TCK's GS1100ESD Gixxer/Bandit mod thread...

[TheCafeKid]

Here's an interesting question... What width of wheel do you need to run a 120 front & a 170-180 rear & how much different is that from the width required to run a 150-160 rear?

Just out of interest. I wondered if a wheel for a 180 tyre could be stepped down to a 160/150 if clearance became an issue.


Dan

I think you could easily step down to a 170, and thats what alot of guys have ended up doing to get around clearance issues, and if need be, thats what I will do. But I dont think you can get a 160 in the same rim. I may be wrong, like I said, i am a total newb in the MODERN bike territory...

[posplayr]

From what I have read

4"x18 wide is best for 150/70-18 radial, (stock GSXR 86-87 1100)
4.5"x18 is best for 160/60-18 radial (stock GSXR 88 1100)
5.5"x17 is best for 180/55-17 radial Standard 2nd gen Gixxer

The radial ties don't tolerate rim/tire mismatch as well as bias tires.

Edit:

To run a 120/70 radial you should use a 3.5" wheel. A 160 rear should be on a 4.5" wheel and a 180 on a 5.5" wheel.

Like Billy Said

[RJ]

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that what Kichigai did was some figment of his imagination, I'm just relaying what I needed to do the fit the rear wheel. The actual gist of my response was more related to what kind of swingarm you were going to use.

[gs scott]

Just Curious

Have you thought about the front wheel size and fender? The stock fender for a 19" wheel will have a larger radius than the intended 17" wheel to be installed. I'm sure the matching GSXR front fender will go on - would you paint it white (and like the way it looks?)

A data point; I read that a guy installed an 84 1100ES rear wheel that was wider than the 83 ES, so he got a wider (and I think bigger, 18") tire without any clearance or swingarm issues. I can't confirm the accuracy of that statement, and you're planning a lot more, but a data point to consider.

Anyway, good luck - sounds like one heck of a trick ride when you're done!

[TheCafeKid]

The whole front end will be Gixxer, fender, wheel, forks, brakes and all. Minus the fairing of course. Also, im sure you meant an 84 1150ES, as there was no 1100ES in 84, at least stateside. I have considered a few different options, to be honest. But in the end, I think the best bang for the buck will be what I have chosen to do. And, as said, the best part to me is that its completely reversible. I wouldnt do it otherwise.

[salty_monk]

4"x18 wide is best for 150/70-18 radial, (stock GSXR 86-87 1100)
4.5"x18 is best for 160/60-18 radial (stock GSXR 88 1100)
5.5"x17 is best for 180/55-17 radial Standard 2nd gen Gixxer

The radial ties don't tolerate rim/tire mismatch as well as bias tires.

Edit:


Like Billy Said

How does this affect tyre availability? I believe 160's are hard to get? Would a 150 fit the 4.5" & a 170 fit the 5.5"?

Dan

[Billy Ricks]

How does this affect tyre availability? I believe 160's are hard to get? Would a 150 fit the 4.5" & a 170 fit the 5.5"?

Dan

Shouldn't be a problem going down one size. That would be preferable to going up a size when it comes to radials. Watch Ebay for race take offs. I picked up a set of Michelin Power Pilots in a race compund for about $80 with about 90% of the tread left. The set was a 120 up front and a 160 in the rear. At that price I can afford to wear out a race compund tire a couple of times a year.

[mullesaurus]

Again, as I said quite a few times in my introduction to this thread: I WILL NOT ALTER THE FRAME PERMANENTLY IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM. This grinding is not at all necessary using either of the swingarms if you use the correct offset sprocket. Reading thru Kichigai's thread on this mod on this EXACT bike, he didnt have to grind anything, and instead of using a 5/8ths offset like everyone assumed and suggested, he tried a 13mm offset, and had a 1/4inch of clearance on each side without altering anything.

i have been wondering, does that 1/8" not make any significant difference lining up the sprockets? would it be a good idea to machine a bit off the sprocket carrier when using less offset? it seems the 13mm offset works well for kichigai. why does everyone run the 5/8" if the 1/2" is a better fit?

[rapidray]

i have been wondering, does that 1/8" not make any significant difference lining up the sprockets? would it be a good idea to machine a bit off the sprocket carrier when using less offset? it seems the 13mm offset works well for kichigai. why does everyone run the 5/8" if the 1/2" is a better fit?

MOSTLY because the 5/8 offset is a readily available, easy to get part. PLUS, it works & the PMFR offset is one of the nicest ones made. It also LOOKS nice! Most of us that drag race on small tire bikes use the 5/8 offset & they work great & support the output shaft very well. Ray.

[Nessism]

Hey Josh,

I know you want to have the mods be reversible but a little grinding to gain clearance doesn't sound like anything to be concern with. A GS1100 doesn't have exorbitant collectors value or anything, so no real worry from a value standpoint.

