming folks! and Kinnet you hit the nail on the head; my aim was definitely to create a bike that performs well and looks good while learning a thing or two in the process!

**salty_monk** · 11-05-2009, 12:43 AM

If you were after ultimate horsepower you'd have a bigger engine to start with... but the cafe bikes generally go with pods. The look I guess.

Important thing if you do go with them is to get the quality K&N pods & matching Dynojet kit. After that with clean carbs well sealed to the engine it's not such a problem.

A lot of people who have issues are too cheap to buy the right stuff & it bites them on the *ss

I don't see any issue with going with stock airbox though. I also like a 4:2 - just availability is the issue. Why exactly is yours shot? You can paint it black if it's just the chrome. I'm a big fan of "black on black" paint schemes. Remember you don't have to go cafe just cause everyone else is... do something you like, will use & that works reliably.

No probs on the point for point, it was a bit rushed but I didn't like a lot of the responses you were getting.

Everyone has to start somewhere & at least one of those posting negative stuff has an un-finished cafe build of his own... so glass houses & stones spring to mind

**salty_monk** · 11-05-2009, 12:50 AM

My current project.... with GSXR suspension.

These both have black pipes..

**TheCafeKid** · 11-05-2009, 01:05 AM

Yanno I used to be more optimistic and helpful especially regarding cafe type projects. But I got really sick of people who were only concearned about making it "look cool" rather than making it actually run first and finding out what needed to be addressed, be it modification wise or simply getting it running correctly period. Then I got even more turned off by people who simply refused to not only listen, but also told me to stuff it. Combine that with the people who just start whacking away on a bike with no forethought planning or vision of the project much less any idea of what sort of damage they are actually doing, and those who get pizzed when you try to tell them that the bike they mangled that they over pAid for to begin with and now are trying to get what they've got in it out of it, and yeah I'd say it's made me a little jaded toward extending any suggestions or tips to those who don't research for themselves first. So my appologies to the new boyo if ya took offense. My point was merely that you should do some more research and get a better feel for the bike before dumping a bunch of money in a cafe. One: it should never be your only bike and two: 1000 bucks can get sucked up in a couple parts hoarding days if you're not careful. Good luck with your project.

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