First impressions and .....

[rkj2002]

The new bike (1985 GS700e) came a few days ago and although my first ride was cut short because of charging issues, I got a decent feel for the machine. It feels quite a bit heavier than the Honda 650sc I've been riding for the last three years, the Suzuki is fifty pounds more bike but feels lighter on the road but also feels more of a serious road machine, the extra weight feels right and a little less likely to pushed around by wind currents and truck back drafts. It does handle beautifully and is very light on its feet

Generally I think the bike will work for me but I could use a little help; I've been reading the stator papers (for many nights) but can someone tell me where the connectors are from the stator to the regulator, I think there should be one set of bullet connectors coming off the stator pig tail (this one location would be helpful) and one connection at the regulator itself, right? Do you test all three stator wires for output and what should I set my meter to (what scale)- are we measuring volts, amps when running and is there a test at rest with an ohm meter???

The ground issue, should you use the regulator's base for the ground tap or is there a wire coming off the regulator itself for this. The diagrams in the stator papers are a bit confusing.

And last, the exhaust system; its too loud- any other bikes have the same pipe (1983 GS700e/es)? and does anyone have any suggestions for a quiet street pipe- The folks at Bassani are looking for something but I have no idea what their pipes sound like.

Thanks for any direction you can send my way on any of these issues, Rick

 

[rkj2002]

Stator plugs and exhaust-please help

Stator plugs and exhaust-please help

I'm trying to get a location on the bullet connectors on the end of the stator pigtail and to ask if any other bikes take the same exhaust as the 1985 GS700e, may be the 1983 GS750?

Also the lower post has regulator ground locations/wiring questions.

Thanks, Rick

The new bike (1985 GS700e) came a few days ago and although my first ride was cut short because of charging issues, I got a decent feel for the machine. It feels quite a bit heavier than the Honda 650sc I've been riding for the last three years, the Suzuki is fifty pounds more bike but feels lighter on the road but also feels more of a serious road machine, the extra weight feels right and a little less likely to pushed around by wind currents and truck back drafts. It does handle beautifully and is very light on its feet

Generally I think the bike will work for me but I could use a little help; I've been reading the stator papers (for many nights) but can someone tell me where the connectors are from the stator to the regulator, I think there should be one set of bullet connectors coming off the stator pig tail (this one location would be helpful) and one connection at the regulator itself, right? Do you test all three stator wires for output and what should I set my meter to (what scale)- are we measuring volts, amps when running and is there a test at rest with an ohm meter???

The ground issue, should you use the regulator's base for the ground tap or is there a wire coming off the regulator itself for this. The diagrams in the stator papers are a bit confusing.

And last, the exhaust system; its too loud- any other bikes have the same pipe (1983 GS700e/es)? and does anyone have any suggestions for a quiet street pipe- The folks at Bassani are looking for something but I have no idea what their pipes sound like.

Thanks for any direction you can send my way on any of these issues, Rick

 

[Griffin]

Told ya it was easy to ride....


On this particular model, the three wires from the stator (which are actually yellow) run up underneath the tank and plug into three other wires that disappear into the netherworld of the wiring harness. Three wires emerge from the other end of the wiring harness and hook up to the reg/rec.

Last fall I replaced the reg/rec with an aftermarket one. This spring I replaced the stator. I bypassed the wires in the wiring harness and went straight to the reg/rec from the stator. I then untaped the harness, removed the now unnecessary wires, and retaped it back up. The reg/rec should be directly grounded to the negative battery terminal, you may need to solder on an extension to the rr's ground wire to get there.

If you have a sensing wire on your new rr (Honda type), you can tie it into the oil pressure switch wire (green and orange, I believe) that runs right by the rr mounting plate. You'll have less voltage drop to the sense wire that way instead of through the tailight, because the oil pressure switch runs straight from the battery, and doesn't go through the ignition switch.


By the way, I have a spare stock exhaust system for the GS700. It isn't perfect, so if you're looking for show quality, this one isn't it. But it's not rusted out at all and is fully useable. Let me know if you're interested in it, I'm sure we can work something out, although shipping won't be cheap.


Edit: Yes the '83 GS750E/ES pipes are identical, just black not chromed. Those are the only other GS pipes that are direct GS700 bolt-ons with no modifications to either bike or pipes.

 

[rkj2002]

Told ya it was easy to ride....


