tube or tubeless tyres for 1980 Suzuki's?

[ukjules]

I was just wandering what the thoughts are
for whether to use on 1980 Suzuki's with
mag wheels tubeless tyres ?
I am about to buy an Avon road rider for the front.
.

I have just checked on my Yamaha rd 1977 and the
mag wheels on it as standard
are not right for tubeless tyres. this just found out.

What are the thoughts ?
1980 gs550e
1980 gsx250
both with mag wheels.

[Nessism]

This topic has been debated here many times before and there is no consensus. Your bike came with tube tires, and the rims don't have the safety bumps to hold the tire close to the rim edge in case of sudden deflation. Some early tubeless rims didn't have these bumps, including the first GS tubeless front rims, so it's not strictly required, but it's highly desirable. So the decision as to whether or not you want to convert is up to you. Personally, I run tubes in the tires unless it originally was tubeless.

[Rob S.]

...I run tubes in the tires unless it originally was tubeless.

Ditto.....

[mmattockx]

So the decision as to whether or not you want to convert is up to you.

This sums it up. It isn't obviously safe or dangerous and everyone needs to make their own decision on running tubeless on rims not designed for it. Lots of people do it without issue, but I'm sure there have been issues for someone, somewhere.

Just to offer a contrary voice here, I run tubeless on both ends of my 1100E. The rear rim is the correct 'MT' type for tubeless tires while the front is not. In ~10,000km I have had no problems with either end beyond the rubber seal on the front valve stem rotting and leaking a bit this year. It will be replaced next spring and I expect to carry on without issues in the future.


Mark

[Grimly]

Ditto that. I've been running tubeless in the GSs for more than 30 years and never had a tyre come off its seating due to deflation.
Might be dumb luck, of course.

[fastbysuzuki]

I have been running tubeless on the 850 for 4 years with no problems, gives peace of mind when touring in case of a puncture no messing around with tubes. Well that's my two pence worth.

[rphillips]

Never tubes on any GS cast wheels, for me. Biggest problem, many places won't mount tubeless unless "TUBELESS" is clearly visible on the wheel (liability concerns). Many GS wheels don't have that notation.

[bwringer]

I've converted many to tubeless, using a 5/8" counterbore with a 5/16" pilot in a drill to machine a flat seating surface for the valve stem.

NAPA NTH 90426 valve stems are easy to get or order from your friendly local Napa store, they're the correct diameter for motorcycle wheels, they look good, and they're inexpensive ($4.69 each around here). I would not drill a GS wheel to a larger diameter in order to fit a car valve stem.

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/NTH90426

That said, I've never advised anyone to convert. But if that's what you want, I'll do it correctly with the correct special tool.

If you're not 110% decided, use a tube. And if you convert to tubeless and want to change back at some point later, just remove the valve stem and install a tube.

I've also never heard of a problem with converting a GS cast wheel to tubeless. Or maybe it's just that the next of kin didn't say anything...


As noted, this also requires that you mount your own tires. Which is better for your health, sanity, and wallet in many other ways besides.

If you have to pay someone to mount tires, very few shops, if any, will mount without tubes unless the wheel says "Tubeless".

[mmattockx]

Biggest problem, many places won't mount tubeless unless "TUBELESS" is clearly visible on the wheel

That is easily solved with a set of tire irons and a bit of swearing on a saturday afternoon.


Mark

[Brendan W]

My bike is a mongrel with bits from 79 through 82.
Both wheels have the tubeless mark but the front is not drilled for the tubeless valve?

[bwringer]

My bike is a mongrel with bits from 79 through 82.
Both wheels have the tubeless mark but the front is not drilled for the tubeless valve?

A proper motorcycle tubeless metal valve stem fits in the 8mm-ish valve stem hole in the wheel. The far more common car valve stems are larger in diameter where they go through the wheel.

Some folks drill the wheel to a larger diameter to fit a car valve stem, but I've never been comfortable with that.

You need a flat spot on the inside of the wheel for the seal on the valve stem to seal properly. If the wheel is marked tubeless, this will already be there. On some wheels that aren't marked tubeless already, this isn't flat so you'll need to machine the area around the hole just enough to create this flat spot.


Motorcycle valve stem: the threads are the same diameter as the cap all the way down. Car valve stems get fatter where they go through the wheel.

[Brendan W]

A proper motorcycle tubeless metal valve stem fits in the 8mm-ish valve stem hole in the wheel. The far more common car valve stems are larger in diameter where they go through the wheel.

Some folks drill the wheel to a larger diameter to fit a car valve stem, but I've never been comfortable with that.

You need a flat spot on the inside of the wheel for the seal on the valve stem to seal properly. If the wheel is marked tubeless, this will already be there. On some wheels that aren't marked tubeless already, this isn't flat so you'll need to machine the area around the hole just enough to create this flat spot.


Motorcycle valve stem: the threads are the same diameter as the cap all the way down. Car valve stems get fatter where they go through the wheel.

Thank you. That I did not know. Looks like all I will need is a proper tubeless valve for the front and I can ditch the tube. The guy who fits my tyres saw tube and replaced tube and I had been making assumptions based on what I saw people doing to convert to tubeless.

[ukjules]

Until now I have never given it much thought
but forcing myself to look at what the tyre
man put on bike I have thr following this time ...

An Avon RR on the rear with a tube.
For some inexplicable reasom I asked for this to be the case
in a previous thought that tubes were better on long travels
if get puncture in deepest spain.
A Michelin on the front with no tube.

Over the years Like others I have used tubeless
and never had an issue.
I am going for tubeless.

q) Where is it marked on the wheel rim
that it is tubeless or meant to use with tubes ?
OR is it left to be obvious with the bump
on the inner ridge ?

MT I am sure means tubeless
WM on the rim means it should be fitted with a tube.

I also notice on my avon road rider that it
states it is a tubeless tyre but in small
letters on tyre says - for tubeless rims use a
tube.

20201211_180650.jpg

[bwringer]

A cast wheel originally intended for tubeless use will be have the word "TUBELESS" somewhere on it. Usually this reads "TUBELESS TIRE APPLICABLE", or sometimes just "TUBELESS", IIRC.

Some tubeless GS wheels do not have the bead retention ridge. I have a front wheel from an 1982 GS1100GL on my wall that is marked tubeless and has no ridges.


As far as tires, some tires, mostly dirtbike tires, are still sold that can only be used with tubes.

Tubeless street tires can be used with or without tubes; in other words, the design of the wheel determines this, not the tire.

Spoked wheels obviously require tubes (although there are some recent adventure bikes that attach the spokes differently, and are tubeless. But that has nothing to do with your GS).

If you have cast wheels and they're not marked tubeless, then they came from the factory with tubes.

[ukjules]

Let me ask .. if one morning you woke up
and decided to drive 2700miles to Greece
with barely any backup (bar this site) or
money what tyre would you put on the bike ?
a gs550e 1980 ally standard wheels

I gave up with tyre levers a long time ago.

I suppose the answer is with what is meant
to be on the rims. And take a tube or
tyre can of that gunge stuff for emergencies.

tubes in tubeless tyres run hotter (or used too).
I wander if this runs true now with
say the avon road rider being a tubeless
tyre but on it with small print saying if put on a
tubeless rim insert a tube.
basically saying that it can do both but "might"
not run hot of fitted with tube ? (as they used to as tubed and tubeless
were different tyres internally).

I ran tubeless on last 5000m odyssey
and no probs. possibly luckily