Sport Demons vs Roadriders

[Mysuzyq]

Having used both, I would suggest Turtle get the SD this time around, and the Avons to replace them, when worn. Going by his argument, I think he would be at a psychological disadvantage with the Avons (not necessarily based on reality), but that is the last thing you need when tipping the bike into a turn at high speed, or an emergency situation....I guess Joe prefers with the SD for precisely the same reason, actually.
I like both tires, I'll stick with the Avons (no pun intended) when this set is trashed, simply bec of the superior mileage they get. IMO, the Pirellis exhibit a freakishly short warm up time, probably by virtue of the softer compound, ( this probably isn't a factor in Arizona, but should be taken into account here, with Canadian cold weather riding), which isn't to say the Avons are unsafe....they are superior to designs that are a few years old, and light years ahead of anything available when these bikes were new....absent any gravel, you should be able to grind the footrests down to a nub before the tires let go, assuming you have the skill and confidence to do this.
To jinkyz, the 1100E has enough power/torque to break any rear tire loose if you shift aggressively whilst leaned over in a corner.....this happened to me once even with the Sport Demon, but the difference is that the wheel 'stepped out' in a very predictable/controllable manner, whereas some lesser tires would have caused a 'pucker moment' at the very least . Aggressive shifting is best done before/after entering a corner, not in it, but the Pirellis give the impression that they cannot be broken loose while cornering, leading the rider to push the envelope a bit.
Tony.l

[Turtleface]

Having used both, I would suggest Turtle get the SD this time around, and the Avons to replace them, when worn. Going by his argument, I think he would be at a psychological disadvantage with the Avons (not necessarily based on reality), but that is the last thing you need when tipping the bike into a turn at high speed, or an emergency situation....I guess Joe prefers with the SD for precisely the same reason, actually.

Tony.l

The mental bit is a good mention as well. I don't trust the physics of motorcycles enough to get myself really leaned over, and knowing this, I approach corners with great care. Also, the increased predictability of the tire, at all speeds, could lead to greater overall control. I'm also investigating the possibilities of a track day, my bike should be leak free in about four days or so. There's a few tracks out here, so it shouldn't be hard. Plus I've easy access to several large, empty parking lots, perfect for practicing emergency maneuvers at normal commuting speeds.

[salty_monk]

Also think of it this way... The Avon's wear better so where in the tyres mileage do you want to have your crash/hairy moment? If it's just after you fitted them then maybe the SD's could help you out if like Joe says you are skilled enough to use that 0.5% extra grip... if it's getting towards 6k miles you might be better off on the Avons.

What Joe's getting at & what I agree with is that the tyres are so close together in performance that safety shouldn't really be a factor. Joe might be safer on his SD's because he knows their performance margin etc. I would be better on the Avon's as I have a lot more experience of riding those....

I had 7k mile on one set of Avons on my 1000G with over 50% tread left. I have 3.5k miles on the other set & they look brand new still (on my 1000E).

My 750 Project is getting Pilot Powers - one of the stickiest road rubber's out there... ($240 a set so you can see the $$ of SD to RR's is not really an issue for me) I wonder if it will change my mind about tyres at all after some time spent riding that! ($240 a set is a very good price for those tyres & I suspect I'll get 6-7k out of them so at least a year the way I'm planning to use that bike).

I am 165lb & a lot of my miles are in Los Angeles so the straight line work I have to do to get to the twisties means the Avons work better for me. I Suspect I'll find that issue with the Pilot Powers to be honest but I wanted to at least give them a shot!

Dan

[TheCafeKid]

It's because it's an '83 ES. Huge improvement in handling over previous GSes.

True, but I had sub standard tires on it before, and it handled WAY worse than it does now. The nice high profile of the Avons make the bike feel much much lighter than it is in the steering dept. Turning in is much quicker and almost effortless. Like Brian said, if you're not ready for it, it will scare the bejesus out of you the first good turn you put it in.. . Ive also gone to great lengths to improve its handling characteristics, but, apples to apples, yes, its a better design, but the tires, compared to what it had on it before, make a larger difference than I would have suspected. I love the combo, and yes, ive used the RoadRider in front before, the Venom feels a little more aggro, which i like.

[bonanzadave]

And yet, you are riding a thirty year old motorcycle, with something like half the braking and handling of a modern bike

Things that can confuse accurate evaluation are tired/sagging suspension,excessive play in steering head and wheel bearings, incorrectly graded fork oil (for your weight and riding style), over sized tyres for rim width, poorly performing brakes, brake disc run out, etc,etc.

Its is unfortunate that your 27 year old Bike is a dinosaur but I respect your home work trying to make it all it can be.

Youll be draggin all sorts of hard shinny parts long before you push either brand tire over the edge.

It's because it's an '83 ES. Huge improvement in handling over previous GSes.