On this particular model, the three wires from the stator (which are actually yellow) run up underneath the tank and plug into three other wires that disappear into the netherworld of the wiring harness. Three wires emerge from the other end of the wiring harness and hook up to the reg/rec.

Last fall I replaced the reg/rec with an aftermarket one. This spring I replaced the stator. I bypassed the wires in the wiring harness and went straight to the reg/rec from the stator. I then untaped the harness, removed the now unnecessary wires, and retaped it back up. The reg/rec should be directly grounded to the negative battery terminal, you may need to solder on an extension to the rr's ground wire to get there.

If you have a sensing wire on your new rr (Honda type), you can tie it into the oil pressure switch wire (green and orange, I believe) that runs right by the rr mounting plate. You'll have less voltage drop to the sense wire that way instead of through the tailight, because the oil pressure switch runs straight from the battery, and doesn't go through the ignition switch.


By the way, I have a spare stock exhaust system for the GS700. It isn't perfect, so if you're looking for show quality, this one isn't it. But it's not rusted out at all and is fully useable. Let me know if you're interested in it, I'm sure we can work something out, although shipping won't be cheap.


Edit: Yes the '83 GS750E/ES pipes are identical, just black not chromed. Those are the only other GS pipes that are direct GS700 bolt-ons with no modifications to either bike or pipes.

Thank you Griffin, I should take the tank off, right? to get at the stator wiring plugs. Can I check the stator output wires while the bike is running and what scale on the meter do I use; I'll have an idle reading and then give the throttle a blip and see what the readings say then too, right? Then I'll do the same thing at the rr and see what my readings are there.

Its my understanding that the rr is grounded but not to a good place or it can be corroded and not making good connection; so I take the existing ground wire from the rr and extend it to the negative side of the battery (I think I'll do that first).

This is the email mail I got from Ricks electric on parts-

"Thank you for the email. We offer a rec/reg (part# 10-222) for $95 and a stator (part# 21-303) for $140. We have both pieces in stock and there is no charge for shipping. If you would like to place an order, just give us a call or go right to our website."

Should I buy these or is there a better option, is the Honda's rr a better unit and how does it stack up money wise?

My exhaust system is mint but its just loud, I'm used to, and like, a quiet motorcyle. Unfortuntaly, there are no systems out there right now for either the 83 750 or our machines- there are plenty of pipes for the 79-82 GS750's but I think those are the two valve cylinder motors and may be different, although I'm a good welder so... I'll keep looking for a set-up on ebay and I'll keep trying to see if someone has a leftover on the self somewhere...

Again, thank you so much for your help and guidence, newyorkRick

 

[Griffin]

If you have a stock exhaust and it's loud, then something is not right with it. These exhaust notes are so quiet, the engine noise drowns out the exhaust note at most rpms.

Rick's stuff is good, but the reg/rec is the stock size one, and it's kind of flimsy. I prefer the beefy Honda styled ones. If you look one up that is for the Honda CX500/650, those are good to go.

Pm Duanage, he usually has some used Honda RRs on hand that he sells pretty reasonably.


Test the stator output while the bike is running. You can disconnect all three wires and do it, it won't hurt anything. You should put your multimete on the 200V Vac setting, and measure voltage across each set of wires coming from the stator (1-2, 2-3, 1-3). You should get between 50-75 Vac on each leg. If you don't, bad stator. Shut the bike off, set the meter to the 200k ohm setting, and measure resistance across all three legs just like you did voltage. You should get infinite resistance. If you don't, and get 0.00 resistance, you've got a short somewhere, bad stator.

 

[rkj2002]

I have DC-V scale 200 (or is it AC-V 200, can't imagine that is right) , I think that's the one I want, yes?

How can I tell the number's on the "(1-2, 2-3, 1-3)" stator wires? And where is the best/easiest place to tap in to, to measure from

That's interesting about the exhaust noise level, I'll have to check for leaks although it seems quite loud out the pipes (outlets), it doesn't sound like a leaky system.

Thank you

If you have a stock exhaust and it's loud, then something is not right with it. These exhaust notes are so quiet, the engine noise drowns out the exhaust note at most rpms.

Rick's stuff is good, but the reg/rec is the stock size one, and it's kind of flimsy. I prefer the beefy Honda styled ones. If you look one up that is for the Honda CX500/650, those are good to go.

