Making It Easier To Select Neutral

[Suzuki_Don]

I have read here on the site a couple of times lately with guys having trouble selecting neutral, particularly when the bike has come to a halt.

I tried this trick not knowing whether it would work or not. As it was it worked out really well and I can select neutral very easily when the bike is at a halt. before I did this mod I had to select neutral while the bike was moving, which is not always possible.

The mod is to replace the standard cam stopper No.2 spring ('77 GS550) with a heavier one from a GS650 which I pulled from a spare "G" motor I had in the shed (so I cannot be guaranteed it is the OE spring but anything heavier than the original would be good). The difference is chalk and cheese. It goes into neutral so much easier now. See following pic for comparison between the two springs.

The original 550 spring on the right, the heavier 650 spring on the left.

Any questions?

 

[tkent02]

The one with less coils should be the stronger of the two?
Or is the wire that much thinner?
What am I missing here?

 

[Steve]

The mod is to replace the standard cam stopper No.2 spring ...

Any questions?

Ummm, YEAH. :-k

Just where is this spring?

I have a sneaking suspicion that such an animal does not exist on my 850s.

.

 

[wkmpt]

Chalk and cheese?

 

[Nessism]

The one with less coils should be the stronger of the two?
Or is the wire that much thinner?
What am I missing here?

I agree with Tom here. The spring with more coils will be softer.

My newest 1000 doesn't like to find neutral when the bike isn't moving. Maybe I need a spring with more coils?

BTW (for Steve): that spring is for the neutral stop. It pushes a metal plunger that engages with a notch on the shift drum.

 

[Steve]

BTW (for Steve): that spring is for the neutral stop. It pushes a metal plunger that engages with a notch on the shift drum.

So, you're saying it's inside the engine?

You have to split the cases to change it?

.

 

[Suzuki_Don]

OK Thanks for the queries (queeries)!!!!!!!!!!!

TOM: The spring on the left with more coils is much stiffer than the one on the right. The wire on the left one is much thicker, although the pic does not really show this. The spring on the right I could compress easily between my fingers (quite soft), easily compressed. The spring on the right is much harder to compress, also it could be the material they are made from.

Having said that I don't know if the original spring in the 550 was the one it came from the factory with and like wise with the 650 spring.

STEVE: All motors/transmissions have these springs, stoppers, etc. It is how you find neutral and no you don't have to disassemble the motor to get at it. There is a bolt type thingo the screws into the crankcase which is hollowed out to accept the spring and the other end of the spring goes into a nodule that presses against the shift drum and goes into an indentation when neutral is selected.

With the stronger spring in place there is a much more positive feel to finding neutral.

Just for you Steve, '82 GS850G shift mechanism and so others know what I am talking about.

The spring we are talking about is #21

This is the neutral plunger position on the 550s, the larger motors have the fitting from underneath the motor.

.

 

[Steve]

Thanks, Don. :clap:

I would guess that, because of the gasket involved, that oil would come out when the bolt is removed?

Next time I change oil on my wife's bike, I will have to check that spring. Her bike has been hard to find neutral. :-k

.

 

[Suzuki_Don]

Thanks, Don. :clap:

I would guess that, because of the gasket involved, that oil would come out when the bolt is removed?

Next time I change oil on my wife's bike, I will have to check that spring. Her bike has been hard to find neutral. :-k

.

Yes Steve, luckily mine is on top, although I did replace mine when the cases were apart. But I can't believe the difference it has made to my bike. Let me know how it goes when you do it.

 

[Steve]

It may be a while, don't hold your breath.

I will find out this week whether I am working between Thanksgiving and Christmas.

Gives more time to work, but less money to play with.

.

 

[Buffalo Bill]

Doh! Just when I hear about a fix for that!

Doh! Just when I hear about a fix for that!

Bummer!
I got an 1100G, so their ain't no bigger engine to take a spring from.

 

[tkent02]

No, but there are spring suppliers chock full of them.

 

[Steve]

Bummer!
I got an 1100G, so their ain't no bigger engine to take a spring from.

