Better than impact driver

[flyingace]

I just tried this, and it worked great.

When you have to remove those soft phillips-head screws, clamp a vice grip to the screw driver handle. Then when you remove the screw, push down hard with one hand on the screw driver handle and use the other hand to twist using the vice grip. I know I would have chewed up these screws if I hadn't done this.

 

[gremlin]

I just tried this, and it worked great.

When you have to remove those soft phillips-head screws, clamp a vice grip to the screw driver handle. Then when you remove the screw, push down hard with one hand on the screw driver handle and use the other hand to twist using the vice grip. I know I would have chewed up these screws if I hadn't done this.

I have a #3 screwdriver that has a hex shaft. for some of the screws that i remove and install on drills and grinders. I put a wrench on it then press down hard and trun. bout in some cases the impact driver is needed.

 

[Unclesol]

SlipSTOP screwdrivers

SlipSTOP screwdrivers

Crude, but effective. For the best choice for removing "compromised fasteners", see http://www.wera.de/cgi-bin/vshop?ID=115686781661&HTML=wera_tech/wera_tech.html
My apologies for the plug, but it was just lying there...

 

[flyingace]

Actually, with a handle like that, you still have to apply downward force and sideways force at the same time with one hand. It's just a bigger handle on the screwdriver. With the vicegrips method, you can put all your weight into pressing down and simply turn with the vicegrips with the free hand. It separates the two motions better.

The guy before who suggested a screw-driver with hex-shaped handle for using a socket wrench has the right idea.

 

[Jethro]

Sorry, but I fail to see why I would ever chose to use this method instead of an impact driver- unless space is an issue and you haven't room to swing a hammer. Those impact drivers are pure gold-tap, tap, tap and it effortlessly removes the screw!

 

[jknappsax]

Space WAS the issue!

Space WAS the issue!

I started dropping my oil pan to check my sump screen two days before I was supposed to leave for the Deal's Gap converntion this year. It was a bear to take off with stock exhaust, and when I finally DID get the pan out, the phillips screws were seized. And there was NO room to swing the hammer for my impact driver. I ended up buying a motorcycle jack to give me enough room to remove the screws, but the header pipes kept me from jacking it up until I fashioned blocks to go between the frame and jack platform. THEN I had enough room to swing the hammer, and all worked out ok, except I missed my window for leaving for Deal's Gap. A one-hour job became a THREE DAY job! I should have known better.

 

[Unclesol]

Actually, with a handle like that, you still have to apply downward force and sideways force at the same time with one hand. It's just a bigger handle on the screwdriver. With the vicegrips method, you can put all your weight into pressing down and simply turn with the vicegrips with the free hand. It separates the two motions better.

The guy before who suggested a screw-driver with hex-shaped handle for using a socket wrench has the right idea.

Actually, you missed the point. Although the handle is more comforable and gives you much better torque transfer due to the soft inserts, the real advantage is the fact that the tips of the blades are laser-etched. This creates a very hard, rough surface, that "bites" into the screw. This means you don't need to waste your energy pushing on the ned of the handle to keep it from slipping out, instead you can put more of your force into turning the screw. These screwdrivers also include a hex bolster on the blade right below the handle), so you can put a wrench (or vice grips) on for some extra leverage.
I recently used this to remove the screws from my master cylinder cover that were almost completely stripped out, and I was able to get them out.

 

[mark]

The post is entitled, "better than an impact driver". Sometimes the vice-grip thing on a screw driver works for difficult philips screws, but I think saying that it better is a bit of an overstatement. Sometimes in my experience its a lot worse.

 

[J_C]

I still can't figure out the right technique to using an impact driver... you line it up with the screw, push it in until it stops, and then whack it? Maybe I need a bigger hammer. It never seems to do anything for me.

 

[flyingace]

Sorry, but I fail to see why I would ever chose to use this method instead of an impact driver- unless space is an issue and you haven't room to swing a hammer. Those impact drivers are pure gold-tap, tap, tap and it effortlessly removes the screw!

I've had horrible luck with impact drivers - they only seem to strip out the screws faster. Maybe I have a crappy one - I don't know.

This method allows you to push down first and then twist - splitting up the motion. If the screw doesn't come out, you can stop 'twisting' before it's stripped. I only know it worked on screws I know I would have stripped otherwise.

 

[Jethro]

I still can't figure out the right technique to using an impact driver... you line it up with the screw, push it in until it stops, and then whack it? Maybe I need a bigger hammer. It never seems to do anything for me.