Pm Duanage, he usually has some used Honda RRs on hand that he sells pretty reasonably.


Test the stator output while the bike is running. You can disconnect all three wires and do it, it won't hurt anything. You should put your multimete on the 200V Vac setting, and measure voltage across each set of wires coming from the stator (1-2, 2-3, 1-3). You should get between 50-75 Vac on each leg. If you don't, bad stator. Shut the bike off, set the meter to the 200k ohm setting, and measure resistance across all three legs just like you did voltage. You should get infinite resistance. If you don't, and get 0.00 resistance, you've got a short somewhere, bad stator.

 

[Griffin]

I have DC-V scale 200 (or is it AC-V 200, can't imagine that is right) , I think that's the one I want, yes?

How can I tell the number's on the "(1-2, 2-3, 1-3)" stator wires? And where is the best/easiest place to tap in to, to measure from

That's interesting about the exhaust noise level, I'll have to check for leaks although it seems quite loud out the pipes (outlets), it doesn't sound like a leaky system.

Thank you

There actually aren't any numbers on the wires. I was just illustrating that you have to measure every possible combination of wires coming from the stator. To measure the voltage (and resistance), simply unplug the wires from the reg/rec.

You can use both the 200 Vdc and 200 Vac scales when performing checks on your bike. Vdc for everything other than your stator votage, Vac for stator voltage only. If you come across voltage that exceeds 200 V in either flavor, you've got BIG problems....:-s

If your exhaust is loud, check the end baffles to make sure they are intact, not rusty, and haven't been drilled out by a previous owner trying to make his own "performance" exhaust. Any aftermarket exhaust you get is going to be noticeably louder than the stock exhaust is, assuming the stock exhaust is performing correctly and relatively intact. The EPA really put the clamps on motorcycle noise emissions in the early 80s, and later model GSes have a really muted exhaust note.

 

[850 Combat]

Before buying parts, I would go through the diagnostic in the Stator papers. You would be amazed how often they can be made to charge properly wiyhout actually replacing the Stator and R/R. I actually made 4 of mine charge by fixing connections and grounds. In the future, I intend to eliminate the bullet connectors, and hard wire the stator to the R/R.

 

[Nessism]

The stock exhaust on those bikes does have sort of a rumble at low rpm but you won't find anything quieter overall. As for the charging system, it's pretty darn easy to trace the wires coming out of the stator cover (and under the starter cover) until they hook into the harness. Unplug them where they hook into the main harness and check for AC voltage output there per the Stator Papers. The main problem with the charging system is the R/R gounding so that is where many people start. I suggest you check everything.

Good luck.

 

[rkj2002]

Can you tell me what #6 fuse is for, I can't read it on the schematic. So far I have #1 oil temp gauge, 2- signal lights, 3- oil pressure circuit, 4- starter motor, 5- starter relay, 6-?, 7-RR, 8- just says fuse

Is this right so far?

Thank you

The stock exhaust on those bikes does have sort of a rumble at low rpm but you won't find anything quieter overall. As for the charging system, it's pretty darn easy to trace the wires coming out of the stator cover (and under the starter cover) until they hook into the harness. Unplug them where they hook into the main harness and check for AC voltage output there per the Stator Papers. The main problem with the charging system is the R/R gounding so that is where many people start. I suggest you check everything.

Good luck.

 

[rkj2002]

Can you tell me what #6 fuse is for, I can't read it on the schematic. So far I have #1 oil temp gauge, 2- signal lights, 3- oil pressure circuit, 4- starter motor, 5- starter relay, 6-?, 7-RR, 8- just says fuse

Is this right so far?

Thank you

Oh boy, got that totally wrong, if anyone has the proper fuse layout please let me know.

The wires on the RR have three yellow's (those are the charging wires from the stator, which one is the ground please? I have a red on one end and a black with a white tracer on the other.

 

[rkj2002]

Okay, really sorry for all the confusion, the fuse block clearly says what each fuse is for and the black (white tracer) is the ground. even has an aux out, cool!

Oh boy, got that totally wrong, if anyone has the proper fuse layout please let me know.

The wires on the RR have three yellow's (those are the charging wires from the stator, which one is the ground please? I have a red on one end and a black with a white tracer on the other.

