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degreeing cams ... why?

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    #16
    More links

    Here is some more interesting background on heory. Especially the sensitivity numbers highlighted in Red below which would indicate the level of sensitivity to cam degreeing accuracy.

    From a practical standpoint, if you want to degree a stock cam, that isall that matters. If you buy an aftermarket cam, it would be worth the money you spend to get it degreed to the closest degree as specificed by the manufacturer. If you are racing well you dot need my advice.

    http://instructor.mstc.edu/instructor/candres/studentaccess/Presentations/Unit%204/Camshaft%20Theory%20and%20Design.ppt#256,1,Camshaf t Design and Theory

    http://www.compcams.com/Technical/TimingTutorial/

    http://www.hotbikeweb.com/tech/0711_hbkp_tech_tips_camshafts/final_thoughts.html

    Changing Cam Timing: Retarding or advancing a cam 4-degrees will move the engine's power band either up (retarded) or down (advanced) approximately 300 to 400 rpm. Closing the intake valve later and/or opening the exhaust valve earlier tend to move the power band higher. Basically, retarding a cam increases top-end horsepower, while advancing a cam improves low-end torque. If power improves when the cam is retarded more than 4-degrees, the cam is too small and requires more duration. On the other hand, if power increases when the cam is advanced more than 4-degrees, the cam is too large and less duration would probably improve performance. All else being equal, a cam with a later closing intake valve requires an increased mechanical compression ratio to maintain a given low speed performance.

    SAMPLE TWIN CAM CAMSHAFTS

    Table 2 Valve lift with 1.625:1 rocker arm ratio. *Gear Drive, reverse rear cam rotation.Note the TW37s and TW37b cams have the same amount of duration and lift but the opening and closing valve timings are different, by changing the timing of the opening and closing events, Lobe Center, Lobe Separation Angle, and the amount of overlap change. Also note that duration values change when measured at different tappet lifts, such as .053" and .020". Accurate comparisons can only be made with measurements taken at the same tappet lift.
    Last edited by posplayr; 04-14-2009, 11:11 AM.

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      #17
      Originally posted by reddirtrider View Post
      As a matter of fact, Pos was the only one with any specific information on HOW to actually degree cams.
      That's funny, I thought I contributed to this thread. Guess not.
      1981 GS650G , all the bike you need
      1980 GS1000G Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely

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        #18
        Originally posted by duaneage View Post
        That's funny, I thought I contributed to this thread. Guess not.
        You did, just not any information on HOW to degree cams, which is what was originally asked, and what I specifically stated. Yes, you did contribute. I never said you didn't. This is turning into something I didn't intend. I appologize to all who read my comments.

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          #19
          whoa, to everyone whos haveing a little argument here, do it over PM's, we dont want to read it, or start something off-topic elsewhere. (personally, i love political banter, so long as its founded) and remember, were all here because we love the same thing (bikes...i hope)

          so relax, and share some riding stories, and get over this!

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            #20
            oh, yeah, i forgot to ask, has anyone tried to do this with a 550? im just curious to see what anyone has to say.

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              #21
              holy crap

              thanks to the dude who liked my sig line.

              no thanks to the dude who bashed him, wtf is your deal dude? (rhetorical)

              thanks to all who contributed to my education. i didn't realize that the stock cams were ballparked.

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                #22
                Originally posted by truckah View Post
                thanks to the dude who liked my sig line.

                no thanks to the dude who bashed him, wtf is your deal dude? (rhetorical)

                thanks to all who contributed to my education. i didn't realize that the stock cams were ballparked.
                Well since you guys won't let this drop. My problem is with those that think guns are the solution. 3 cops were recently mowed down by someone with similar thoughts.

                If you think guns are to protect you from government - you are wrong. That's what VOTING is for.

                I have nothing against guns, I do however take exception to the deviant thought process that they somehow protect us from our government and they can/should be used to overthrow it.

                Now I'm finished. Move this to the appropriate forum. You can bash me all you want in there as I won't ever see it.
                Last edited by Guest; 04-14-2009, 04:22 PM.

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                  #23
                  maybe you should all "degree" your brains back in and get back to the origonal subject!!!!!
                  1978 GS1085.

                  Just remember, an opinion without 3.14 is just an onion!

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Originally posted by reddirtrider View Post
                    Well since you guys won't let this drop. My problem is with those that think guns are the solution. 3 cops were recently mowed down by someone with similar thoughts.

                    If you think guns are to protect you from government - you are wrong. That's what VOTING is for.

                    I have nothing against guns, I do however take exception to the deviant thought process that they somehow protect us from our government and they can/should be used to overthrow it.

                    Now I'm finished. Move this to the appropriate forum. You can bash me all you want in there as I won't ever see it.
                    pm sent red

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Well since you guys won't let this drop. My problem is with those that think guns are the solution. 3 cops were recently mowed down by someone with similar thoughts.

                      If you think guns are to protect you from government - you are wrong. That's what VOTING is for.

                      I have nothing against guns, I do however take exception to the deviant thought process that they somehow protect us from our government and they can/should be used to overthrow it.

                      Now I'm finished. Move this to the appropriate forum. You can bash me all you want in there as I won't ever see it.


                      This one of the reasons I don`t visit this site much any more

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Kris V View Post
                        This one of the reasons I don`t visit this site much any more
                        Yea Kris, kinda gets tiring ; I still have lots to learn so I mostly tolerate it.

                        Just a little forethought, tolerance and thoughtfulness would eliminate 80% of this "clutter" (note choice of words).

                        I generally try to ignore most of it unless someone is balls-ing up thread I started.

                        Applogies if I play with the pigs (less than PC choice of words; see the diff) sometimes.

                        Pos
                        Last edited by posplayr; 04-14-2009, 04:56 PM.

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                          #27
                          what reason kris? the venomous replies or the endless beating of the proverbial dead animal?

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                            #28
                            UMM......yes

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                              #29
                              As in you question about degreeing cams, I dragrace a lot and found out a long time ago that properly degreed cams will cut your times down from .2 to .4 tenths on the track. So this means if I am doing a 9.70 in the 1/4 mile you will be doing 9.50 to 9.30 with little $$$$ spent. 110 degrees I have found is optimum for power.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Kris V View Post
                                As in you question about degreeing cams, I dragrace a lot and found out a long time ago that properly degreed cams will cut your times down from .2 to .4 tenths on the track. So this means if I am doing a 9.70 in the 1/4 mile you will be doing 9.50 to 9.30 with little $$$$ spent. 110 degrees I have found is optimum for power.

                                at what RPM range?

                                some of us tend to street our bikes more and could use a mid range grunt more than 7k+ if yours is high end.

                                Did you notice a difference in mileage also?

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