Attaching Tire Weights

[Joe Nardy]

The heavy spot on the wheel was probably 10 degrees from the valve stem and the weight was maybe 25 degrees from the stem with the spot between them. I must be getting blind or just dull, I have since found another weight. I guess I really need to go back to square one and get a correct heavy spot but I hate to remove the tire. Does rotating the tire around the rim mean breaking the beads? I have been involved in something else for the last few hrs and have to leave for an hr but will deflate the tire when I get back. Thanks Jim M

Jim,

Yes, rotating the tire means breaking the beads....sorry. Hopefully it won't be too bad since the tire was recently installed.

I'm guessing that you have actually positioned the tire in the worst possible spot, heavy tire spot to heavy wheel spot due to the weights remaining on the wheel when you checked for the heavy spot. The only way to be sure is to start over. I hope you end up needing much less weight to balance.

FYI, my 1/2 inch, 1/4 ounce lead weights arrived today. I can send you a couple strips if you PM me with an address........I can throw in a couple clip-on weights in as well.

Thanks,
Joe

[sharpy]

Ill be going to a breaker/wrecker and asking for the Genuine weights off some of there wheels. Wont have to worry about degreaser or anything and are reusable. How where u balancing it, how free was the "setup". At least you where doing the correct way just forgot that 20g weight.

[1948man]

Thanks Joe, I really appreciate your advice and will PM you. I guess I get up close and personal with bead breaking tomorrow. Yes Sharpy, my set up does seem pretty sensitive and seems to be working well. It's the way I oriented the tire on the rim that's mucking things up. Anybody ever had any experience with this?

http://www.harborfreight.com/motorcycle-bead-breaker-98875.html

I guess if I can find some big wooden clamps that would work well too.

[Joe Nardy]

Thanks Joe, I really appreciate your advice and will PM you. I guess I get up close and personal with bead breaking tomorrow. Yes Sharpy, my set up does seem pretty sensitive and seems to be working well. It's the way I oriented the tire on the rim that's mucking things up. Anybody ever had any experience with this?

http://www.harborfreight.com/motorcycle-bead-breaker-98875.html

I guess if I can find some big wooden clamps that would work well too.

I believe Mr. Salty Monk has experience with the Harbor Freight bead breaker. I believe whoever used it said it did a good job.

Thanks,
Joe

*****EDIT******

Yes, it was Mr. Salty Monk: Linky. Note the 'proper' spelling of 'tire'. (What a sausage jockey........)

Thanks,
Joe

[1948man]

One last Noobe question. I guess taking the tires totally off the rim won't damage them will it? I could just break the bead and rotate the tire and try it but the best way seems to be to get the tire off and test the rim correctly for the true heavy spot.

[Joe Nardy]

One last Noobe question. I guess taking the tires totally off the rim won't damage them will it? I could just break the bead and rotate the tire and try it but the best way seems to be to get the tire off and test the rim correctly for the true heavy spot.

Nope, taking the tire off the rim will not hurt it. Yes, the only way to find the true heavy spot is to remove the tire. To be as accurate as possible check for the heavy spot with valve stem in and valve cap on and................(it should go without saying but I can't resist)............all weights removed .

By the way, have you replaced the valve stem? This is always a good idea and metal is preferable to rubber.

Thanks,
Joe

[1948man]

I haven't replaced the valve stem but it looks good and worked well when I aired up the tire in the wrong orientation. I did look for some stems locally for another rim and was going to have to order some so I used the old stem. I will order some but being an impatient type, I will probably reuse the old one on this wheel I'm involved with just to get through. I guess if it gives me a problem, that will be one more lesson learned the hard way. I got the Harbor Freight Bead Breaker.

[Joe Nardy]

I guess if it gives me a problem, that will be one more lesson learned the hard way.

Just my opinion but it is also a problem that could be catastrophic but is completely avoidable. You need to take the tire off the rim anyway and it's going to be a couple days before the weights arrive............

Just sayin'......................

Joe

[1948man]

Well I got the tire off and remounted it before I read your last post Joe, That's something to think about. Aren't the OEM stems metal and would they tend to fail catastrophically. I thought they might just develope a slow leak. Anyway, I have another issue. I guess I'm just snakebit on the balancing. I redetermined the heavy spot when I had tire off and all the weights removed. The spot moved as expected so I was encouraged and remounted the tire. In retrospect, I wish I had tested to see how much weight it would take to balance the rim without the tire on, just to see how out of balance the rim was.

With the spot on the tire matched up with the heavy spot on the wheel, I still need over 60 grams of weight to balance. It almost seems like I have a really out of balance wheel and my tire, while marked, really doesn't have enough of a light spot to counteract the heavy spot much. I haven't set the beads yet, would that affect the balance to enough of a degree to produce these balancing numbers? I'm going to try rotate the tire around the rim and experiment but don't expect much of a difference. Kind of hard to get the tire to rotate, but I guess I need a fresh dose of bead-lube.
I should add, the wheel had either 40 or 50 grams of weight on it when I got it (Ebay).

