It is real becuase its says SH-775 on the side of the housing; fakes do not!
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Charging system hasn't failed, should I mess with it?
- Thread starter 93Bandit
- Start date
It is real becuase its says SH-775 on the side of the housing; fakes do not!
93Bandit, I doubt anyone can accurately tell you when that the charging system will fail. On the other hand, nobody wants to tell you it won't fail and have that on their conscience if it does happen. You've read enough on this topic to know the risk and can now make a tough decision, but you have to make it. (Sounds like your seriously considering the R/R swap, but I typed most of this yesterday and figured I'd finish and post it.)
I will say that my charging system seemed fine with 27k miles on an immaculate, near mint looking bike. It lived in the dry desert southwest, in a garage of a mechanic school's instructor. Needs nothing, he said when I bought it (which was far from the truth). New battery, cranks strong etc. etc. After sorting many hidden issues with this new to me bike, I decided to head out on a 400 mile trip which went just fine. Later on, during my second trip, after 500 miles, I found myself stranded in the middle of nowhere. Couldn't bump start, battery was shot, R/R fried! Called my wife from a dying cell phone and waited for five hours to be rescued.
The good side of this story is that in the middle of the Alamo Navajo Reservation, at midnight, with no clouds in the sky, one can see the Milky Way and it leads to deep thoughts about our existence. About how so many people groups exist on this spinning rock and we all speak different languages. Some, being more technologically advanced than others and one group, in particular, on an island in the Pacific was able to engineer, assemble and mass produce millions and millions of these machines that so efficiently carry us to such uninhabited locations. Furthermore, one of these methodically assembled machines transported me to this magical place, waiting until this precise moment to reveal it's secret. Oh, how many millions of people around the world, in utter silence and solitude, must have gazed upon the heavens pondering the answer to this question.
Now, in this moment, this long moment, of pondering why, why did it choose this exact place and time to reveal such a dark secret? You, my friend, have an advantage. You have the opportunity to never need to ask this question.
So, in my case, the R/R failed. I had good grounds and thought I had cleaned and used dieclectric grease on all connections, but maybe I missed one or the unit was just done. When that unit failed it let the stator pump way too much power into the battery putting a strain on the battery and the rest of the wiring. In all, after a wonderful evening under the stars, I ordered an SH775 and purchased a new battery. The stator lasted another 18k miles before giving up. Fortunately I was in town this time and could bump start when I had to shut off the engine.
A volt meter to monitor your charging voltage would help you at least determine if you need to ride to a civilized location before shutting off the bike. If the voltage varies out of the 13v to 14v range you'll know right away.
Just for reference, here's where I was star gazing that night. Took this at dusk. Thankfully that haze on the horizon didn't block the view after dark.
I will say that my charging system seemed fine with 27k miles on an immaculate, near mint looking bike. It lived in the dry desert southwest, in a garage of a mechanic school's instructor. Needs nothing, he said when I bought it (which was far from the truth). New battery, cranks strong etc. etc. After sorting many hidden issues with this new to me bike, I decided to head out on a 400 mile trip which went just fine. Later on, during my second trip, after 500 miles, I found myself stranded in the middle of nowhere. Couldn't bump start, battery was shot, R/R fried! Called my wife from a dying cell phone and waited for five hours to be rescued.
The good side of this story is that in the middle of the Alamo Navajo Reservation, at midnight, with no clouds in the sky, one can see the Milky Way and it leads to deep thoughts about our existence. About how so many people groups exist on this spinning rock and we all speak different languages. Some, being more technologically advanced than others and one group, in particular, on an island in the Pacific was able to engineer, assemble and mass produce millions and millions of these machines that so efficiently carry us to such uninhabited locations. Furthermore, one of these methodically assembled machines transported me to this magical place, waiting until this precise moment to reveal it's secret. Oh, how many millions of people around the world, in utter silence and solitude, must have gazed upon the heavens pondering the answer to this question.
Now, in this moment, this long moment, of pondering why, why did it choose this exact place and time to reveal such a dark secret? You, my friend, have an advantage. You have the opportunity to never need to ask this question.
