Hours to split case?

[glib]

Do any of you know how many hours it takes to split the cases on an 1100E and reassemble (in the bike)? I have been asked if I would perform this work and I don?t want to underestimate the price. The purpose is to fix an oil leak and address possible leaking valve.

 

[Steve]

Depending on where the oil leak is, you don't need to "split the cases".

On the other hand, it would depend on your terminology. To do anything with a valve, you DO have to remove the head. When you remove the head, it is highly recommended to remove the cylinders and replace the base gasket. Splitting the cases is usually only necessary to access the bits and pieces of the crank and transmission.

IF you have everything necessary, sitting on the bench, ready to go, AND have sufficient experience and/or training, a home mechanic might take 6-8 hours. A professional mechanic that has all the special tools necessary might do it a bit quicker.

I am in the middle of this process right now. Because of other things I am doing, it will be taking much longer, but I am not a professional mechanic and don't have all the special tools.

.

 

[dorkburger]

When I read "split the case" I read separating the bottom half of the engine from the top, so as Steve said, more clarification is needed.

 

[bwringer]

When I read "split the case" I read separating the bottom half of the engine from the top, so as Steve said, more clarification is needed.

"Splitting the cases" most often means separating the bottom end case halves. You need to do this to get to the transmission, crankshaft, etc. This is the terminology used in the manuals.

You can remove the cylinder head and cylinders (the "top end") in the frame without splitting the cases.

But to split the cases (separate the bottom end halves), you must remove the engine from the frame.

You can replace the crankshaft and countershaft and some assorted other seals and o-rings without splitting the cases, so it's unclear what sort of oil leak might require this.

Or perhaps the OP means removing the cylinder head and cylinders, sometimes referred to as the "top end".

So Glib: what exactly is leaking and what work are we talking about here? You mentioned a valve, so can we assume you're talking about a top end?


If you've done it a couple of times before, I'd guess that the disassembly and assembly work of removing and replacing the cylinder head, cylinder, and pistons ("doing the top end") could be done in something like four to six hours, NOT including any cleaning, prep, or scraping. This is assuming you're organized, clean, and invisible gnomes make your parts magically clean the instant you put them down. (I bet the drag racers have this down to two hours or less...)

However, you'll spend at LEAST the same amount of time and probably a LOT more cleaning and scraping, depending on when the engine was apart last, and how well it was prepared at that time. Dealing with crusty diamond-hard 35 year old gaskets is the ridiculously tedious and time-consuming part of GS engine work. They're very simple engines, so disassembly and assembly are the fun, easy parts...

And I haven't even accounted for any time required to deal with broken bolts. If the engine hasn't been apart recently, it's a virtual certainty.

Not to mention all the time acquiring parts, etc. Getting the cylinders back onto the engine over the piston rings is possible with one person, but it's about 100x easier if you can recruit an assistant for a half hour or so.

If you're really talking about "splitting the cases" as in separating the bottom end case halves, then it depends on what you're in there to do. Plus, you can actually split the cases without removing the cylinder head, so perhaps that's an option.

 

[dorkburger]

Yes, the bottom halves is what I understood splitting cases to be, but wasn't clear enough. .....

There will be a case splitting in my future at some point. Case halves leak oil where they meet.

 

[glib]

The leak is from the area between the lower cases where they are held together with Three Bond. A major operation to be sure. The bike owner believes that an exhaust valve is leaking also so that will need to be addressed as well.

It would be helpful to know what a professional would charge for comparison.

 

[Nessism]

Splitting the cases is major surgery. You have to remove the engine, fully tear it down, clean everything and replace gaskets/seals, etc. I'd estimate the amount of work for someone that's not a pro at about 30 hours, assuming you have the proper tools to do things like remove the valves, lap them, and replace valve stem seals. New rings are highly recommended too unless the bike is low mileage. Where you can really go sideways is if you run into stuck exhaust pipe bolts and hamfist the removal thus breaking them off. Other frustrations is fighting with carb boots that are hard and stiff. Stuff like that. It's no wonder most shops won't touch old bikes anymore.

 

[hannibal]

I spent at least 10 hours just cleaning the engine.

 

[scratch]

Donor motor would be easier, faster and probably cheaper... motor is coming out anyway, that's half the battle...just say'n.

Then you can take your time rebuilding the orriginal one.

 

[posplayr]

On a 1100E you can remove the engine and split the cases without removing the head/cylinders.

If the engine is out of the bike, I would say it is harder to remove the top end than split the cases. Of course, removing the engine involves some work which you have to do to split the cases.

I have several of the parts required for splitting the cases (I ended up fining all my GS1100ED leaks) so never did that.

 

[glib]

I have several of the parts required for splitting the cases (I ended up fining all my GS1100ED leaks) so never did that.

What parts are required? What would you estimate for time to complete?

 

[posplayr]

What parts are required? What would you estimate for time to complete?

