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1979 GS1000L - don't run quite right... Any suggestions?

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    1979 GS1000L - don't run quite right... Any suggestions?

    Howdy, all!

    I just recently got my '79 GS1000L going (last weekend, in fact), and one of the first things I did was synch the carbs with a set of mercury column manometers. I just bought the bike last fall from one of those types who *thinks* he's the world's greatest mechanic. Well, turns out that 1 & 2 were way low, and 3 & 4 were way high on the scale. No wonder it ran rough! Couldn't get them perfect - the mercury columns would all surge and decline at different times, but I got it running a whole lot smoother than it did. Also got rid of a loud "clattering" noise that seemed to result from one or two cylinders trying to over-ride the others.

    Then I developed a gas leak. Turns out the sharp end of the choke wire had poked a hole in my BRAND NEW clear-plastic fuel line near where it goes into the carburetor. Cut 1/2 inch off the damaged end, bent the end of the choke wire away from the fuel line, and that fixed that. Of course, I then proceeded to lay the bike on its right-hand side in my garage while trying to rock it up on the center stand and I lost my balance. No obvious damage other than some smudges where gas leaked out onto the top of the gas tank from the fill-neck vent, and those polished out OK.

    The next couple of days were cold, and the bike had never started very well below 50 degrees since I got it, but I thought I'd see how well the bike would start now that the carbs were synchronized. Ended up running the battery down trying. Checked the plugs and found out that they were all sooty (one was also slightly oily, but the previous owner said it had a valve-seal leak on that cylinder). The gaps were around .040" and last I knew the spec was around .025" with a points-type ignition. Closed the gaps down to .025", checked for spark - all good, fat, blue sparks. The engine started, but now it was puking gas out through the overflow pipes on #2, #3, and #4 carbs! This stopped with a bit of thumping on the carbs, though (probably somehow stuck the float needles when I laid the bike over). No obvious smell of gas in the oil, either.

    Problem is, the clattering noise is back. It goes away when I rev the engine, but comes back around 1500-2000RPM's. It also pops and backfires when I let up on the throttle after revving it up. #1 and #4 cylinders' exhaust pipes barely get warm, even by the manifold, while #2 and #3 are too hot to touch at the same time. I have to pull the choke partway out to keep the bike running, and while I had been able to get a reasonably smooth 1000RPM idle right after I synched the carbs, now it dies if I push the choke in enough to get it to idle down to that point, even when fully warmed up (except for #1 and #4 cylinder, as I mentioned). I even checked for leaks in the rubber manifold seals by spraying starter fluid near them. No chance in engine function. The ambient temperature was around 45 degrees Fahrenheit.

    What should I do next next? My Haynes manual says don't touch the idle air screws and whatever that one is at the bottom of the carb (Mikuni flatslides, BTW) because they're close-toleranced for emissions reasons. Well, if it would help my bike to run better, bugger the emissions standards (Michigan doesn't check them except perhaps in some metropolitan areas anyway). Should I re-synch the carbs? adjust the screws? Get hotter plugs? Any or none of these? HELLLLLP!

    #2
    Could be a coil problem. If the plug wires will reach try switching the coils around. One coil fires 1&4 and the other fires 2&3. You'll have to switch the wires feeding power into the coils then switch the plug wires around.

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      #3
      ...Except, I'm getting a nice, fat, blue spark on all four wires.

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        #4
        Did you do a valve adjustment?

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          #5
          You need to go back into the carbs and reclean them. At idle the engine will be noisey, make sure the cam chain tensioner is working

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            #6
            Birdman,
            This might sound silly. But after I installed new coils. I had 2 cold headers and same symtoms as yours. I had put 2 plug wires on backwards. Was only running on 2 cyl. Switched wires and bike ran perfect.
            Just a thought.
            Charlie

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              #7
              Mystery (mostly) solved...

              Thanks, all! Part of the problem DID turn out to be in the coils, or at least in one of them. It was an intermittent problem, which is why it wasn't obvious at first. One coil would occasionally short out to ground and not function properly. I found a pair of used "Cir Cycle" brand coils on Ebay for $20 (they look something like Accel Supercoils, but with a differend way of connecting the plug wires), and they work great. Still some problems, and a guy at work who used to fix bikes for a living said I need to take my carbs apart and clean them thoroughly, and possibly replace the float needles and seats. So that's next on the agenda...

              BTW, my bad. They're NOT flatslides...

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                #8
                I recently completed refurbishing a 78 GS1000 for a guy. It started and ran perfectly with the fuel pilot screws set to 1 1/4 turns out, pilot airscrews at 1 3/4 turns out and carbs vacuums synched to 10 inches of mercury at 1200 rpm. The thing comes off the line so hard, it'll yank you right outta yer shorts. :-)

                Earl
                Komorebi-The light filtering through the trees.

                I would rather sit on a pumpkin and have it all to myself than be crowded on a velvet cushion. H.D.T.

