Lower-end noise from my GS850 daily driver

[rustybronco]

Pull out the rest of the springs and rollers and see what they look like.

Now, with that said, I just listen to your noise and it sounds like it coming from the clutch side, not the starter clutch side (stator side). Possibly a loose clutch basket or broken spring in the backside of the basket.

 

[Roostabunny]

Pull out the rest of the springs and rollers and see what they look like.

Now, with that said, I just listen to your noise and it sounds like it coming from the clutch side, not the starter clutch side (stator side). Possibly a loose clutch basket or broken spring in the backside of the basket.

I'll do that - I saw two out of three because they fell out (and they looked perfect to me and went back together just fine), but I'll double check all three. Meanwhile, I think you may be right about the noise, and I'm crossing my fingers. But no garage and ran out of daylight, so I'll try to get into that other side tomorrow.

Thanks again!

 

[Roostabunny]

Slow but sure progress...

Double checked - all starter clutch rollers/springs look perfect. Reassembled that side per the shop manual and buttoned it back up.

Then drained the oil and popped the clutch cover.

I was pleasantly surprised that my trusty HF Tools hammer-driven impact driver made short work of breaking loose all the screws (which have not been loosened by me, so that's at least 6 years). I've had stainless hex-heads to replace the phillips-heads for a couple of years, was just waiting for a reason to remove them.

Aside from my own failed attempt to get the gasket off in one piece, there were no overt signs of destruction in the case - no metal or broken bits.

I'm a clutch noob, so I need to read up on what I'm looking for and how to get the thing out of there.

Meanwhile, initial observation is that the clutch release rack is loose and floppy, and there's 1/8-1/4" of play where the basket can move back and forth in line with the shaft. I don't know yet if those things are normal or indicate a problem.

 

[Nessism]

That loose rack gear piece is normal.

Next fun is getting the clutch hub nut loose. A rattle gun typically makes short work of it, or you will have to make yourself a tool to hold the inner clutch hub from turning while the nut is removed.

Good luck. Love the photos.

 

[rustybronco]

Meanwhile, initial observation is that the clutch release rack is loose and floppy, and there's 1/8-1/4" of play where the basket can move back and forth in line with the shaft. I don't know yet if those things are normal or indicate a problem.

In and out or parallel to the shaft?

 

[Steve]

Then drained the oil and popped the clutch cover.

A little late now, but did you realize that you don't have to drain the oil to open the clutch cover? :-k
Just leave the bike on the side stand, virtually no oil comes out.

Might be a few drops that were clinging to the inside of the case, but that's all.

On a similar note, you don't have to drain the oil to pull the stator cover, either. Just put a 2x4 under the left foot of the center stand.
Bike is still PLENTY stable.

Love the photos.

I agree.

Well-lit, good focus, just a tad large, though. Some of the larger pictures were 1204x903, which barely fit on my 17" screen. For those who are using smaller laptop screens, even a 1024x768 might be too big. Usually, an 800x600 picture will work just fine.

.

 

[tkent02]

and there's 1/8-1/4" of play where the basket can move back and forth in line with the shaft.

Maybe the clutch hub nut came loose. Easy fix if it is.

 

[Roostabunny]

A little late now, but did you realize that you don't have to drain the oil to open the clutch cover? :-k
Just leave the bike on the side stand, virtually no oil comes out.

Ha, no I didn't know that about the clutch cover, though it makes sense since I did know about the stator cover - I did similar to your pic when I had mine off before.

That said, an oil change was overdue, so no biggie. I had the filter and a jug of oil on hand already.

I'll take the picture size tip under advisement, but glad they're helpful. I know the pics of others have been a huge help to me in the past, and though I'm not the first, I'm also not likely the last one to have a similar issue. I believe the children are our future... etc etc.

 

[Steve]

I'll take the picture size tip under advisement, ...

If you use PhotoBucket, you can go into your user preferences and have any incoming pictures set to a maximum size automatically.
I have mine set to resize the 'long' side to a maximum of 800. If you upload something smaller, it will not enlarge to 800.

