Twins vs. Mono

[liloaty]

Monoshocks are to vintage sportbikes as professional wrestling is to sports.

What do you define as vintage? '84 1150s were monoshocks, and I'd definitely consider them vintage.

[drhach]

All modern sportbikes and roadracing bikes come with monoshocks, if there were an advantage to twinshocks then they would be so equipped.

I'm not disagreeing with you entirely. But also consider that many decisions about vehicles are made from a cost saving or efficiency in manufacturing standpoint. Decisions are also made based on the "gee whiz" factor. Somebody puts out a monoshock bike first. Maybe they did it so that they would have to store half as many shocks at the plant, or they got a deal from the OEM. The marketers however say " look at us, first to market with a monoshock. It's new, it must be better". The rest of the lemmings follow suit. They don't necessarily have a product that is better, but they have to play along because their competitors introduced something new and they have to appear to be keeping up with the times. In turn, the aftermarket supports it, because that is what everybody now has, so you see greater R&D on that front and the innovations that applied to the old product are no longer pursued.

I think it is fair to say that most people buying a monshocked bike couldn't ride to the capacity of a well done bike that had dual shocks.

[LilTinc]

Can anyone possitively say wich one works better? Mono or twin shocks?

I understand that Mono shock set ups can have a rising rate engineered into them through their linkage geometry but a similar effect can be accomplished with varriable rate coils on Twin shock set up. I'm coming at this from a high performance car suspension back ground so I'm just trying to understand.

The question I should have phrased sould have been wich one works better?

[reddirtrider]

Can anyone possitively say wich one works better? Mono or twin shocks?

I understand that Mono shock set ups can have a rising rate engineered into them through their linkage geometry but a similar effect can be accomplished with varriable rate coils on Twin shock set up. I'm coming at this from a high performance car suspension back ground so I'm just trying to understand.

The question I should have phrased sould have been wich one works better?

Inless you're a professional rider, I doubt you can tell the difference between a well set up mono or dual unit - all else being equal (tires, etc).

[Billy Ricks]

The only thing I'll say here is that if you want to go with top notch components you can probably do either for about the same money. If you're going to really push to find its limits you'll find them a few times. Hopefully it happens where you have room for error. If you're just going for general street riding with some spirited backroad riding then dual shocks with good dampers will be more than you'll ever need. If you're going to push your limits and the bikes you're going to need to brace the frame and get the geometry right for the mounting points on the frame for the shock and it's linkage to go mono.

redirtrider is speaking from experience. He did one of the nicest builds you'll ever see.

80GS1000 is the kind of rider that can justify going mono.

[focus frenzy]

shocks smocks!!!!! the biggest gain in performance and handling is getting rid of the cast lead stock wheels!!!!

the monster wide rear wheel and tire on my SV weighs less than the front tire and wheel on my 1000G. that right there is all unsprung weight.

with a mono shock set up weight transfer to the chassis from the wheel remains the same, straight up the middle. with dual shocks it moves to either side through the shock on the inside of the turn.

you have to be realy realy good and fast to tell or benifit from the change but many gain just from the stiffer swing arm as the older steel swingarm was pretty flexy. the later boxed aluminum one is stiffer.

look at our Australian katana friends, in the pictures Dink has posted many of them are running modern ultra light alloy spoked wheels.

[reddirtrider]

with a mono shock set up weight transfer to the chassis from the wheel remains the same, straight up the middle. with dual shocks it moves to either side through the shock on the inside of the turn.

I must differ on this. Both shocks in a dual setup work in a corner. The only way one shock will have an advantage is if there is significant flexibility in the swingwarm or through the frame connections. I've even seen production bikes with a single shock setup on one side of the swingarm. There is no transfer back and forth in a properly designed system.

The biggest advantage of a mono over a duel seems to be in setting up the suspension. You have a greater range of tuning and you only have to do it for one shock, not both.

In a production environment, anytime you can eliminate components, especially costly one such as a shock, manufacturers are going to go for it.

Take for example our tube frames. They can be made strong enough, take Ducati for instance, but they are much more expensive than the monique units. So, manufactures go that route.

[drhach]

Mono shocks sure do impress the ladies though.

[80GS1000]

redirtrider is speaking from experience. He did one of the nicest builds you'll ever see.

redirtrider - do you have any pics of your bike? Would love to see it.

[reddirtrider]

redirtrider - do you have any pics of your bike? Would love to see it.

I built it for my son and it's not accessible right now. I used to have a thread on it here, but it's probably been deleted.

I'm going to be working on it again after I get the 750ES rebuilt. I'm going to either rework the mono bracing to go with more of a Ducati look (tubular) or convert back to a dual setup and use modern shocks.

There's plenty of examples in here and you have a beautiful bike. Nice job. I really like what you've done.

[Billy Ricks]

I built it for my son and it's not accessible right now. I used to have a thread on it here, but it's probably been deleted.

I'm going to be working on it again after I get the 750ES rebuilt. I'm going to either rework the mono bracing to go with more of a Ducati look (tubular) or convert back to a dual setup and use modern shocks.

There's plenty of examples in here and you have a beautiful bike. Nice job. I really like what you've done.

The old thread is probably in the archives but the pics would be dead. Might be able to find it through Katman's thread.
Found a link in Katman's thread and yours is dead.

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showpost.php?p=272001&postcount=44

[isleoman]

On my GS1100 I've got the dual shock set up on a bandit swing arm with GSXR tires, its certainly better than stock.

There may be someone on the site who has ridden both mods (dual vs mono) but I doubt it. I have mono on my 01 FZ1 and love it. There are too many other variables to compare one to the other from bike to bike and the same is true on GS conversions. How good of a job did the builder do, what combination and quality of components were used.

I think you just have to decide what "Vision" you have for how you want your bike to look. The ride quality and performance will be governed by your skills and your components.

[liloaty]

I must differ on this. Both shocks in a dual setup work in a corner. The only way one shock will have an advantage is if there is significant flexibility in the swingwarm or through the frame connections. I've even seen production bikes with a single shock setup on one side of the swingarm. There is no transfer back and forth in a properly designed system.

I agree that both shocks work in a corner, but they will not be under the same load. Properly designed systems can reduce this, but not totally eliminate it.

[reddirtrider]

I agree that both shocks work in a corner, but they will not be under the same load. Properly designed systems can reduce this, but not totally eliminate it.

If your swingarm and chassis mounting points are sufficient stiff, where would the differnt loads come from?

The only difference I can see at that point is the individual responses of each shock. Good quality shocks should be very close to each other tolerance wise.

In any case, what you'd have is an averaged system contolled by the responses of each shock. If the swingarm and chassis are sufficiently stiff, you wouldn't even need a shock on each side. A mono mounted on only one side of the rear would work (if it was the correct shock for the application).

[liloaty]

If your swingarm and chassis mounting points are sufficient stiff, where would the differnt loads come from?

Nothing is infinitely stiff, and in a turn the bike + rider's center of gravity will be different distances away from each shock and its mounting points.