If you have an engine out and on a bench (or engine stand),

1 hour to get the clutch cover, clutch , counter sprocket and stator cover off
1 hour to get the base bolts out.
1 hour to split the case/ remove lower case
1 hour to clean the case facing surfaces
1 hour to order parts
1 hour to reassemble torque lower case.
1 hour to reassemble clutch and all covers
3 hours of drinking beer.

Round up to 10 hours including beer drinking time.

You can find the various parts needed in the parts finch.


Note without a special tool it is easier to break the clutch nut loose when the engine is in the bike.

 

[glib]

If you have an engine out and on a bench (or engine stand),

1 hour to get the clutch cover, clutch , counter sprocket and stator cover off
1 hour to get the base bolts out.
1 hour to split the case/ remove lower case
1 hour to clean the case facing surfaces
1 hour to order parts
1 hour to reassemble torque lower case.
1 hour to reassemble clutch and all covers
3 hours of drinking beer.

Round up to 10 hours including beer drinking time.

You can find the various parts needed in the parts finch.


Note without a special tool it is easier to break the clutch nut loose when the engine is in the bike.

Excellent!
How long if drinking beer comes first?

 

[posplayr]

Excellent!
How long if drinking beer comes first?

What is the alcohol content? Oh yea, do you have three legs?

 

[bobgroger]

You should seriously consider getting a sizable deposit before starting in case it never gets picked up and you get stuck with a bike you will need to go through the lien process to be able to auction off for whatever it brings.....

 

[glib]

There's a reputable machine / speed shop near me that specializes in GS drag bikes. I asked him for a quote to do a case swap and his estimate was $1000 with me supplying all gaskets and the removed motor

If he gets $85/hr that's about 11 hours. I'm sure he can do it in half that time and I'm also sure......... I could do it in a week and 11 hours the second time.

Thank you. That is also helpful. It certainly makes it worth considering.

 

[rapidray]

"Splitting the cases" most often means separating the bottom end case halves. You need to do this to get to the transmission, crankshaft, etc. This is the terminology used in the manuals.

You can remove the cylinder head and cylinders (the "top end") in the frame without splitting the cases.

But to split the cases (separate the bottom end halves), you must remove the engine from the frame.

You can replace the crankshaft and countershaft and some assorted other seals and o-rings without splitting the cases, so it's unclear what sort of oil leak might require this.

Or perhaps the OP means removing the cylinder head and cylinders, sometimes referred to as the "top end".

So Glib: what exactly is leaking and what work are we talking about here? You mentioned a valve, so can we assume you're talking about a top end?


If you've done it a couple of times before, I'd guess that the disassembly and assembly work of removing and replacing the cylinder head, cylinder, and pistons ("doing the top end") could be done in something like four to six hours, NOT including any cleaning, prep, or scraping. This is assuming you're organized, clean, and invisible gnomes make your parts magically clean the instant you put them down. (I bet the drag racers have this down to two hours or less...)

However, you'll spend at LEAST the same amount of time and probably a LOT more cleaning and scraping, depending on when the engine was apart last, and how well it was prepared at that time. Dealing with crusty diamond-hard 35 year old gaskets is the ridiculously tedious and time-consuming part of GS engine work. They're very simple engines, so disassembly and assembly are the fun, easy parts...

And I haven't even accounted for any time required to deal with broken bolts. If the engine hasn't been apart recently, it's a virtual certainty.

Not to mention all the time acquiring parts, etc. Getting the cylinders back onto the engine over the piston rings is possible with one person, but it's about 100x easier if you can recruit an assistant for a half hour or so.

If you're really talking about "splitting the cases" as in separating the bottom end case halves, then it depends on what you're in there to do. Plus, you can actually split the cases without removing the cylinder head, so perhaps that's an option.

On an 1100E you can NOT pull the crank without disassembling the entire engine. The cams, head, barrels and pistons HAVE to come off to get the crank out. IF, and it's a BIG if, you have NO ISSUES, broken bolts, etc..... it is a full day to remove exhaust, carbs, engine, split cases, reassemble engine and reinstall. 8 hours MINIMUM! I won't do it anymore unless it's my own stuff. I tell people to bring me the engine.
Ray.

 

[glib]

On an 1100E you can NOT pull the crank without disassembling the entire engine. The cams, head, barrels and pistons HAVE to come off to get the crank out. IF, and it's a BIG if, you have NO ISSUES, broken bolts, etc..... it is a full day to remove exhaust, carbs, engine, split cases, reassemble engine and reinstall. 8 hours MINIMUM! I won't do it anymore unless it's my own stuff. I tell people to bring me the engine.
Ray.

If you can do it in eight hours then it?s probably a winter project for me!

 

[storm 64]

If you can do it in eight hours then it?s probably a winter project for me!

Haha good one. A winter project for me too! Haha

 

[bwringer]

On an 1100E you can NOT pull the crank without disassembling the entire engine. The cams, head, barrels and pistons HAVE to come off to get the crank out...

Excellent point.

If you don't need to remove the crank, can you get the bottom case off an 1100E without removing the cylinder head? For example, if you need to address a transmission issue but the crank is fine. I know this is possible on the shafties anyway.