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clutch basket

  • Thread starter Thread starter Anonymous
  • Start date Start date
A

Anonymous

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while still looking for the cause of my high rpm to low mph problem, i noticed that the clutch basket (? the thing that all the disks and plates go into) doesn't seem to have gear teeth that go all the way around the back of the basket (if you're looking at the basket, i'm talking about the teeth kind of behind it, where it looks like the clutch is transferring power to the transmission). the teeth are there in a Y pattern, relative to the basket (if you think of a thick Y inscribed in a circle, the teeth are where the Y touches the circle, and no teeth in the other parts)

is this normal? if not, is there a reason someone would put in a basket like that? has anyone ever heard of something like that? could this be why my engine is revving high but i'm not moving fast? thanks again...
 
Re: clutch basket

rvahid said:
while still looking for the cause of my high rpm to low mph problem, i noticed that the clutch basket (? the thing that all the disks and plates go into) doesn't seem to have gear teeth that go all the way around the back of the basket (if you're looking at the basket, i'm talking about the teeth kind of behind it, where it looks like the clutch is transferring power to the transmission). the teeth are there in a Y pattern, relative to the basket (if you think of a thick Y inscribed in a circle, the teeth are where the Y touches the circle, and no teeth in the other parts)

is this normal? if not, is there a reason someone would put in a basket like that? has anyone ever heard of something like that? could this be why my engine is revving high but i'm not moving fast? thanks again...
Click to expand...

How about a photo of that one???????
 
Not exactly sure what you are talking about. The gears that transfer power from the crnak to the clutch are (stock) helical - not straight cut. There are some gears on the backside (hidden) of the clutch, but those are used to drive the oil pump. The transmission is driven from the center shaft through the clutch.

I would help with some more background on the problem.
 
showschematic.asp


http://houseofmotorcycles.bikebandit.com/partsbandit/showschematic.asp?dept_id=709029

i'm at work (yes, very productive day), so i can't do any better than schematic pics from bike bandit now. i'm talking about the teeth around the edge (to the left, under the arrow for 1) of the thing labeled 1 in the schematic. i'm going to double check tonight when i get home to make sure i'm telling you guys the right thing i was looking at, but i'm pretty sure that's what i saw (i took the clutch apart over the weekend and looked around to see if i could identify any problem areas, and the Y pattern of the teeth seemed odd)

if this isn't a problem, any other ideas for the rev issue (i'm getting 70mph @ 7k rpm in 5th)?
 
#1 is the helical cut drive gear that runs off the crank, all the teeth should be there, so I guess you found the problem!!! Still would like to see a pic though, when you can, that's a most unusual failure! Were there chunks of teeth lying around in there too? I would have thought you'd have mentioned it if there was. Don't even know what to say about someone who would knowingly re-assemble something like that after cleaning up what must have been a real mess :roll:
 
no chunks of teeth or anything... actually, it looked smooth in the areas without the teeth, which is why i thought it may be like that on purpose. but, like i said, my memory isn't the greatest, so i'll have to double check tonight to make sure what i saw is what i'm showing you guys. i'll definitely put up pics if this is case.

i think this has got to be it though... if the gear only has about 2/3s of the teeth that are supposed to be there, and i'm supposed to get around 15mph / 1k rpm, then the 10mph / 1k rpm i'm getting works out (yes, i crunch numbers for a living...)

anyhow, anyone know how i can cross reference gs part numbers? i have the microfiche for my bike ('82 850g), but i know that that gear is no longer made for my bike, and i need to know what other models use the same gear...
 
If there were teeth mising you wouldnt be able to ride the bike at all
 
ok, my memory is fading... it wasn't the primary gear after all. i can't see what it was i was looking at without removing the plates again, and since it's raining, i'll have to wait another day to see what it was i was looking at (probably just the oil pump gear...) so the mystery of the high revving engine lingers... i do have new metal plates on the way though. maybe that'll fix the problem...
 
rvahid said:
ok, my memory is fading... it wasn't the primary gear after all. i can't see what it was i was looking at without removing the plates again, and since it's raining, i'll have to wait another day to see what it was i was looking at (probably just the oil pump gear...) so the mystery of the high revving engine lingers... i do have new metal plates on the way though. maybe that'll fix the problem...
Click to expand...