So, in my case, the R/R failed. I had good grounds and thought I had cleaned and used dieclectric grease on all connections, but maybe I missed one or the unit was just done. When that unit failed it let the stator pump way too much power into the battery putting a strain on the battery and the rest of the wiring. In all, after a wonderful evening under the stars, I ordered an SH775 and purchased a new battery. The stator lasted another 18k miles before giving up. Fortunately I was in town this time and could bump start when I had to shut off the engine.
A volt meter to monitor your charging voltage would help you at least determine if you need to ride to a civilized location before shutting off the bike. If the voltage varies out of the 13v to 14v range you'll know right away.
Just for reference, here's where I was star gazing that night. Took this at dusk. Thankfully that haze on the horizon didn't block the view after dark.
93Bandit, I doubt anyone can accurately tell you when that the charging system will fail. On the other hand, nobody wants to tell you it won't fail and have that on their conscience if it does happen. You've read enough on this topic to know the risk and can now make a tough decision, but you have to make it. (Sounds like your seriously considering the R/R swap, but I typed most of this yesterday and figured I'd finish and post it.)
I will say that my charging system seemed fine with 27k miles on an immaculate, near mint looking bike. It lived in the dry desert southwest, in a garage of a mechanic school's instructor. Needs nothing, he said when I bought it (which was far from the truth). New battery, cranks strong etc. etc. After sorting many hidden issues with this new to me bike, I decided to head out on a 400 mile trip which went just fine. Later on, during my second trip, after 500 miles, I found myself stranded in the middle of nowhere. Couldn't bump start, battery was shot, R/R fried! Called my wife from a dying cell phone and waited for five hours to be rescued.
The good side of this story is that in the middle of the Alamo Navajo Reservation, at midnight, with no clouds in the sky, one can see the Milky Way and it leads to deep thoughts about our existence. About how so many people groups exist on this spinning rock and we all speak different languages. Some, being more technologically advanced than others and one group, in particular, on an island in the Pacific was able to engineer, assemble and mass produce millions and millions of these machines that so efficiently carry us to such uninhabited locations. Furthermore, one of these methodically assembled machines transported me to this magical place, waiting until this precise moment to reveal it's secret. Oh, how many millions of people around the world, in utter silence and solitude, must have gazed upon the heavens pondering the answer to this question.
Now, in this moment, this long moment, of pondering why, why did it choose this exact place and time to reveal such a dark secret? You, my friend, have an advantage. You have the opportunity to never need to ask this question.
So, in my case, the R/R failed. I had good grounds and thought I had cleaned and used dieclectric grease on all connections, but maybe I missed one or the unit was just done. When that unit failed it let the stator pump way too much power into the battery putting a strain on the battery and the rest of the wiring. In all, after a wonderful evening under the stars, I ordered an SH775 and purchased a new battery. The stator lasted another 18k miles before giving up. Fortunately I was in town this time and could bump start when I had to shut off the engine.
A volt meter to monitor your charging voltage would help you at least determine if you need to ride to a civilized location before shutting off the bike. If the voltage varies out of the 13v to 14v range you'll know right away.
Just for reference, here's where I was star gazing that night. Took this at dusk. Thankfully that haze on the horizon didn't block the view after dark.
You are exactly correct that there are unseen cumulative stresses that the charging system has been exposed to that are difficult if not impossible to discern.
The shunt style R/R stresses both the stator and the R/R (as well as the wiring between the two) with the most probable outcome being the stator insulation burns and fails. Alternatively the R/R may fail first on one of several ways. The most likely is either A, it shorts out blowing the main fuse, or B.) stops regulating and over charges the battery.
There are two tests that I mentioned that do look for cumulative damage to the stator. A.) leg to ground VAC tests at 5K RPM and B.) visual inspection of the stator.
You can also look for cumulative damage in the form of melted connector for the stator connects.
In contrast you can't measure cumulative damage to the R/R . It is a sealed unit and there are no tests without special equipment to test the unit stand alone.
The charging system involves R/R ,stator , battery and wiring and it can all go to $hit under various failure scenarios. The only reason I can see to not change an R/R to a series unit is if the stator does not show excessive heating. If it does everything else is being stresses or could see additional stress as well.
(steve) ...I guess this is what you mean...from my 650 manual. Indeed you are correct-two legs only! "switched leg" is not obviously regulated excepting by the "voltage plane" imposed by the others? for lack of a better handle.. This'd be the Nippon-Denso ? original. Mine certainly got hot and I replaced it.