At any rate, sounds like a fun project. I agree with the others suggesting finding the value center of the project - so keeping the stock swingarm seems reasonable.

Enjoy and keep us posted on the project.

[TheCafeKid]

Hey Josh,

I know you want to have the mods be reversible but a little grinding to gain clearance doesn't sound like anything to be concern with. A GS1100 doesn't have exorbitant collectors value or anything, so no real worry from a value standpoint.

At any rate, sounds like a fun project. I agree with the others suggesting finding the value center of the project - so keeping the stock swingarm seems reasonable.

Enjoy and keep us posted on the project.

The value center of the project for me isnt a monetary thing. To me at this point, its performance vs performance, and using a proven method vs one that currently doenst have alot of info available... there are more on here to garner info from that have done the Bandit swingarm vs those who have used the modified stock arm and used HARDER to find 86-88 gixxer 1100 parts. The performance gain there isnt, in my opinion worth the amount of headache, searching for parts, and the "invisible" money spent on trial and error with a lesser known mod set up. I did that with the cafe, and spent an unreasonable amount of money trying this and that, vs using a tried and true method, and in the end, while im pretty happy with the turn out, the overall gains werent what i was hoping for. This set up that im going with has all the bugs worked out thru other people trying it, and finding better ways of doing things, and in the end, isnt THAT much more expensive than using other mod methods. The total price im looking at for the winter mods isnt JUST the suspension, i am including a total refurbish of the frame, some motor mods, and repaint.

And, while I agree the 1100 isnt that huge on the collector list now, the ES is a bit more rare than the EZ/ED and perhaps one day will have some collector value. It certainly will to me. Again, my plan is to use the ES as the test bed for the suspension mods this winter. I will ride it next season with that set up, and in the fall look for a basket case or a lil better 1100ED. I will use THAT bike to swap the susp mods to, and also be installing a 140ish end horsepower motor that i will be having built over the summer and fall of next year. Then, the ES will be getting the stock pipes and airbox put back on it, completely cleaned, and restored, and then semi-retired with matching numbers. No, they're not worth alot now, but im sure those who had Z1s, CBXs and the like didnt think they'd be worth alot to a collector one day either...

[Ironriot]

Hell yeah! A build thread. Dude there's been too many words and not enough pictures to make this a legit build thread i believe

[TheCafeKid]

Hell yeah! A build thread. Dude there's been too many words and not enough pictures to make this a legit build thread i believe

I need parts...that will take me a few months. Not gonna be cheap, but IMO well worth it. If you'd like to see pretty much what im goin for.. search for pics of Isleomans GS1100ED or Kichigai's GS1100ESD

[gmansyz]

Offsets?

When you put the GSXR 17" wheel in the swinger, use the GS11 sprocket carrier as it has less offset for the sprocket. I believe .200". Nearly much the difference between the 5/8" and 3/8" offset sprockets. Then when you use the 530 chain, you have more clearence. Just check to see how close it comes to the tire too. Maybe it can be machined down even further. Then you need even less offset in the sprocket. And more clearence to the frame. I have also heard that there is a difference between the '82 and '83 1000/1100 Katana frames with the chain running into the frame on the '82 1000 and there being enough clearence on the '83 1100. Oh, the 5.5 x 17 wheel pops right into the GS11 swinger. Maybe, the only mod might be to grind some of the bracing away from the from of the arm and this is so you have clearence to slide the wheel/tire forwards and take the chain off when you need to take the wheel out. Or, you can still go with a Bandit swinger or a GSXR 750 or 1100 arm. They are much the same just maybe the pivot width? Just watch the overall length. I may even have one of those if you want measurements or one.

[TheCafeKid]

When you put the GSXR 17" wheel in the swinger, use the GS11 sprocket carrier as it has less offset for the sprocket. I believe .200". Nearly much the difference between the 5/8" and 3/8" offset sprockets. Then when you use the 530 chain, you have more clearence. Just check to see how close it comes to the tire too. Maybe it can be machined down even further. Then you need even less offset in the sprocket. And more clearence to the frame. I have also heard that there is a difference between the '82 and '83 1000/1100 Katana frames with the chain running into the frame on the '82 1000 and there being enough clearence on the '83 1100. Oh, the 5.5 x 17 wheel pops right into the GS11 swinger. Maybe, the only mod might be to grind some of the bracing away from the from of the arm and this is so you have clearence to slide the wheel/tire forwards and take the chain off when you need to take the wheel out. Or, you can still go with a Bandit swinger or a GSXR 750 or 1100 arm. They are much the same just maybe the pivot width? Just watch the overall length. I may even have one of those if you want measurements or one.

The WHEEL may fit into the GS11 swinger, but you're going to have other problems, like the brake torque arm, as the gixxer uses an underslung caliper etc etc. Have to have it modified, and if im gonna do that, might as well use the bigger stiffer Bandit arm.... There is no problem that I am currently aware of with chain and frame issues with the 13mm offset, and 520 chain.