Maybe its just a slipping clutch
 
that's what i thought too (that the clutch was slipping)... i replaced the disks, but not the metal plates, and it seemed like it wasn't slipping anymore, but i'm still getting the high revs. i guess i'll see if the new metal plates make the difference (the old metal ones weren't warped or anything, but they were definitely thicker than stock suzuki plates... i'm hoping that that is the problem, and my gs pains will finally be over (well, for a little while, at least...)
 
rvahid said:
that's what i thought too (that the clutch was slipping)... i replaced the disks, but not the metal plates, and it seemed like it wasn't slipping anymore, but i'm still getting the high revs. i guess i'll see if the new metal plates make the difference (the old metal ones weren't warped or anything, but they were definitely thicker than stock suzuki plates... i'm hoping that that is the problem, and my gs pains will finally be over (well, for a little while, at least...)
Click to expand...
I dont see the model of your bike and exactly wht oil you are using. You can chek the metal disks with a feeler guage and a piece of window glass.
 
my bike is an '82 850g & i'm running castrol gtx 10w40 (regular, not motorcycle specific)... just before the last oil change, though, i put in mobile 1 (i forget which weight). but the bike has been revving high ever since i got her, so i don't think it was the mobile 1 that did the clutch in...
my neighbor, who used to work on auto transmissions, thinks my problems were b/c the disks and plates were too tight, and even though the clutch is tight at low rpms, it'll slip once it starts moving faster...
 
do you have a shop manual or a clymers and did you re adjust your clutch. Some of these bikes need to be adjusted on the tight side to allow easier downshifting. maybe you over did it??

WHAT HAPPENED TO ALL THE OTHER WRENCHES AROUND HERE. I DONT KNOW WHATS WRONG WITH THIS THING???? :lol:
 
i've been using the clymer manual... when i put the new disks on, i torqued it to spec, though i think i torqued it towards the higher end of the range rather than the low end, so maybe that change will help.
by readjusting the clutch, do you mean the lever? i did that too... she's shifting fine, though neutral seems to be a little harder to find now. the only other thing i noticed when i put the new disks in, is that my bike seemed to have lost a little bit of it's low speed "pep" (aka, it's not as quick to accelerate at low speeds as it was before i put the new plates in... i can't tell that much of a difference at higher speeds), if that makes any sense.

thanks for your help, slopoke... very much appreciated!

oh, and a question for when i get the new metal plates... should i also replace the back metal one as well (the one that's locked into place with the piano wire clip)? if so, can i take out the clip without destroying it (i forgot to order a new one when i ordered the plates...)
 
Are you saying that you are not going to measure the old disks first. dont just keep changing parts.
Your problem sounds screwy. Maybe thats why no other folks are getting into the act.

This whole business doesnt sound correct to me. are you Joking with me??
 
woah, slow down there slopoke... i'm not pulling your leg. the metal plates aren't warped (i checked that w/ a piece of glass and the feeler guages)... the only thing i could gather was that they were thicker than the 2mm specified in the clymer manual (i measured them with vernier calipers... they're about 2.5mm each) looking through the old service records, i saw the previous owner had the clutch changed, and used non-genuine suzuki parts. i also noticed the old springs were thicker than the new suzuki ones i ordered, so i'm guessing he had heavy duty ones put in. also, the metal plates weren't "sided" like people said on the site (the teeth look the same on both sides... there's not a "sharp" side and a "rounded" side).
 
If anything, I would think what you just mentioned would cause the clutch to not disengage. Engagement should be fine, unless something else is goofy. There may be an adjustment on how the clutch engages, but I'm not sure, I know there is one on the 750's.
 
i don't follow... engagement = clutch connecting engine and transmission? and there may or may not be something that affects that, other than the springs & pressure plate? like i said earlier, disengaging the clutch is not a problem... shifts are smooth and easy. i think there's somthing weird going on here too, which is why i've been posting for the past few weeks on it (and, slopoke is right, no one's been able to help other than tell me my clutch is slipping)... other than the high rpms, is there a way to tell if it's slipping? the manual says i'm not supposed to be able to start from a dead stop in second gear without stalling the engine, and, if i can, it means my clutch is slipping. well, i can still start in second just fine (though it struggles a little more than before i replaced the asbestos disks). and since i just replaced those disks, it seems like the problem has to be with the metal plates. but, since those plates aren't warped, it doesn't make sense to me that the clutch would still slip. but, i guess it has to make sense, as that seems to be my only option...
 
You can usually feel the clutches slip, there will be increased rpms, and decreased acceleration. What I've experienced is when I shift I'd let go of the clutch and the rpms would climb, but acceleration would be slow until I backed off the gas a little, then you would feel the clutch grab, and you could accelerate again. That may not be what happens for everyone though. When you switched the fibers did you put Mobil 1 in immediately? I'm wondering if you fixed one problem by replacing the fibers, but then the mobil 1 caused the new fibers to slip. That said, I thought that Mobil 1 was ok to use with wet clutches, just trying to narrow it down.
 
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