That will leave your full-size picture on your computer and only upload a re-sized copy to PB. Saves on their space, saves time for anyone downloading it, etc.

The only pictures I host on PB are ones that I want to post. I understand the convenience of "cloud" storage, I just prefer not to use it at this time, and I don't store them for the world to hack.

.

 

[Roostabunny]

Maybe the clutch hub nut came loose. Easy fix if it is.

Fingers crossed.

Hey wait - is that the same nut that's really tough to get off when you want it off? How ironic is it that if that's the problem.

Speaking of which I've read on here that the hub nut for a 1000 is 32mm, is mine the same size? Going to need to pick one of those up.

 

[Roostabunny]

If you use PhotoBucket, you can go into your user preferences and have any incoming pictures set to a maximum size automatically.

I use Google, but I've got a program that'll drag-and-drop batch shrink 'em. I can set the long side to some more reasonable number of pixels.

Oh, and I tried the drag-and-drop batch shrink on my electric bill and a credit card bill. No dice.

 

[Roostabunny]

Also - pics from yesterday. Edit: Hopefully the reduced size will provide some relief for those with smaller screens. I tried 800px for the long side and they look OK to me, lemme know if they distort.

Clutch cover off...

And the clutch cover bolt order...

 

[Steve]

Great job on the re-size.

.

 

[Roostabunny]

Uh oh...

Uh oh...

Left the waste oil in the pan overnight to let it settle and I didn't like what I saw when I poured it into the jug.

Looks to me like I've got some little gold flakes visible in the bottom of the pan. I assume it's brass. I also assume it used to be inside the bike somewhere, but I'm kinda lost to guess what it was part of.

Clearly there's been some damage, just hope I'm catching it early.

 

[rustybronco]

Are there any metallic particals in your clutch frictions? Start by removing the pressure plate, then remove the frictions and steels, bend the tabs back on the washer and check to see if the nut is tight, then go in from there.

 

[blowerbike]

brass is from the thrust washer's on each side of the con rod's.
on the big bikes the rods will step then start eating away at the thrust washer's.
cut your oil filter a part and have a look...
maybe i'm wrong but i always got a sick feeling when any of the 1100/1150's i have owned had "brass" in the oil and filter.

 

[tkent02]

brass is from the thrust washer's on each side of the con rod's.
on the big bikes the rods will step then start eating away at the thrust washer's.
cut your oil filter a part and have a look...
maybe i'm wrong but i always got a sick feeling when any of the 1100/1150's i have owned had "brass" in the oil and filter.

Yeah, I can't think of anything else made of brass in there.

If that's the case at least the 850 engines are easy to find. I bought one for $1.02 off Ebay a while ago. It was fine. Slap it back together and ride it while you peruse the local Craigslist and Ebay, you will find one.

 

[rustybronco]

The washers on either side of the con rods are not brass. More likely they are made from sintered bronze which is copper colored.

 

[Roostabunny]

The washers on either side of the con rods are not brass. More likely they are made from sintered bronze which is copper colored.

I definitely thought I'd struck gold (not copper) when I saw the material, but I was outside and the light was failing. Unfortunately, even though I took the time to inspect the oil, I'd already tossed the filter, so I can't inspect that. I'll take a closer look at the material tonight.

Regardless, not ready to panic yet (which is a small miracle). I do see assembled lower ends on Ebay for well under $100 (and a crank with connecting rods for under $20) if it comes to that, but I'll finish inspecting the clutch and see what's behind it then go to the next phase. Didn't see any complete engines for $1 and change, but I haven't searched much yet.

Speaking of which, haven't had time yet to even pull the pressure plate, but can anyone confirm that the hub nut needs a 32mm to remove/tighten?

 

[blowerbike]

The washers on either side of the con rods are not brass. More likely they are made from sintered bronze which is copper colored.

you are correct...i always just called it "brass" as the color was copper looking.