Who said it had to be a "G"? :-k

Keeping it Suzuki:
GS1150E
GV1200 Madura
GSX1250
GSX1300R Hayabusa
GV1400 Cavalcade
C90 Boulevard (1462cc)
M109 Boulevard (1783cc)



Or, as tkent says, plenty of spring supply houses.

.

 

[UncleMike]

So, how would one go about measuring the general spring rate of an item that small - you know, so they could order a stronger one for their ... oh to just pick a model at random - 1986 Suzuki GS 1150 E (in red)?

 

[Steve]

Springs from the red ones won't work, you need the blue ones.


OK, springs are measured by force necessary to compress (or extend) a measured amount.
Get a scale and a ruler and get busy.

.

 

[Guest]

Nice find Don!

The 450 one is also on top like the 550, but I don't recall ever having problems shifiting into neutral on mine, but it's been almost 9 years since I rode it...

I'll keep this thread in mind though and will upgrade the spring if I have difficulty once it's back together. At least with it on top like that it will be fairly straight forward.

 

[Buddy]

Could you shim the stock spring? That would give you a use for those left-over RadioShack washers not used to shim the carb needles.

Buddy

 

[Suzuki_Don]

Could you shim the stock spring? That would give you a use for those left-over RadioShack washers not used to shim the carb needles.

Buddy

NO. I wouldn't try that as things are pretty tight in there (not much space).

 

[Suzuki_Don]

If you have no trouble finding neutral then don't worry about this mod, but if you do then the first thing to do is go check microfiches for different models and see which model has a spring with a different part number to the one on your own bike.

Lucky for me I had a 650 bottom end sitting in the shed. The spring should not be that expensive, buy a 650 spring and see how it compares to the spring in your motor. Or pull your spring out and go to a spring place and get one a bit heavier and stronger. The advantage of this mod is that if you don't like the end result then go back to the way it was and it takes about 5mins. to do.

Particularly on the 450 and 550 motors. Don't even need to drain the oil to do it.

 

[Suzuki_Don]

Microfiche Information

Microfiche Information

I just did a search on my microfiche information on the two type of springs.

The spring that was in my '77 GS550B was also in these other models of Suzukis.

Part # = 09440-06014
Part Description = SPRING
Model Count = 53
DS250T 1980 250 DS250 DUAL PURPOSE
GSX550ED 1983 572 GSX550E STREET
GSX550LD 1983 572 GSX550L STREET
GS1000C 1978 1000 GS1000 STREET
GS450ET 1980 448 GS450E STREET
GS450EX 1981 448 GS450E STREET
GS450EZ 1982 448 GS450E STREET
GS450EZ2 1982 1/2 448 GS450E STREET
GS450LT 1980 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LX 1981 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LZ 1982 448 GS450L STREET
GS550B 1977 549 GS550 STREET
GS550C 1978 549 GS550 STREET
GS550EC 1978 549 GS550E STREET
GS550ET 1980 549 GS550E STREET
GS550LN 1979 549 GS550L STREET
GS550LT 1980 549 GS550L STREET
GS550N 1979 549 GS550 STREET
GS700EF 1985 700 GS700E STREET
GS750B 1977 748 GS750 STREET
GS750C 1978 748 GS750 STREET
GS750EC 1978 748 GS750E STREET
GS750ESD 1983 748 GS750ES STREET
GS850GN 1979 844 GS850G STREET
GT550-B 1977 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT550A 1976 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT550J 1972 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT550K 1973 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT550L 1974 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT550M 1975 543 GT550 INDY STREET
GT750-B 1977 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
GT750A 1976 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
GT750J 1972 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
GT750K 1973 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
GT750L 1974 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
GT750M 1975 738 GT750 LEMANS STREET
RL250L 1974 246 RL250 EXACTA TRIALS
RL250M 1975 246 RL250 EXACTA TRIALS
TM250J 1972 246 TM250 CHAMPION OFF ROAD
TM250K 1973 246 TM250 CHAMPION OFF ROAD
TM250L 1974 246 TM250 CHAMPION OFF ROAD
TM250M 1975 246 TM250 CHAMPION OFF ROAD
TS250A 1976 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250B 1977 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250C 1978 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250J 1972 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250K 1973 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250L 1974 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250M 1975 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250N 1979 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250R 1971 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250T 1980 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT
TS250X 1981 246 TS250 SAVAGE DUAL SPORT


This next list are the bikes that already have the spring which replaced the weaker one on my bike. So if you have one of these models I would suggest you can probably find neutral OK.


