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    I'm looking for very specific advice on my GS550L rebuild

    Hi,


    This is my first time posting. I just bought a 1981 GS550L, my first bike, for $200, and among a few minor other things (mostly cosmetic), it really just had an oil leak (bad head gasket and a few other gaskets that I've ordered and am soon to install with a friend) and very dirty carbs that were running quite rich I think.

    I've torn it apart somewhat now, mostly to clean the engine and replace all the gaskets and stuff. The valves and pistons have lots of carbon buildup on them. Although I think my work installing all new gaskets and making all necessary engine adjustments (along with the professional job I'm having done on the carbs right now - cleaning, replacing anything needed and calibration) will make the engine run okay, I really want to remove all the carbon from the valves and pistons. Is something like ZMax a good idea. I've actually gone ahead and tried to clean them with "Gunk" Engine Bright, which I think says "don't use on motorcycles" (I ignored that - is that OK?) and is more for grease, oil, dust and grime on the outside of the engine parts than inside carbon buildup, and it wasn't that effective. That won't really harm the engine, will it?

    The problem is, the bike has only 12,000 original miles (the previous owner(s) left it out to rot basically) and I kind of want to replace the valve head (piece below camshafts and above cylinders?) because one of the fins on the exterior of the piece is damaged, and the entire piece doesn't look nearly as good as one I saw at the salvage yard today from a 78 GS550 with like 35,000 miles on it.

    Should I:

    A. Rebuild my existing parts using all the new gaskets, then use an engine treatment (if so, which one(s), ZMax?) to clean the carbon out after it's back together.

    B. The same thing with the piece from the salvage yard (looks much[/i:
    c44e70bcab] better on the outside (obviously I'd have to check for interior cracks and stuff), but does have over 20,000 miles more than mine, which really just looks bad and has carbon buildup.

    C. Somehow clean all the carbon before rebuilding orginal piece. If so, how and with what do I do this?

    D. same as C but with the piece from the salvaged bike.

    E. something I haven't thought of, explain please.

    For all the above - should I actually get new valves? Where?


    Next, I wanted to go with a higher performance exhaust for two reasons. First, mine have to have a lot of work put in to look good, and new ones would be, well, new! Second, I'm a big guy and the 48 horses I'm making when I make the bike spec are a little weak for what I'd like, so I'm looking to add power. If I did this, I'd consider a 4 into 1 but would really like to keep the 4 into 2 stock look but add power. I would also the K & N clamp on racing air kit that replaces the standard air box assemble with the metallic cone things to give (supposedly) power increases of up to 12% for about $110, then rejet the carbs to run best with this new intake/exhaust flow. The guy at the place I'm having the carbs done at strongly advised me to basically keep the bike stock because the power increases I want wouldn't really be there and the normally smooth running engine might have problems. I grudgingly took his word for, but i had to draw the line somewhere.

    He even told me I really shouldn't replace even the stock air filter with a K & N stock filter replacement ([i:c44e70bcab]NOT
    the clamp on kit), but I can't understand why. K & N has been making world class filters that racers and municipalities have been using for years and they very specifically claim no rejetting or other adjustmenst are needed (there are adjustmenst and rejetting needed with the clamp on kit). I went ahead and ordered just the filter replacement ($50 or so) anyway against his advice.

    Am I right o
    r is he. Am I taking a risk with the lifetime guaranteed K & N, or will I be fine?

    Would I have been better off given my performance wishes to also go against his advice and get a new non-OEM exhaust and the K & N clamp on kit?

    I'm also repainting the tank and side covers which badly need it. I've been quoted $300 for a complete preparation (stripping, rust removal, etc) of my tank and side covers, 4 coats of solid color paint and a clear coat. Is this a good idea or should I try to paint it myself?

    One last thing. In my quest to make the engione look new and shiny, I'm considering experimenting with some of that high temp silver paint that I could paint onto engine parts, especially the front. Anyone ever try this and have advice?

    Anyone know about plastic chrome look cylinder head, cam, and other covers for a GS and where to get them if they're worth it?

    Anyone know of a good place to order new bolt sets that shine and stay tight?