[fastpakr]

Is that 40-50 grams of weigh still in place?

[1948man]

There's no weight permanently mounted. To get the tire and wheel balanced, I need to tape on about 60 gr. The original 40-50 gr (which leads me to believe the wheel is somewhat out of balance) has been removed prior to determining the heavy spot on the rim (sans tire). I read on other sites about some riders needing even more to balance and wondering if it's okay. I also read that some guys question whether the manufacturer paint spot placement scheme is consistent. They talk about the "Seam" being the heavy spot. Is there a trick to rotating the tire on the rim (beads not set yet). I guess you need to somehow get something to hold the rim from rotating so you can really put some oomh on the tire.

I realize the beads not being set could have some effect but I'm reluctant to set them until I have tried everything. I don't want to have to break them again.

[Joe Nardy]

Well I got the tire off and remounted it before I read your last post Joe, That's something to think about. Aren't the OEM stems metal and would they tend to fail catastrophically. I thought they might just develope a slow leak. Anyway, I have another issue. I guess I'm just snakebit on the balancing. I redetermined the heavy spot when I had tire off and all the weights removed. The spot moved as expected so I was encouraged and remounted the tire. In retrospect, I wish I had tested to see how much weight it would take to balance the rim without the tire on, just to see how out of balance the rim was.

With the spot on the tire matched up with the heavy spot on the wheel, I still need over 60 grams of weight to balance. It almost seems like I have a really out of balance wheel and my tire, while marked, really doesn't have enough of a light spot to counteract the heavy spot much. I haven't set the beads yet, would that affect the balance to enough of a degree to produce these balancing numbers? I'm going to try rotate the tire around the rim and experiment but don't expect much of a difference. Kind of hard to get the tire to rotate, but I guess I need a fresh dose of bead-lube.
I should add, the wheel had either 40 or 50 grams of weight on it when I got it (Ebay).

If the OEM stem is metal you are much less likely to have a catastrophic failure. The rubber gasket is probably pretty hard but still better than a dry-rotted rubber stem.

There's no weight permanently mounted. To get the tire and wheel balanced, I need to tape on about 60 gr. The original 40-50 gr (which leads me to believe the wheel is somewhat out of balance) has been removed prior to determining the heavy spot on the rim (sans tire). I read on other sites about some riders needing even more to balance and wondering if it's okay. I also read that some guys question whether the manufacturer paint spot placement scheme is consistent. They talk about the "Seam" being the heavy spot. Is there a trick to rotating the tire on the rim (beads not set yet). I guess you need to somehow get something to hold the rim from rotating so you can really put some oomh on the tire.

I realize the beads not being set could have some effect but I'm reluctant to set them until I have tried everything. I don't want to have to break them again.

The balance may change when you seat the beads due to the tire possibly being off-center and 'hanging down' in one spot. You should be able to get some idea of how rotating the tire will affect the balance without seating the bead. 60 grams is still a considerable amount of weight but could be correct. I think I have used eight 1/4 ounce segments on a wheel before which is about 56 grams. Most tires I do require 4 or fewer 1/4 ounce sections. I have also never balanced a Shinko so maybe they tend to be less consistent than the brands I have balanced.


Thanks,
Joe

[1948man]

Thanks, I have been googling up some horror stories of guys putting 6 ounces on a shimano on a BMW, etv. I'm not saying they knew what they were doing but they said some directions claimed they might need 3 oz (84 gr). I also read somewhere that racers like to stay below 40 gr on the rear wheel so maybe I can live with 55-60gr as a non-racer. Anyway, if I can get these beads set, I'm going to balance and see where I'm at. I think I need a higher flowing air chuck. I got it a couple of days ago but it's resisting now.

[Joe Nardy]

Thanks, I have been googling up some horror stories of guys putting 6 ounces on a shimano on a BMW, etv. I'm not saying they knew what they were doing but they said some directions claimed they might need 3 oz (84 gr). I also read somewhere that racers like to stay below 40 gr on the rear wheel so maybe I can live with 55-60gr as a non-racer. Anyway, if I can get these beads set, I'm going to balance and see where I'm at. I think I need a higher flowing air chuck. I got it a couple of days ago but it's resisting now.

Jim,

Here's a tip on bead seating. Remove the valve stem and get some kind of air nozzle that does not need the valve stem to open the flow of air. The amount of air flowing through the valve stem and into the tire will be greatly increased. Also, keep the beads well lubed when attempting to seat them.

Thanks,
Joe

[Steve]

To get the tire and wheel balanced, I need to tape on about 60 gr.

Do something as an experiment, and as a favor to yourself.

Break the beads again and rotate the tire 180 degrees on the wheel to see if it gets any better.

With proper lube, breaking and re-seating the beads is not that much of a problem.

You might also try seating the tire at 90-degree increments instead of the 180. One of them just might work.

.