dual compound tires for our bikes?

[Chuck78]

Can anyone recommend a great dual compound tire for a 110/90-18 or 110/80-18 front and 130, 140, 150/70-18 rear for alloy spoked DID rims???

I had Dunlops at first, they were old and scary. TheN Kendall Challengers - could corner ok, 110 rear would go up in Smoke with a twist of the wrist. Then 2.50/3.50 alloy 18 rims and Shinko 230 TourMaster front and 140/70-18 Shinko SR741 rear. The grip was AMAZING, cornering was very very impressive. 4300 miles however and I deemed the rear fit for replacement, as the tread was pretty flat and worn in the center from living at the edges of the glaciated plains that make up 65% of Ohio, takes 40 minute ride southeast or 55 minute ride east on the slab or backroads to get into the amazing SouthEast Ohio Appalachian hills.... Where the Shinko proved to me that they make amazing sticky tires for the price.

I like the Pirelli Sport Demons a lot as well, as they come in far more sizes such as a 110/80, and offer similar but even better handling, but slightly less life again.

Avon 150/70-18 on rear 3.50 rim with cracking sidewall problem at only 200 miles and 2 winters does not grip nearly as well as the Shinkos...

I am hoping to find a tire in these sizes that grips like a sport demon or Shinko 230/SR741, but doesn't wear down so quickly in the center. A dual compound is the only answer so it seems. Otherwise I will swear by Shinko & Pirelli at 4000 mile change intervals.

I had a slight speculation that the widest recommended (150/70) Avon RoadRider for a 3.50 rim might be slightly pinched in and have less contact patch than a 140/70 (best recommended fit for a 3.50 rim) but still, the RoadRider just doesn't seem to stick as good, and I live for leaning into corners in southeast Ohio & West Virginia Appalachian hills and West Virginia/Virginia mountain riding... WV mountains are 5 hours trip mostly slab, however...(1 hr slab to twisties to WV mtns would make it a 9+ hr trip to the mountains). dual compound would help a lot there

[Chuck78]

This 150/70 Avon AM26 R.R. is just plain scary coming out of low to mid speed turns on the throttle, as it breaks loose unexpectedly and sends the back end squirming (far far better than cheap tires, but from a highly recommended tire in a wider size, I would not expect this kind of handling). On the SR741 140/70 Shinko, I could induce a similar drift if I tried, but it did not come on so unexpectedly, and when I did spin it up powering out of turns, it was very predictable and practically invited me to rip the throttle open even more to have some drifting fun. The Avon in a 150/70 on a 3.50 rim makes me feel less comfortable and gives me the sense that I could dump it unexpectedly if I didn't back right off the throttle. Also I have never done a 200'+ burnout on the Shinko as I did on the Avon AM26 due to peer pressure coming up the hill from the main entrance at AMA vintage motorcycle days weekend at the local race track. In fact, a couple of times that I tried to do a good burnout on the Shinko I ended up just popping a big wheelie... I can get this road rider to squirm all over the road by ripping the throttle open at 15 mph. Then it seems like it starts hooking up a little better after I heat it up.

My buddies at the Rice Paddy are trying to convince me that this is all just because the Avon, despite only having 200 miles on it when all of this started, with cracked sidewalls after two winters, they say it is just old, and a brand new on would grip much better. I'm definitely skeptical, as some of their choices in high end dual compound tires for their newer sportbikes leave them sliding through turns as they follow me on my vintage bike with sticky rubber.Thank you GSR members for turning me on to the Shinko and Pirelli tires, as they are truly incredible compared to even some modern sport bike dual compound tires that are highly rated. Of course there could be rider input error that caused my bud's ZRX1100 to slip & slide through the turns that I took even faster than him behind me... unfortunately he almost high sided behind me once on those tires, and ran off the road and dumped it in the grass in a turn that I blazed on through.