    Anyone have advice on chrome engine guards and/or highway footpegs and where to get them?

    I know this post is hopelessly long but I figured it might be best to get everything out at once as a reference. Anyway, I'll be thrilled by any help or advice and will do my best to contribute to everyone else's projects too!

    #2
    Welcome,

    You should have a fine machine there with a little time and a lot of money. I am currently in the process of a complete facelift for my tired GS1100, so I have a pretty good idea of where you are coming from. Lets see if I can shed some light on some of your questions:

    The gaskets are no problem, I hope you didn't pay retail at a shop. I just got a set off a member of this site. Full set of engine gaskets - approx. $50. Just did a head replacement and sure enough, lots of carbon to clean. I was told the best thing was to let some carb cleaner or "foamy brite" soak for a while, then scrub with nylon or brass bristle brush. Are you talking about a ZMAX treatment that you put in the fuel and drive it clean? If so, forget about it. I spent years using those feul injector cleaners, Slick 50 and so on in my car to make it run better. Products like these are just snake oils, and don't actually do a damn thing. Spend some time tearing down the engine. If it needs cleaning, clean it. If the fuel system is dirty, clean it. If you have carbon build up- you get the idea.

    Can't imagine the head needs new valves. If it is worth buying then they should be fine. Make sure the cams and notably the journels look good. Cams are machined to within 1/1000 of an inch tolerance to the head so make sure you are getting a head with the original cams in it- they wear at the same rate, a good thing.

    I thought about making the move to pod filters. Keep in mind that getting the carbs set up right can be a royal pain in the butt. I can't seem to find a willing mechanic to do a carb sync! My problem, not yours. Also, I believe you may be a little optimistic about the horsepower gains. Even with the upgrades you are talking here, on your 550 I would be suprised to see more than a 5% power gain. Get that bike running clean and it should scoot along pretty good. The mechanic is somewhat correct if you think about it. Suzuki designed the bike to
    run great straight off the boat. If you feed the stock motor more air and fuel without increasing the displacment, you could have some problems. The engine will run at a higher temp and higher stress loads. Hope I don't sound like a jerk here, but if you want more ponies, look around for a 750 or 1100.

    K & N direct replacment? I can't see it doing any harm, I know guys that have run them for years. However, these are guys who dump money into thier rides for no reason at all other than the sake of tinkering. The K & N filter will not perform any better or worse than the 3 or 4 paper filters you could buy with the same money.

    Repaint- did you see the "In the Garage" topic on the home paint job? I was going to go that way until I bought a new factory painted gas tank. Now I have less pieces to paint (less money) but they need to match better. Unless you are looking for a 4 tone pearl color fade job, I say go it yourself. Follow the directions in the article I mentioned perfectly and it should look pretty pro. Let us know how it comes out!

    I have talked to lots of guys who have painted the engine black, I would be interested if someone has done silver with good results. One good idea a friend told me (he restores cars), have the engine cases glass-blasted, then chrome or polish the covers. A lot of work to tear it down, but I guess it brings it back to like new condition. I plan on having this done next winter as well as have the frame and wheels powder coated.

    As to where to get parts? Everything I have ever needed has come from three sources: GSResources, E-Bay and bikebandit.com. Never bought from him, but oldkawman.com has lots of used stuff for early '80's bikes. If you need something, put the word out onthis forum, and I can gaurentee you will get offers or at least advise on where to get what you want.

    Hope all goes well, keep us posted as to your progress, and submitt a photo to the gallery!
    Currently bikeless
    '81 GS 1100EX - "Peace, by superior fire power."
    '06 FZ1000 - "What we are dealing with here, is a COMPLETE lack of respect for the law."

    I ride, therefore I am.... constantly buying new tires.