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                  #9
                  Well, I bit the bullet and tore the carbs apart. Pretty heavily varnished, and the float needles had rings worn into them. Cleaned the carbs, replaced the float valve assemblies, and then had a fun time re-adjusting the carbs. Turned out that (a)the points wouldn't stay adjusted for squat (warped points plate), and (b) the bike does NOT like BR8ES plugs. I found a great deal on a Dyna III ignition (about $100 directly from Dyna on their closeout page) and ditched the points, found a store that carries B8ES plugs (resistor plugs plus resistor caps made for a relatively weak spark), and was finally able to get the carbs adjusted. One muffler has all the baffles burned out, so to compensate the mixture screws are 3 turns out (I'll likely have to re-adjust them after I replace the mufflers - a guy at work is making me a custom pair). The bike purrs like a kitten, takes off like a raped ape, and gets 40+ MPG whether there are two people on it or just one. WHEW!

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                    #10
                    Birdman,
                    Great to hear you got her running good!
                    Charlie

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                      #11
                      Sometimes you just have to be persiant

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                        #12
                        Excellent tech!

                        How exactly does one go about synching the carbs though? (the way you describe the initial problems sounds very similiar to a problem I am now having with my '78 GS1000)

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by Psychoholic
                          Excellent tech!

                          How exactly does one go about synching the carbs though? (the way you describe the initial problems sounds very similiar to a problem I am now having with my '78 GS1000)
                          I bought a set of Motion Pro mercury carburetor sticks from JCW for about $40.

                          There is a 6mm plug screw and copper washer in each of the intake manifold tubes (between the carb and head) that has to be removed and then the adaptors that come with the carb sticks screw into the manifolds where the screws were (put the long adaptors inboard). Slip the tubes from the carb sticks onto the adaptors (make sure they're hooked up so that column 1 goes to carb 1 - the leftmost one - and column 2 goes to carb 2, etc. to avoid confusion. I know, kind of a "duh", but I know a few people who don't quite get that...).

                          Remove the gas tank (I made an auxilliary tank from an old washer fluid bottle, some gas line fittings, a petcock and some clear fuel line, with an inline filter between the aux tank and carb fuel inlet; you can also buy one from JCW or Dennis Kirk).

                          Remove the carb top covers. Leave the air filter(s) in place. Otherwise, you will be running leaner than normal and not get an accurate reading.

                          Start the bike and get it to operating temperature (blow air from a household box fan on the engine while running it to keep it from overheating. A hot engine will also melt the plastic tubes coming from the carb stix, too, so be careful!) Use the remote idle control knob (underneath the carbs) to adjust the idle to about 1500-2000 RPM's. DO NOT, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, REV THE MOTOR AND THEN LET GO OF THE THROTTLE WHILE THE CARB STIX ARE HOOKED UP!!! THE SUDDEN VACUUM CREATED UPON RELEASING THE THROTTLE COULD SUCK MERCURY OUT OF THE COLUMNS AND INTO THE ENGINE. MERCURY IS POISONOUS, SO USE EXTREME CAUTION!!!

                          Pick the carb that seems to have the median point on the mercury columns to use as the "reference carb". You will try to match all the other carbs to it.

                          You will then need an 8mm wrench and a long, narrow-bladed flat screwdriver (or, again, you can buy a special tool from JCW or Dennis Kirk). Put the 8mm wrench on the locknut at the top of the carb slide and loosen it. Then, while keeping the wrench on the nut, use the screwdriver to adjust each carb until the mercury columns are all even or as close to even as possible. Once this is accomplished, hold the screwdriver in place to keep the adjuster stationary while tightening the jam-nut back up again. Minor tweaking here and there may be required, but as long as the difference between the highest and lowest mercury columns is within 1/2 inch or so you should be fine. The columns won't necessarily stay steady (they'll likely pulse a little), but the adjustment of the idle to 1500-2000 RPM will help reduce this tendency.

                          Once the carbs are synched, and the jam-nuts are retightened, replace the carb top covers (and gaskets, too, if needed).

                          Use the idle control knob to re-adjust your idle back down between 1000-1200 RPM's. You want the lowest that will still run smoothly while idling. Mine is about 1100.

                          Let the engine cool, then pull the tubes off the manifold adaptors (warm plastic can stretch and tear more easily). Remove the adaptors, then replace the plug screws and sealing washers.

                          Replace the gas tank.

                          Enjoy!


                          BTW, my bad. They're NOT flatslides. They're the stock Mikuni VM26SS carbs that came with the bike. With no experience myself worth speaking of, I listened to someone whom I THOUGHT knew better who took a quick glance at them and said "they're flatslides". Oh, well. Teach me to do my own research...

                          Comment


                            #14
                            JCW

                            Interesting about the carb balancing. I may have to do that. I have owned a 79 GS1000 since new. 80k+ km's on it now. I have the rattle at idle, replaced the charging system. Haven't done much else except tires, brakes, chain, plugs & points. And oh yea, fork seals, twice.
                            Just wanted to know about JCW. Do they have a website? Want to buy the kit you used.
                            Also need float needles and seats and want to know a good source for parts.
                            Current problem with bike is sticky sliders, and fuel petcock doesn't stop the fuel completly when engine is off.
                            Oh, yea, I also need a tach.


                            Thanks a bunch..

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