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Lastly, (drifting away solving a dead case ...) the Honda 232-238 Shunt...yes, they are not the Fave R/R hereabouts, but the comparison of all this points to a possible reason the Suzuki R/Rs failed so badly, where the Honda shindegnen did not...with three shunt scrs..weak varnish with oil dripping on them might be yet another.
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yes, Posplayer...looks to be the same r/r as the one from my GSX400, (as in the gs250-300's) I printed a few posts up...)
Whatever the problem with "shunts" both of these must be weak compared to the shindengen varieties...
Whatever the problem with "shunts" both of these must be weak compared to the shindengen varieties...
I may be mis interpreting the schematic of the single SCR, but it appears when the SCR is shorted it is shorting the low Bl/W stator leg to the positive terminal of the battery.
Back in about 2010, I deduced that due to the limited control authority (only a single stator leg), this was the only way for a battery to overcharge.
There was simple no way that I could rationalize that bad connection could cause overcharging with a 5 wire R/R ( excluding the 6 wire with voltage sense).
Back in about 2010, I deduced that due to the limited control authority (only a single stator leg), this was the only way for a battery to overcharge.
There was simple no way that I could rationalize that bad connection could cause overcharging with a 5 wire R/R ( excluding the 6 wire with voltage sense).
fbody_mike
Forum Mentor
My bit of advice is to get sh775 regulator, I've had a few oem Suzuki regulators fail where they started over charging. One just recently even. Taking out the ignitor can be a big hassle and expensive.
93Bandit
Forum Mentor
I ordered a used SH775 for the 850L, and it should arrive tomorrow or Tuesday.
My road trip has been canceled, but I've had the opportunity to do a lot of the work I've been putting off on the bike so I've slowly been checking things off the list. I'm to the electrical now, and today I decided to see what charging voltage is. At idle, its 16.5V and at 3k its 17.5V. Last time I checked charging voltage, it was around 14.5V if I remember correctly. So now that it's at 17.5V, that means my R/R is not working correctly, right? Glad I went ahead and ordered an R/R.
My road trip has been canceled, but I've had the opportunity to do a lot of the work I've been putting off on the bike so I've slowly been checking things off the list. I'm to the electrical now, and today I decided to see what charging voltage is. At idle, its 16.5V and at 3k its 17.5V. Last time I checked charging voltage, it was around 14.5V if I remember correctly. So now that it's at 17.5V, that means my R/R is not working correctly, right? Glad I went ahead and ordered an R/R.
93Bandit
Forum Mentor
I installed the SH775 today on my 850L and it's now charging at 14.46V. Glad that's working as it should!
For future reference if anyone needs an answer, the SH775 will bolt directly in the same place as the original R/R with the original fasteners, on the bottom of the battery box, on an 83 850L.
For future reference if anyone needs an answer, the SH775 will bolt directly in the same place as the original R/R with the original fasteners, on the bottom of the battery box, on an 83 850L.
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That same spot works for the G model as well. Curiously enough, my stock reg/rec unit was next to the fuse panel, but there was no way the larger SH775 would fit there.
93Bandit
Forum Mentor
Where there already threaded holes on the bottom of the battery box for yours?
Yes. I regret not pulling the battery box and turning it over to mount it though. It was a real bear to fasten in place.
93Bandit
Forum Mentor
Cool, good to know for my 850G.
Funny you mention removing the battery box. Before I started working on it, I wondered if I would be able to fasten the new module in place with the battery box in the bike. After evaluating the situation, I decided it would just be easier to pull the box out. I'm glad I did because it was super easy to do, and I had to use an impact screwdriver to get the fasteners broke loose. I would have never gotten them out had I left the box in place, and i likely would have stripped the heads. Also, since the batt box was out I was able to clean off some surface rust and repaint it to help prevent it from rusting out.
G
Guest
Guest
I love my Compu Fire, 12 years now and going strong.
G
Guest
Guest
I have had my Compu-fire for close to that long with no problems. I was worried about it recently because my battery has gone dead on me a few times. Then I realized that my MotoBatt battery is almost 9 years old when a friend told me they don't last more than two or three years on average. I guess I have gotten a lot of service out of that battery.
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