Big Block Engine On The Street?

[Hap Call]

Contrary to the above post, a motor that big should have the crank welded.

Jay

Jay, you're very correct that the crank needs to be welded if you build a large displacement motor, and I'm fairly sure that lecroy agrees with you but I believe he was was talking about the guy who did not expect the price tag from Falicon when he sent the crank in for rehab - sticker shock caught him in the nads. The guy was starting to question if it was worth all the money to build a mega motor for a GS if my memory serves me right.

Hap

[lecroy]

I never stated that the crank should not be welded. What I was referring too was the poor fellow who had sent his crank to your company, APE, to have welded and when he received it, it was not true. He would have been much further ahead had he spent the money and sent it to a crank builder.

I think Ray is in the ballpark with his numbers. Figure..
Head: $1500 - $3000 (port, valves, springs, rockers? )
Crank: $1000 - $1400 (all new bearings, maybe rods, full weld...)
Transmission: $500 - $1100
Block & pistons: $1200 (nothing special, no gas port etc)
Prep cases: $100
Clutch: $1200 (lockup, billet basket, SC gear....)
Cams: $300
Oil pickup and new pump: $150
Case and head stud kits: $300

You can buy bigger pistons and slap them onto a 20+ year old stock motor, but don't expect things to live. You can also send your crank to APE to be welded, just don't expect them to do anything but weld it for $100.

Once you start talking this much cash, may as well get a new bike...

[Big Jay]

Contrary to the above post, a motor that big should have the crank welded.

Jay

[lecroy]

Contrary to the above post, a motor that big should have the crank welded.

Jay

LOL. Jay, I'll let your responce speak for itself.

[madjack57754]

If you want to know, ask a pro. Jay is the ultimate pro. His company has built more of these motors than most any of us has ever seen

[lecroy]

Seems like if he treats one of our members wrong, its a good thing to point it out.

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=106071&highlight=APE

Refunding Rif's $100 would have gone a long way to to say we stand behind our work.

[Big Jay]

The puyrpose of welding the crank is to keep it from twisting under load. We check them to make sure they are not twisted by running a precision ground rod thru all four wrist pin holes. If it goes, it is not twisted and we weld it. If it is twisted we do not weld it, and notify the customer that the crank will have to be sent to Gardner Racing for rebuild.

Our service to roller bearing cranks is limited to and only to what I stated above. We have never aluded to doing anything else to these cranks. No one has ever received a welded crank from us that was twisted out of index.

Apparently there are some who do not understand what this service really is, so I wrote this.

Jay

[lecroy]

Jay, is it possible that you missed a step. Maybe running the index rod back through after you weld it or before you return it to the customer.

"No one has ever received a welded crank from us that was twisted out of index."

This is exactly what this persons complaint was. It was returned twisted, but also welded.

[Big Jay]

If I remember reading that post. he had issues with runout. Like the end taper ran out, or the center bearing races ran out, etc.

This is a completely different deal that the crank being twisted. We don't do repairs on roller bearing cranks.

If you have ever seen one that has been welded, there is not a lot of weld on it. Not a chance that it warped of twisted from the welding.

Over the last 30 years, we have welded these cranks and have welded pristine cranks, and boarder line junk cranks. The only time we won't weld them is if they are twisted, or if we can tell by feel that a rod bearing is on it's way out, etc. Everything else they send in for weld is welded.

If one wants to send their crank off and get it back perfectly trued and indexed, nice bearings, AND then welded. They have to send it to Gardner.



Jay

[lecroy]

Or John Pearson.....

[schinae]

Or John Pearson.....

Back to the origional subject. I run my 1426cc big block bike on the street all the time. Its so much fun to see the look on peoples faces when the historic tagged suzuki drops the hammer and leaves half the rear tire on pavement...

However, consider the cost to make this thing reliable, powerful, and streetable.
Welded crank, billet clutch basket, cams, p&p, oversize valves, big block, low enough compression pistons to handle the pump gas (I often run homemade additive, especially in the serious heat of the summer). I have an oil cooler, which I have run without but not if you are going to be in traffic. On the open road, the oil temp gets up over 200 but under 250... In traffic it climbs over 200 quickly (without cooler) and its not something I would recomend running without. May need to get into the bottom end and undercut the trans.. mine are.

On top of that you have all the standard upgrades that a motor that big needs, like 38mm flatslides, nice k&n filters, dyna ignition and coils, an exhaust (and you will need to work out the baffle thing, mine just blows the fiberglass right out the back after a season there isnt much left, maybe use steel wool), extended swingarm (a few inches will allow you to ride to the track, run well and ride home), freshen up the brakes with SS lines, good pads, master rebuild (gotta stop when your going 140mph), etc. etc. etc. and you could probably buy something as fast for less that wouldnt require as much attention and love. None the less, I love mine and wouldn't have it any other way. Also, 2 up riding becomes a non-issue as the extra weight really takes a toll heat wise, even on a short trip around town.

Pics for views, I purchased the bike with the motor already done for a great deal but to start from scratch would be killer.

[lecroy]

Not to change the subject again but damn son, that's a nice looking ride!

[Big Jay]

Yes... Very nice!!

Jay

[schinae]

Thank you both...

Anyone else out there? I know there a bunch of European streetfighter guys who run big block GS motors, anyones else stateside?

[Big Jay]

Thank you both...

Anyone else out there? I know there a bunch of European streetfighter guys who run big block GS motors, anyones else stateside?

I do know there are a lot out there.

Jay