 

[spyug]

Just wanted to add to this thread by saying that you should make sure that your connectors and contacts are clean and not corroded. Corrosion adds resistance to the circuits which can result in voltage drops which in turn can cause components to fail. I had just gone through this with my charging system.

I was getting charging but it wasn't correct i.e. 14+volts at idle dropping off after 3000 rpm.

I first checked stator output and seemed to get about 22 volts on each leg. definitely not right. I tried to clean the connector but didn't get any real change. I did then clip off the plastic connector ( that plugs into the r/r) and replaced them with fresh spades. Checked again and now getting up to 90v on each leg at 5000rpm.

It was still charging when checked across the battery terminals but only reaching around 13 volts from about 2500 to 5000. Next I cleaned the contacts to the fuse block. As these were hard to get out of the plastic connectors, I dipped the whole plug in liquid Tarn-X (jewelry cleaner) for about 2 minutes each. Problem solved.

Now at idle there is no charge but it kicks in around 2500 and goes strongly to 14.5+ at 5000 which according to my manual is within spec.

As mentioned, the stock R/rs are not strong and many change them out but first try running an additional ground from the black/white lead directly to the battery negative pole. When I first got my GS 3 seasons back it didn't charge at all and this mod got me charging...not correctly but charging.

As you will read, electrics are a major issue on these and most every other old Jap m/c but taking care of the connects can make a huge difference.

Good luck with it.

cheers,
Spyug

 

[rkj2002]

Thanks spyug

Tarn-x, wow, I never thought of that treatment for blade fuse holders. That might be the best treatment I've heard yet! I just use the fuse and spray contact cleaner and the airgun; working the fuse in and out and blowing/spraying as I go. If I can't tighten up a loose female holder I curve the fuse spades slightly to make a tighter connection or just add another inline circuit. My Honda has the fuse box right under the headlight! Now covered with a small fairing

Thank you for your readings, the more facts I have the better I feel about making all these tests, you guys really know these motorcycles..... so cool.

Today I should be able to devote time to my new honey, I've got it apart and the proper jumpers all set to go. The family (love them) hopefully will give me a break today

Thanks so much, Rick

Just wanted to add to this thread by saying that you should make sure that your connectors and contacts are clean and not corroded. Corrosion adds resistance to the circuits which can result in voltage drops which in turn can cause components to fail. I had just gone through this with my charging system.

I was getting charging but it wasn't correct i.e. 14+volts at idle dropping off after 3000 rpm.

I first checked stator output and seemed to get about 22 volts on each leg. definitely not right. I tried to clean the connector but didn't get any real change. I did then clip off the plastic connector ( that plugs into the r/r) and replaced them with fresh spades. Checked again and now getting up to 90v on each leg at 5000rpm.

It was still charging when checked across the battery terminals but only reaching around 13 volts from about 2500 to 5000. Next I cleaned the contacts to the fuse block. As these were hard to get out of the plastic connectors, I dipped the whole plug in liquid Tarn-X (jewelry cleaner) for about 2 minutes each. Problem solved.

Now at idle there is no charge but it kicks in around 2500 and goes strongly to 14.5+ at 5000 which according to my manual is within spec.

As mentioned, the stock R/rs are not strong and many change them out but first try running an additional ground from the black/white lead directly to the battery negative pole. When I first got my GS 3 seasons back it didn't charge at all and this mod got me charging...not correctly but charging.

As you will read, electrics are a major issue on these and most every other old Jap m/c but taking care of the connects can make a huge difference.

Good luck with it.

cheers,
Spyug

 

[rkj2002]

Well, crapola.....

First I did an ohm test (on the 200k scale) on 1-2, 2-3, and the 1-3 as you said at the rr plug; all read 0.00- Then I took them at the stator pigtail and got the same readings (all the connections looked mint too by the way)

I then took readings on the VAC scale (200 meter reading scale) and got between 5-7 to 9-4 at idle and up to 9.2-15 at four grand. All of these readings were the same at the stator pigtail so I guess my charging system is shot.

When I was testing at the rr plug I plugged in a ground that went from the plug to the negative side of the battery, I don't know if this did anything as the readings did not change at all...

Is there any other tests I can do or are we sure at this point its order-up time?

Ricks tells me the stator and the rr they offer is factory spec units, if I'm going to have to buy these pieces anyway is there a better (read heavier duty) stator out there somewhere and what year Honda cx500/650 do I want for the rr?