    "Tell me what kind of an accident you are going to have, and I will tell you which helmet to wear." - Harry Hurt

    Comment


      #3
      Next, I wanted to go with a higher performance exhaust for two reasons. First, mine have to have a lot of work put in to look good, and new ones would be, well, new! Second, I'm a big guy and the 48 horses I'm making when I make the bike spec are a little weak for what I'd like, so I'm looking to add power. If I did this, I'd consider a 4 into 1 but would really like to keep the 4 into 2 stock look but add power. I would also the K & N clamp on racing air kit that replaces the standard air box assemble with the metallic cone things to give (supposedly) power increases of up to 12% for about $110, then rejet the carbs to run best with this new intake/exhaust flow. The guy at the place I'm having the carbs done at strongly advised me to basically keep the bike stock because the power increases I want wouldn't really be there and the normally smooth running engine might have problems. I grudgingly took his word for, but i had to draw the line somewhere.
      Id keep the stock airbox too, Ive seen a lot of badly running bikes with K+N pod filters, and usually putting in a new air filter would give you nearly the same improvement anyway.
      The 4-1 will give some power gains up higher in the rev range, but at the expense of lower speed running, so when you are revving the motor it can feel good, but it wont behave as good low down. I figure if Im after a power gain that much, I just go to bellmouth intakes with a flashback mesh over them and bugger the extra wear...
      And one last thing, if you are going to get the engine blast cleaned, please get it vapour blasted, any form of shot/glass etc blasting will always leave some tiny particles where it shouldnt, but vapour blasting uses water that evaporates...

      Comment


        #4
        Thanks for the reply and advice! I have some answers to your questions and advice and at the end I have some new questions.


        Originally posted by Jethro
        Welcome,

        You should have a fine machine there with a little time and a lot of money. I am currently in the process of a complete facelift for my tired GS1100, so I have a pretty good idea of where you are coming from. Lets see if I can shed some light on some of your questions:

        The gaskets are no problem, I hope you didn't pay retail at a shop. I just got a set off a member of this site. Full set of engine gaskets - approx. $50. Just did a head replacement and sure enough, lots of carbon to clean. I was told the best thing was to let some carb cleaner or "foamy brite" soak for a while, then scrub with nylon or brass bristle brush. Are you talking about a ZMAX treatment that you put in the fuel and drive it clean? If so, forget about it. I spent years using those feul injector cleaners, Slick 50 and so on in my car to make it run better. Products like these are just snake oils, and don't actually do a damn thing. Spend some time tearing down the engine. If it needs cleaning, clean it. If the fuel system is dirty, clean it. If you have carbon build up- you get the idea.
        I paid $78 for the gasket set off of denniskirk.com (in my opinion a great site with great supply, prices and service). I haven't installed any of them yet because I'm still just finishing taking the bike apart. I did use a wire brush along with some Engine Brite to clean the piston crowns (am also going to do the valve openings when I get a circular brush) and had great results - Thanks! My Haynes manual says to actually polish the pistons. Is this a good idea and can I use regular motorcycle metal polish like Luster?

        I really don't know for sure, but everything I've heard about ZMAX says that it, unlike all the other engine treatments out there, actually breaks
        down everything and improves fuel economy. This may or may not be true, but they're infomercial is pretty impressive. I'm going to go ahead and do it after my complete restoration is done, but I can completely understand you being skeptical as it has now been basically proven that Slick 50 and the like don't do squat.

        Can't imagine the head needs new valves. If it is worth buying then they should be fine. Make sure the cams and notably the journels look good. Cams are machined to within 1/1000 of an inch tolerance to the head so make sure you are getting a head with the original cams in it- they wear at the same rate, a good thing.
        I agree that I shouldn't at all need new valves, but should I have my cams rebuilt (now that my novice self took apart nearly the whole bike) professionally if they're so sensitive?