Really ? Better than a EZ or ED ?

Extra Stability ? Enhanced Suspension ?

[tkent02]

Its is unfortunate that your 27 year old Bike is a dinosaur but I respect your home work trying to make it all it can be.

Youll be draggin all sorts of hard shinny parts long before you push either brand tire over the edge.



Really ? Better than a EZ or ED ?

Extra Stability ? Enhanced Suspension ?

Smaller front wheel, completely new frame design, better brakes, smaller bike overall.... Huge difference in handling and braking.

[Mysuzyq]

Smaller front wheel, completely new frame design, better brakes, smaller bike overall.... Huge difference in handling and braking.

This probably applies to the smaller ES bikes (700/750) that benefited from upgrades, but the 1100 variety is essentially the same bike, with different cosmetics (square headlight with fairing & the blue/white scheme). I don't know if even the 1100 Kats had much changed, apart from the clip-on style bars, and different cosmetic package.

Tony.

[tkent02]

This probably applies to the smaller ES bikes (700/750) that benefited from upgrades, but the 1100 variety is essentially the same bike, with different cosmetics (square headlight with fairing & the blue/white scheme). I don't know if even the 1100 Kats had much changed, apart from the clip-on style bars, and different cosmetic package.

Tony.

OK, I thought the 1100 changed the same year as the 750.
Thanks.

[bonanzadave]

OK, I thought the 1100 changed the same year as the 750.

Maybe Josh's 1100 is better because of that Extra Special cargo...

[TheCafeKid]

Its is unfortunate that your 27 year old Bike is a dinosaur but I respect your home work trying to make it all it can be.

Youll be draggin all sorts of hard shinny parts long before you push either brand tire over the edge.



Really ? Better than a EZ or ED ?

Extra Stability ? Enhanced Suspension ?

Not better than an ED but better than an EZ. Hotter cams higher pegs but otherwise close. It's the best of the 1100s for sure

[Mysuzyq]

Not better than an ED but better than an EZ. Hotter cams higher pegs but otherwise close. It's the best of the 1100s for sure

In the suspension dept., there isn't any difference that would afford it an edge in terms of superior handling....I have the manuals for both bikes, and rake/trail and suspension components are identical. The cams have more lift, and the airbox is slightly different....the peg carriers are different, but I don't believe they are higher or more rear set.

Tony.

[Billy Ricks]

I am 165lb & a lot of my miles are in Los Angeles so the straight line work I have to do to get to the twisties means the Avons work better for me. I Suspect I'll find that issue with the Pilot Powers to be honest but I wanted to at least give them a shot!

Dan

I've always gotten my hands on race compound tires and to be honest with you they wear pretty well. The first and probably the best radial I ever had on the rear was a Daytona qualifying tire that I got my hands on. It was a hand laid Dunlop D364 that was more stable than anything I've had since and I probably got 5,000 miles out of it. It finally bit the dust about halfway through one of the Hill Country rides that were a big hit for a few years. I'd put in 700 or so freeway miles round trip just making the ride and then we'd usually put in close to 300 out in extreme twisties. There was three of us that would run off from the pack and have time to take a break while the pack caught up at each crossroad. By the time we got out of the hills the second time I did it on that tire there was belt showing through all the way around the center of the tire. I limped back to my in-laws and caught a bus home. I squeezed my $60 out of that tire.

[TheCafeKid]

In the suspension dept., there isn't any difference that would afford it an edge in terms of superior handling....I have the manuals for both bikes, and rake/trail and suspension components are identical. The cams have more lift, and the airbox is slightly different....the peg carriers are different, but I don't believe they are higher or more rear set.

Tony.

I have both sitting in my garage at the moment. The 83 pegs, just from eye balling them, are slightly higher, and seem to be back just a tad. The pegs on the 82 feel different for sure. more forward, like the 80-81 1100. To ME it doesnt feel as "tucked in" but maybe im goofy..

[Mysuzyq]

I have both sitting in my garage at the moment. The 83 pegs, just from eye balling them, are slightly higher, and seem to be back just a tad. The pegs on the 82 feel different for sure. more forward, like the 80-81 1100. To ME it doesnt feel as "tucked in" but maybe im goofy..

Ah, you must have the 'superior handling' package, then!
Tony.

[posplayr]

I have both sitting in my garage at the moment. The 83 pegs, just from eye balling them, are slightly higher, and seem to be back just a tad. The pegs on the 82 feel different for sure. more forward, like the 80-81 1100. To ME it doesnt feel as "tucked in" but maybe im goofy..

Josh; eazy tell does the EZ have the shift linkage for the rear set? How long is it in comparision?

Just comparing my 80 GS750E; the geometry is more upright and less confidence inspring in a sweeper than the ED. On the otherhand in comparision to the ED with a set of worn 3K mile SD, the GS750E could dance with the new Avons.