I'm all for good charging systems; when I'm/we're out there in the middle of nowhere it would do my mental health a world of good

Thank you everyone, Rick

If you have a stock exhaust and it's loud, then something is not right with it. These exhaust notes are so quiet, the engine noise drowns out the exhaust note at most rpms.

Rick's stuff is good, but the reg/rec is the stock size one, and it's kind of flimsy. I prefer the beefy Honda styled ones. If you look one up that is for the Honda CX500/650, those are good to go.

Pm Duanage, he usually has some used Honda RRs on hand that he sells pretty reasonably.


Test the stator output while the bike is running. You can disconnect all three wires and do it, it won't hurt anything. You should put your multimete on the 200V Vac setting, and measure voltage across each set of wires coming from the stator (1-2, 2-3, 1-3). You should get between 50-75 Vac on each leg. If you don't, bad stator. Shut the bike off, set the meter to the 200k ohm setting, and measure resistance across all three legs just like you did voltage. You should get infinite resistance. If you don't, and get 0.00 resistance, you've got a short somewhere, bad stator.

 

[Rkt-Rch]

Good Luck... I myself have had many of the same issues as yourself with the charging system on this bike, I believe I have actually fixed the problem this time but only time will tell. Cleaning all the connections is a first step and for useing Tarn-X it works great but remember that you just removed oxidation,corrision,dirt,etc.. and if not protected with a conn type spray protector it will come back and extremly fast.. Ask me how I know !!! LOL... If you look up my threads I actually found a GS 1100 ?? R/R on e-bay by mistake and ordered it and ended up working great so far (same plug-in terminal connector).
Regulates and Rectifies just like the stoke one but is a little bit larger and hopefully will last longer and yeah I should have went to the newer Yamaha R/R or the Honda (If it goes again I will).

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=134690&page=17

The stator papers are and should be your Suzuki bible.

 

[rkj2002]

Thanks, I'll have to pick a good rr from all these choices!

Did you replace the stator, is there a better, higher out-put one available for our bikes??

I was also wondering if it makes any difference which stator wire goes where on the rr; are they all the same, there's no color coding.

Rick

Good Luck... I myself have had many of the same issues as yourself with the charging system on this bike, I believe I have actually fixed the problem this time but only time will tell. Cleaning all the connections is a first step and for useing Tarn-X it works great but remember that you just removed oxidation,corrision,dirt,etc.. and if not protected with a conn type spray protector it will come back and extremly fast.. Ask me how I know !!! LOL... If you look up my threads I actually found a GS 1100 ?? R/R on e-bay by mistake and ordered it and ended up working great so far (same plug-in terminal connector).
Regulates and Rectifies just like the stoke one but is a little bit larger and hopefully will last longer and yeah I should have went to the newer Yamaha R/R or the Honda (If it goes again I will).

http://www.thegsresources.com/_forum/showthread.php?t=134690&page=17

The stator papers are and should be your Suzuki bible.

 

[Griffin]

Stator wires are all interchangeable, it doesn't matter which ones go to which lead from the RR.

I like RM stators. You need the RMG020.

http://www.rmstator.com/en/motorcycles/suzuki/gs_700_e/all_categories.htm

 

[reddirtrider]

Well, crapola.....

First I did an ohm test (on the 200k scale) on 1-2, 2-3, and the 1-3 as you said at the rr plug; all read 0.00- Then I took them at the stator pigtail and got the same readings (all the connections looked mint too by the way)

I then took readings on the VAC scale (200 meter reading scale) and got between 5-7 to 9-4 at idle and up to 9.2-15 at four grand. All of these readings were the same at the stator pigtail so I guess my charging system is shot.

..............

Thank you everyone, Rick

Are you sure the VAC readings on your meter are correct? What the voltage fluctuating that much at a set RPM? Try reading an outlet and see if the meter is good.

 

[Killer2600]

I then took readings on the VAC scale (200 meter reading scale) and got between 5-7 to 9-4 at idle and up to 9.2-15 at four grand. All of these readings were the same at the stator pigtail so I guess my charging system is shot.

Was the stator still plugged into the R/R, if so you need to check the stator voltage with it unplugged from the R/R otherwise the regulator will ground out excess voltage and give false readings.

Play carefully around AC (stator output), it's just as dangerous as the AC in your house.