[Stuarth]

Not dual compound, but I love the Conti Classic Attack radials that I put on my '77 GS550. But they're on the expensive side at about $300 a set, and the rear is about half worn at 1600 miles- mostly commuting so the center wears first. Ride is great, and they do not track rain grooves. Grip is outstanding in the hills near home, and I was starting to push them within 10 miles as they felt secure right away. I'll be getting them for my '76 XS650 when my Bridgestone BT45's wear down. The Bridgestones are dual compound, and I've used them on my XS and my SRX600, but they're nothing like the Conti's. The rear BT45 wears about the same rate on my XS as the Conti's are wearing on my GS so if cost is more of a factor, the BT45's are about 35-40% cheaper than the Conti's. I sound like I work for the company, but have no affiliation- just love the tires for my riding.

[Chuck78]

So it looks like the Pirelli Sport Demon rear is no longer available in a 150/70-18, & 140/70-18 is going to be the largest size I can get it in. A 140/70 is the best fit for a 3.5 rim, so I guess that takes the guesswork out of it for me.

Ordering online, best prices I can find are $240 for Sport Demon's in 110/90-18 & 140/70-18, but my old reliable best bang for the buck Shinko 230 front & SR741 rear come in at $140 for the pair, similar tread life as the Pirelli. Tough call to give the Pirelli a shot.

I think the Pirelli coming in a 110/80-18 will sway me to buy them for the 475cc GS425 racer project I am doing next year, maybe matched to a 130/70-18 rear, although that will flatten out the tread radius slightly but could give me even more improved grip, just decreases the extreme lean angle potential a few degrees... unsure which would be the better. All on 2.5& 3.5 rims.

[Chuck78]

It looks like Metzeler & Bridgestone are the only two manufacturers that I have seen offering dual compounds for our bikes. I have heard good and bad feedback about both. I believe BWringer posted years ago about some of their designs being ancient technology that is very outdated. Others have great feedback on both brands in certain models on how great they grip.

One thing I know is that I have never heard anyone complain about anything on the Shinko or Pirelli other than tread wear life span. They both always get incredibly exceptional reviews on construction, handling, and grip. so I know those are awesome. However, I am still hoping to hear enough positive feedback about any dual compound tires to give me confidence that they will grip every bit as good when leaned over as the Pirelli or Shinko.

[Steve]

Can anyone recommend a great dual compound tire for a 110/90-18 or 110/80-18 front and 130, 140, 150/70-18 rear for alloy spoked DID rims???

I am by no means an expert on ALL tires, but the only "dual compound" tires I have seen were for the rear. I have never seen one for the front.

.

[Chuck78]

Yes, you are correct Steve. what I meant was a pair of matching tires that have a dual compound rear. It sure would be nice to get phenomenal corner and grip on the rear yet not have to worry about putting on the highway miles and flattening the tread, correspondingly hurting the transitioning when leaning over after 2500+ miles. the grip that the sport demon and Shinko give, however, is incredible, arguably worth the hassle of changing more frequently.

[Chuck78]

The Avon rear 150/70-18 that I am very unhappy with has less than 500 miles now & virtually no treadwear, but can't handle much wrist twisting when slightly leaned over, and can be induced into mega burnouts at 15 mph throttle whacks even.

Date codes are 48th week 2011 rear tire, 41st week 2011 front tire. The techs at Avon have been quoted as having said the compound was modified in 2013 to alleviate this problem.

I am wondering now if I should just put on another 150 Avon Roadrider, or if I should just go with a sticky tires that I trust so well, knowing that they may wear down quickly.

I still have considered running a Shinko or Pirelli front and a RoadRider rear. only if the newer RoadRider is guaranteed to grip better than this old one. Hmmm... the 150 Roadrider costs $10 more than the pair of 110/90 & 140/70 Shinko's!

the bigger rear tire does look very awesome, but it's pretty darn close to my chain, and my new shocks and the larger tire jacked up the back in to make the steering noticeably different. Going down slightly would probably improve handling at the expense of losing the awesome look.

[Steve]

I am wondering now if I should just put on another 150 Avon Roadrider, or if I should just go with a sticky tires that I trust so well, knowing that they may wear down quickly.

What is the width of your rear wheel that is supporting the 150?

.

[bwringer]

What you want is the bet tire for your application; whether the tire company accomplished that by using dual compound, triple compound, ancient Himalayan tree gum, or magic embedded elves is irrelevant.