        I thought about making the move to pod filters. Keep in mind that getting the carbs set up right can be a royal pain in the butt. I can't seem to find a willing mechanic to do a carb sync! My problem, not yours. Also, I believe you may be a little optimistic about the horsepower gains. Even with the upgrades you are talking here, on your 550 I would be suprised to see more than a 5% power gain. Get that bike running clean and it should scoot along pretty good. The mechanic is somewhat correct if you think about it. Suzuki designed the bike to run great straight off the boat. If you feed the stock motor more air and fuel without increasing the displacment, you could have some problems. The engine will run at a higher temp and higher stress loads. Hope I don't sound like a jerk here, but if you want more ponies, look around for a 750 or 1100.
        I also doubt I'd get substantial power gains with the pod filters. However, I did buy (but haven't installed) the standard K & N replacement filter. I've read that they may give nearly the power gain that the clamp on kit does (may
        be a 2 or 3 hp gain on the GS550) for half the price. Once again, I may be wrong but just not having to buy an air filter ever again was worth the extra to get the K&N. I also want to keep the stock exhaust, but while disassembling it I realized that the whole section where the headers meet the mufflers is in really bad shape. Bad enough, in fact, for me to want a new one for appearance and reliability reasons. The problem is, they don't make the stock headers anymore, just the mufflers, and those are $200 for each side, whereas most aftermarket ones (4 into 2) are only like $300 for the whole system including headers, mufflers, mounting hardware, etc.

        I really don't want to, but unless I can find some pretty decent stock headers at least (I may be able to get by with my mufflers with some conditioning) I may have to go with an aftermarket 4 into 1 and hope either myself or my mechanic can properly rejet the carbs which I assume will be needed. If I do I believe I will go with the Marshall deep chrome 4 into 1. I was led to it by a great thread about 550 exhuasts (on Laser Exhausts' website). Any thoughts on that anybody?

        K & N direct replacment? I can't see it doing any harm, I know guys that have run them for years. However, these are guys who dump money into thier rides for no reason at all other than the sake of tinkering. The K & N filter will not perform any better or worse than the 3 or 4 paper filters you could buy with the same money.

        Repaint- did you see the "In the Garage" topic on the home paint job? I was going to go that way until I bought a new factory painted gas tank. Now I have less pieces to paint (less money) but they need to match better. Unless you are looking for a 4 tone pearl color fade job, I say go it yourself. Follow the directions in the article I mentioned perfectly and it should look pretty pro. Let us know how it comes out!
        Thanks, I'm glad I've been convinced to drop the idea of paying for t
        he paintjob. I'm going to do it myself. Although most tradittionalists won't like it, I'm going to go with a copper metallic type color. I let you guys have the before and after pics when they're ready.

        I have talked to lots of guys who have painted the engine black, I would be interested if someone has done silver with good results. One good idea a friend told me (he restores cars), have the engine cases glass-blasted, then chrome or polish the covers. A lot of work to tear it down, but I guess it brings it back to like new condition. I plan on having this done next winter as well as have the frame and wheels powder coated.

        As to where to get parts? Everything I have ever needed has come from three sources: GSResources, E-Bay and bikebandit.com. Never bought from him, but oldkawman.com has lots of used stuff for early '80's bikes. If you need something, put the word out onthis forum, and I can gaurentee you will get offers or at least advise on where to get what you want.

        Hope all goes well, keep us posted as to your progress, and submitt a photo to the gallery!
        I'm strongly considering just glassblasting (or vapor blasting) the engine and transmission covers while they're off the bike (to prevent getting the glass media from getting where it shouldn't), then using my finish restorer, metal polish and sealer. I checked out oldkawman, very good site. I also like denniskirk.com, very quick delivery and great selection/prices.

        Thanks again!

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by MrFluffy
          Id keep the stock airbox too, Ive seen a lot of badly running bikes with K+N pod filters, and usually putting in a new air filter would give you nearly the same improvement anyway.
          The 4-1 will give some power gains up higher in the rev range, but at the expense of lower speed running, so when you are revving the motor it can feel good, but it wont behave as good low down. I figure if Im after a power gain that much, I just go to bellmouth intakes with a flashback mesh over them and bugger the extra wear...
          And one last thing, if you are going to get the engine blast cleaned, please get it vapour blasted, any form of shot/glass etc blasting will always leave some tiny particles where it shouldnt, but vapour blasting uses water that evaporates...
          Good point about the blasting. I have the covers all off so I think I'm going to do them that way and not get debris inside.

          Two last things:

          1. I really don't at all want an aftermarket exhaust let alone a 4 into 1 (which seems to be all thats available), but if it's between that and using my existing original exhaust with a big whole in it, I will lean towards a 4 into 1 (Motad, Marshall, or Mac?). Any advice either on which one to go with, a good set of stock herders I can buy, or on the method of rejetting required?