I've had horrible luck with impact drivers - they only seem to strip out the screws faster. Maybe I have a crappy one - I don't know.

This method allows you to push down first and then twist - splitting up the motion. If the screw doesn't come out, you can stop 'twisting' before it's stripped.

I must think that you guys are not using the tool correctly! When used correctly, the screw doesn't even have to resemble a phillips head. I have removed screws with an impact driver that were so absolutely stripped, they looked like they were drilled out already. I've even had so much confidence with the tool that I have reused these totally, 100% stripped screws when I didn't have replacements on hand.

 

[J_C]

Yeah, I am most likely doing it wrong.... So first I set it so that when the two parts get pushed together the screwdriver head goes left. Then I put the bit into the screw head. I push the base of the driver towards the screw until it stops, then I hold it and whack it with a regular hammer. Am I missing something?

 

[flyingace]

Jethro,
Why don't you create a web page on using an impact driver. You could be the 'impact man'.

 

[retrex]

A couple of twisted thoughts

A couple of twisted thoughts

Ditto Jethro on the usefulness of the impact driver. Without it I never would have been able to remove rusted frozen stator cover screws to replace stator assembly nor disassemble my carbs the first time, some twenty odd years ago.

I have two thoughts on removing screws that I'll just throw out there for conversation sake. First most screws are stripped because a. you did not prelube the screws with a good penetrating oil with sufficient time to soak, b. you don't have the right sized/shaped screw bit, and c. you are not using controled torque. I just cleaned my carbs for the umpteenth time. Removing the screws was a snap because I did a. b. and c.. I prelubed all the screws with oil for 24 hours before disassembly. I have a screw driver kit with a wide assortment of different sized and shaped bits so I fit the all the different screw head tightly. And lastly I use either a Black and Decker swivel angle ratcheting screw driver or a 1/4 inch drive ratchet socket wrench with 1/4 socket to hold the bits firmly in the screw head and to apply controled torque. There may be those among you out there that poo poo this methodolgy, but as proof let me offer that I recently remove all of the phillips screws on the engine and replaced them with allen heads using this procedure. Even the stator cover screws which I put in with an impact driver over twenty years ago. Not a single screw required me to resort to the impact driver for removal. One trick that I did employ was if a screw was being stubborn about breaking free, I reversed ratchet, or locked it on the B&D, and tightened it a hair to break it free.

The second thing I'd like to bring to this discussion is a high tech whozits. I'm sure that I have seen this do-hickey talked about here in the forum. It's called a Grabit and it can be your best friend when you have stripped a screw head. To put it plainly this thing works. One end of it is a burr and the other end a high tech easy out. You put it in your drill, burr a clean bore in the stripped head, reverse the Grabit in the drill to have the easyout like end out and stick it in the cleaned bore, flip the drill to reverse. Press down on the drill and squeeze the trigger, and a vast majority of the time the screw breaks free with amazing ease. This tool is a godsend. Look for it in Loews or online. Using the afore mentioned technique and the latter Grabit tool has made the impact driver almost a forgotten tool in my kit. But it's still there if I ever need it.

 

[Jethro]

Doug had praised the Grabit tool many times.

 

[Clone]

There is no substitute for an Impact Driver, one wack with a hammer and it is free, push and twist and still try to keep the screwdriver from slipping or the bike moving away is just not worth the effort.
You must make sure the driver is going to turn the right way when you hit it with the hammer, just like a ratchet they go both ways:-D make sure you have it snugged up tight and then wack, your ok.

 

[Llamaguy]

Blow torches work well, too. Especially in combination with an impact driver.

 

[jaberwok]

Yeah, I am most likely doing it wrong.... So first I set it so that when the two parts get pushed together the screwdriver head goes left. Then I put the bit into the screw head. I push the base of the driver towards the screw until it stops, then I hold it and whack it with a regular hammer. Am I missing something?

An impact driver has saved me many headaches in the past. I don't push mine in then hit it. I let the blow of the hammer push the driver into the screw. The bit twists as you push it in, so with you pushing it in then hitting it the bit wont turn and your bolt wont budge.

As for whether or not vicegrips and a screwdriver are better than an impact driver.... it depends on the job at hand.... there are no absolutes in life... (there is that old adage about death and taxes though )

Enjoy

 

[NATEO]

I just got one tonight, and at first I had the same problem as J_C. I used the right size bit, lined it up, and hit a few times, and nothing happened. then I realized that you have to line it up and turn it just a little bit. one hit and the screw broke free. I love this thing!!!

 

[J_C]

Interesting.... I'll try that next time!