If I follow you correctly, your bike has a 3.5" rear rim. As Steve hints, it's not the least bit surprising that stuffing a 150/80 tire on a too-narrow rim leads to spooky handling. The profile gets more hamburger-shaped than round.

You may also need to carry a small electric pump and experiment with tire pressures; perhaps a higher pressure for slabbing it to the twisties and minimizing wear, then drop 4 to 6 psi when you get to the fun bits.

[Chuck78]

Avon says a 130/70 and 150/70 are good or acceptable fits for the 3.50x18 rim, but that a 140/70 is the best fit. I have the 150/70 on there now. Trying to determine if it's the compound or the rim/tire size compatibility that is giving me less traction than the super grippy/sticky Shinko's. Better wear in the center for slabbing would be great, but ultimate traction is the most important.

I will have to look more into Metzeler and Bridgestone dual compound rears I suppose.

AnY feedback on those?

[Crankthat]

I really like the BT45s/Battlax by Bridgestone.
I have been riding 130/90-16 in the rear and 100/90-19 on the front as is stock on my bike for several years.
Had them on my last bike also.
They make both tubeless (V) and tubed (H) versions.

Bought them for the back roads in my neck of the world.
I am pretty aggressive but from the sounds of your posts not near as aggressive a rider as you.

They tend to wear real quick for me.
Always in the middle.
I tend to motor brake heavy.

Great traction in wet and cold as well as average temps.
You may want to mount something else in the summer months.
Great traction when hot, just noticeable wear after every ride.

I just mounted a sport demon on the rear with a BT 45 in the front.
Have not even broke them in yet.
I really like the turn radius on the demon.
Cannot say on traction yet.

[Chuck78]

Well the Metzelers seemed to be good tires 25 years ago, but I read a lot of mediocre reviews of them. For our vintage sizes in bias ply, the only dual compound I could come up with was the BT45 Bridgestone Battleaxe, which is a dual compound rear, but still people complain of them wearing fast on middleweight four cylinder bikes, as in rears making it into the 5000mi range before replacement. 5000-8000 miles on EX500's & GS500 twins depending on riding style. People love them for great grip, ok wear, and good cornering, but when compared to the Sport Demons, the Pirelli comes out ahead in handling very clearly based on reviews. The treadwear on the Pirelli I would guess would make ino the mid to upper 4000mi range for me, and I read that Pirelli has recently revised the centers of the rears, making deeper tread grooves with more rubber and improved radius for extended treadwear.
I got about 4200mi from my rear140/70-18 Shinko SR741 "cruiser" tire, which is the same compound as the 230 tourmaster, and is a surprisingly excellent radius profile and tread for extremely sporty riding. That tire with a 110/90-18 230 TourMaster front was really great, my friend and I put them on at the same time on our similar bikes and went straight to West Virginia mountains, and we could not believe just how good they gripped and cornered.

so basically it sounds like I might be able to get 500 or 1000 miles more out of a pair of Bridgestone battleaxe tires, but the Pirelli is still going to be the superior gripper and has a clearly better radius profile and carcass construction, but the BT45 is still a good candidate.

I am curious as to how Shinko's will stack up to the battle axe. The BT45 is close to double the cost, but I wonder if it will get better mileage or similar grip as the amazing shinko's.

[Chuck78]

Basically in an 18" & some 19" fronts (available in 17's & 16's also), here is my rundown:

Mileage and good grip:
$$$ Avon AM26 RoadRider good grip
$ Shinko 712 good grip for the money, Avon is better at deep lean angles

Ultimate Grip:
$$$ Pirelli Sport Demons (4400mi?)
$ Shinko 230 TourMaster & SR741 (wider rears in 70 series) (4000-4300mi)
$$$$ Continental Attack (less than 4000mi)

Great Grip, slightly longer life that the Ultimate Grippers, but not by much:
$$$ Bridgestone BT45 & BT45 BattleAxe (5000mi)

Was there a Continental Go or something that was highly regarded?

[Chuck78]

I know there are a multitude of other tires that are available primarily in 17 inch, but I was limiting this to bias ply tires available in 18 and 19 inch, with the bonus of having some 16 and 17 inch sizes.