          2. I am stuck at a point where the screws that attach the gearbox cover to the gearbox case are becomming stripped and seem absolutely impossible to budge. Any help on removing (shouldn't they be bolts anyway?) them by some means? I haven't tried to sodder or weld anything to them yet, but everything short of that. Am I going to have to have this done professionally? I hope not but I don't know what to do.

          Comment


            #6
            I assume the screws you are referring to are phillips head machine screws? If so, take a large, flat tipped punch and hammer and flatten the heads enough to ALMOST close the phillips slots. Then take a #3 phillips bit and hammer and drive the bit into the closed slots, resphaping/cutting the slots. Put the #3 bit into an impact driver that you use a hammer with. (do not use an air impact driver) Hold the impact driver down onto the screw very tightly and hit it once...HARD (be certain you have the correct rotation set on the impact driver). Reposition the driver, hold it again tightly and strike once again with a hammer. The screws will usually undo on the first strike, sometimes on the second. I've never needed more than two tries. Peening the heads and doing this will require that you replace the screws afterwards as they can only be peened, recut and removed once.

            Earl

            Earl


            [quote="teamCHItown
            2. I am stuck at a point where the screws that attach the gearbox cover to the gearbox case are becomming stripped and seem absolutely impossible to budge. Any help on removing (shouldn't they be bolts anyway?) them by some means?
            Komorebi-The light filtering through the trees.

            I would rather sit on a pumpkin and have it all to myself than be crowded on a velvet cushion. H.D.T.

            Comment


              #7
              I have the 4-1 Marshall Deeptone exhaust o my '78 GS750 and seperate K&N filters with bigger main jets too.
              The Marshall is nice pipe I think, sounds good too.
              It puts out a little over 60 bhp at the rear wheel wich is a little more than stock but then again the engine has never been rebuilt and has over 40.000 miles on it.

              Comment


                #8
                screw heads

                And failing the previous method working, I use a centre punch and use it to tap the screw on the outer edge of the head in the direction I want it to go (not too close to the case though, or you'll end up centre popping the screw then nobody will get it out), the shock helps loosen it, and it doesnt matter if someones completely destroyed the head section already. Works good on stripped allen (hex) bolts too, but easier if you grind the tip into a little flat like a chisel for these. Best idea is not to butcher the heads, and best trick for this is to buy a expensive screwdriver, that fits the heads properly, I shelled out ?30 on two snap on screwdrivers that cover most the screws on jap bike cases years ago, and its a worthwhile investment 7 years down the road...
                If push comes to shove, I drill off the heads, then once the case is out the way, theres 8mm or so sticking out I can get some tiny vice grips on (I use facom's amazing brevettes for this), theyve usually gone slack at this point from the tension being off and the vibration of the drilling, and mostly come out with just fingers never mind the vice grip.
                You can get hex bolt sets to fit the gs motor's from custom fasteners, mr fastner etc, probally order a set from your local bike emporium, theyll contain all the screws to change on the motor that are currently cheese head...
                Sorry dont have any real advice on the pipes, usually a half reputable brand will come with instructions on how to jet up for them on a stock bike. I usually just end up fabricating my own pipes anyway....

                Comment


                  #9
                  For Jethro:

                  I've painted the engine, silver that is.
                  You can see the results in the gallery, 79 GS850GN.
                  Did the same thing with a GS850GT, the paint sat for three years, without any problems.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    2. I am stuck at a point where the screws that attach the gearbox cover to the gearbox case are becomming stripped and seem absolutely impossible to budge. Any help on removing (shouldn't they be bolts anyway?) them by some means? I haven't tried to sodder or weld anything to them yet, but everything short of that. Am I going to have to have this done professionally? I hope not but I don't know what to do.
                    Make sure you never use anything other the impact driver Earl spoke of. Those things are like a freakin' miracle. I've been a hack home mechanic for years and for some reason never came across one until I got my GS. I wrestled with the case bolts for a whole weekend stripping them and not making any headway. I gave up and let the stator cover leak on my left boot. A month later I was complaining about Suzukis' use of Phillips bolts to a bike shop sales guy and he simply said, "why aren't you using one of these?" He showed me a simple impact wrench and how it worked. I bought one at Wal-Mart for $14.99 and was able to effortlessly break free all the stripped bolts. It was so easy that I didn't even replace the bolts! I have total confidence with that tool. It cut the head back into shape! Maybe you have one and have used it already, but if you don't, go buy one right now. If I only new of these things when I was 15 years old...