Part # = 09440-06020
Part Description = SPRING
Model Count = 73
GR650D 1983 650 GR650 TEMPTER STREET
GSX1150ESG 1986 1135 GSX1150ES STREET
GSX550ED 1983 572 GSX550E STREET
GSX750EZ 1982 747 GSX750E STREET
GSX750SD 1983 747 GSX750S KATANA SPORT
GSX750TD 1983 747 GSX750T STREET
GS1000GLX 1981 1000 GS1000GL STREET
GS1000GT 1980 1000 GS1000G STREET
GS1000GX 1981 1000 GS1000G STREET
GS1100ED 1983 1100 GS1100E STREET
GS1100ESE 1984 1100 GS1100ES STREET
GS1100EZ 1982 1100 GS1100E STREET
GS1100GD 1983 1100 GS1100G STREET
GS1100GKD 1983 1100 GS1100GK TOURING
GS1100GKE 1984 1100 GS1100GK TOURING
GS1100GKZ 1982 1100 GS1100GK TOURING
GS1100GLD 1983 1100 GS1100GL STREET
GS1100GLZ 1982 1100 GS1100GL STREET
GS1100GZ 1982 1100 GS1100G STREET
GS1150ESF 1985 1135 GS1150ES SPORT
GS450EZ2 1982 1/2 448 GS450E STREET
GS450LD 1983 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LF 1985 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LG 1986 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LH 1987 448 GS450L STREET
GS450LJ 1988 448 GS450L STREET
GS450TXD 1983 448 GS450TX STREET
GS450TX 1981 448 GS450T STREET
GS450TZ 1982 448 GS450T STREET
GS500EK 1989 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EL 1990 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EM 1991 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EN 1992 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EP 1993 487 GS500E STREET
GS500ER 1994 487 GS500E STREET
GS500ES 1995 487 GS500E STREET
GS500ET 1996 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EV 1997 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EW 1996 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EX 1999 487 GS500E STREET
GS500EY 2000 487 GS500E STREET
GS550LX 1981 549 GS550L STREET
GS550LZ 1982 549 GS550L STREET
GS550MZ 1982 549 GS550M KATANA STREET
GS550TX 1981 549 GS550T STREET
GS650EX 1981 673 GS650E STREET
GS650EZ 1982 673 GS650E STREET
GS650GD 1983 673 GS650G KATANA STREET
GS650GLD 1983 673 GS650GL STREET
GS650GLX 1981 673 GS650GL STREET
GS650GLZ 1982 673 GS650GL STREET
GS650GTD 1983 673 GS650GT STREET
GS650GTZ 1982 673 GS650GT STREET
GS650GX 1981 673 GS650G KATANA STREET
GS750ESD 1983 748 GS750ES STREET
GS750ET 1980 748 GS750E STREET
GS750EX 1981 748 GS750E STREET
GS750LT 1980 748 GS750L STREET
GS750LX 1981 748 GS750L STREET
GS750TZ 1982 748 GS750T STREET
GS850GD 1983 844 GS850G STREET
GS850GLD 1983 844 GS850GL STREET
GS850GLT 1980 844 GS850GL STREET
GS850GLX 1981 844 GS850GL STREET
GS850GLZ 1982 844 GS850GL STREET
GS850GT 1980 844 GS850G STREET
GS850GX 1981 844 GS850G STREET
GS850GZ 1982 844 GS850G STREET
LT-A500FY 2000 500 LT-A500F QUADMASTER 500 ATV
RM250Z 1982 246 RM250 OFF ROAD
RM465Z 1982 465 RM465 OFF ROAD
XN85D 1983 673 XN85 TURBO SPORT
X4571T UK UK X4571T UK


Also another piece of invaluable information is that this stronger spring only appeared on Suzukis from 1980, all earlier models will have a different spring to this one.

All the 550s and 750s from the '70s used the earlier (weaker) spring, so it looks like the spring was upgraded by Suzuki for models after 1980.
.