                    About the muffler, I have a little input in that regard. After my stock setup rotted away, I bought a 4 into 1 Vance and Hines job. It sounded great even though I never did a re-jet of the carbs like it said to due. It snapped, crackled and popped loudly on decompresion but I kind of liked the renegade / outcast thing. After that one fell off (can you tell that the bike spent every winter buried up to the gas tank in a snowbank? oops...) I bought a MAC
                    4 into 1 off ebay to replace it. What a piece of garbage! It's clear that the workmanship is not there. Has anyone else had this opinion of MAC or did I just buy some pice of crap leftover that everyone else had the sense to avoid? Reason I ask is that after all this I want to get it back to a stock look sound and feel, and unless I hit the megabucks and can afford a brand new OEM Suzuki exhaust I am stuck with the MAC 4 into 2 model. Just what am I trying to say teamCHItown asks? Keep an eye out on Ebay for a good stock unit to come around. I looked in the Dennis Kirk catalog and didn't see to many options for you. What have you come across?
                    Currently bikeless
                    '81 GS 1100EX - "Peace, by superior fire power."
                    '06 FZ1000 - "What we are dealing with here, is a COMPLETE lack of respect for the law."

                    I ride, therefore I am.... constantly buying new tires.

                    "Tell me what kind of an accident you are going to have, and I will tell you which helmet to wear." - Harry Hurt

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I've painted the engine, silver that is.
                      You can see the results in the gallery, 79 GS850GN.
                      Did the same thing with a GS850GT, the paint sat for three years, without any problems.
                      The silver paint job looks terrific! Does it look a lot brighter than a new stock finish? It looks quite bright, but maybe It's just the comparason between my greasy, oily, filthy motor. I like it, and plan to do the same to mine this winter!

                      P.S. Nice touch with the eyes from your avitar on the fork brace! Sweet!
                      Currently bikeless
                      '81 GS 1100EX - "Peace, by superior fire power."
                      '06 FZ1000 - "What we are dealing with here, is a COMPLETE lack of respect for the law."

                      I ride, therefore I am.... constantly buying new tires.

                      "Tell me what kind of an accident you are going to have, and I will tell you which helmet to wear." - Harry Hurt

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Jethro

                        I bought a MAC 4 into 1 off ebay to replace it. What a piece of garbage! It's clear that the workmanship is not there. Has anyone else had this opinion of MAC or did I just buy some pice of crap leftover that everyone else had the sense to avoid?
                        Yes, I have heard this from other people and have seen the systems. They do look cheap and sound crappy. :?
                        Kevin
                        E-Bay: gsmcyclenut
                        "Communism doesn't work because people like to own stuff." Frank Zappa

                        1978 GS750(x2 "projects"), 1983 GS1100ED (slowly becoming a parts bike), 1982 GS1100EZ,
                        Now joined the 21st century, 2013 Yamaha XTZ1200 Super Tenere.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Thanks for all the advice everybody. This place is really helpful. I got the impact driver and the technique to get the screws out is working great.

                          I'm definitely not getting the Mac exhaust, but I very well may get the Marshall Deeptone 4 into 1 setup. Should I rejet the carbs myself or have a mechanic do it?

                          I'm just about to buy some brand new chrome engine gaurds for the bike but I also want to get forward pegs. Can I install both or do they connect at the same spot usually?

                          Here is the link to the engine guards:



                          Here is the link to the forward pegs:



                          To me it looks like both will fit but I'm a novice.

                          Thoughts?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            ebay pipes

                            ebay motors has some stock gs550
                            pipes right now. Sorry I don't know the
                            number.

                            Comment

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