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R/R Test Reveals Reverse Flow??

  • Thread starter Thread starter crash-harris
  • Start date Start date
I think he fried the ignitor long before now.
And maybe the multimeter too.

Crash Harris, no offence meant, but you really should get someone who knows what they're doing to diagnose your electrics before you do more damage, if that's possible.
 
Alright, switched the multimeter to the correct setting, cart battery read out at about 12.8V
Key on

Same at starter relay

Same at fuse

Left side coil harness - about 11.2V
At coil - About 2V

Right side coil harness - about 10V
At coil - About 8V

Connections need cleaned reqardless.

Guy, I just didn't have a battery and I knew that I was gambling with the charger, but more than likely all of these things would have needed replaced anway thanks to the neglect of my brother and the guy he bought it from. Half of the terminals were painted over and there where wires hanging out of the bike when I picked it up. I just don't know how to use a multimeter, lol. Just never worked with a bike before so it's a learning experiance for sure (usually I can poke around a truck or old car for a minute or so and figure out a problem easy, but they work differently too).
 
crash-harris said:
Alright, switched the multimeter to the correct setting, cart battery read out at about 12.8V
Key on

Same at starter relay

Same at fuse

Left side coil harness - about 11.2V
At coil - About 2V

Right side coil harness - about 10V
At coil - About 8V

Connections need cleaned reqardless.

Guy, I just didn't have a battery and I knew that I was gambling with the charger, but more than likely all of these things would have needed replaced anway thanks to the neglect of my brother and the guy he bought it from. Half of the terminals were painted over and there where wires hanging out of the bike when I picked it up. I just don't know how to use a multimeter, lol. Just never worked with a bike before so it's a learning experiance for sure (usually I can poke around a truck or old car for a minute or so and figure out a problem easy, but they work differently too).
Click to expand...

If the ground side of the coil reads voltage then the grounds are not good. Any Black wire with White stripe ends in a ground terminal somewhere, usually on the frame or battery. You can cut off the ring terminals and replace them with new, the battery terminals are 8 gauge and the rest are 14-16 gauge.

Pick up an assortment of crimp on terminals in a multi pack, and get a few extra packs of male and female bullet terminals, along with a decent heavy duty crimping tool. Replace the brass connectors where ever you find them with the new alloy types.

You are repairing 30 years of neglect so be patient.
 
I think you are on the roll now, the guys will help you all the way now. All we now need are pictures and a fairly clear explanation of what you are doing and have found as you go on. I would also suggest printing out a copy of the wiring diagram and keeping it at hand.
Just follow GS1100K as he guides you and look at duanage's advice and keep his contact details at hand as he supplies used, but tested rectifier/regulators with an installation guide which you may require.
Good luck.:)
 
I have actually been looking for the wiring schematic that I printed out when I first joined here. I'll print another out and put it with the bike. I have a battery that came with the bike but it was as dead as a door nail so I'm going to try and get it charged and see if maybe it'll hold and help me so I don't have to use the golf cart's battery.

The "coil harness" measurements are with the coil disconnected, testing the pins inside the harness on the bike side. The "At coil" reading is with the harness plugged in and the posi cable from the multimeter on the end of the plug wire and the negative on a ground source. I've got a bunch of connectors, but I think I'm going to solder conections on the bike that can be soldered and for removable things I'll get some more spades to use (I've got the female sides, just not male spades).

Thanks for the help guys, I feel like I'm finally making progress again! Probably start replacing conections tonight.
 
Unfortunatly a new $40 battery is out of the question at the moment, BUT, I am trying to get the motocross battery that was with the bike to hold a charge and another Huskee battery from a lawn tractor to use to test the bike as well.
 
I'm going to look up the relay mod since I hardwired most of the connections and mad sure others were clean and I'm still getting 10V at each coil's harness. Also going to try cleaning some more connections.

I do have a spare Ford truck constant duty relay (solonoid) that I'm thinking about using. Why kill it when you can overkill it right? It'll be pretty heavy duty for the bike so I figure it can't hurt anything, it's just a little larger and I'm going to make custom side panels anyway 'cause the bike never had any when I got it.
 
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I noticed in the Coil Relay Mod thread that it was Bosch type relays, which I have a TON of stock Ford ones and one Bosch. I hook all my auxillary lights up on my truck with the Bosch type or the stock Ford ones that get replaced with the Bosch ones since they can deal with more power.

But would the consant duty relay work? It's really the same thing as the $40 one (which I need like 2 or three of for various things for my truck, electric fans, etc...).
 
It'll be perfect then. It is larger and it self grounding (plus I can ground it from the 4th post). Been thinking about making a new cable to ground the electronics panel out of some 16 gauge (or 14?) wire. Strip it, braid it, and put the proper connectors on it. Going to put heat shrink on the terminals.
 
This one grounds from where it's bolted (on a truck) to the inside of the passenger side fender and they are ment to be beat on. Been through a lot of mud and over downed trees and some pretty rough terrain with it firmly bolted to the fender. So I plan to bolt it to the electronics plate tightly and not worry about it since they are made to take the vibration and abuse.

I'll try to wire it up this week :)
 
I'm hoping that it at least gets me 12V to the coils if not get me some spark and get the bike running again.

Side covers will be made out of diamond plate aluminum and thick sheet steel, probably more boxy then stock, but as long as they keep things need and water out of them if I get caught in the rain. There were no side covers on the bike when my brother got it even, none at the bonyard here, but I've got the raw materials.

Thank you for all the help, I'll keep you all updated.
 
So which wire(s) am I drawing from for the signal?

The Coil Relay Mod Thread says that if I'm using a Bosch type relay it would be like this:
post 85- ground to the frame somwhere, or back to the battery negative post if close enough

post 86- kill switch...these are the orange wires that used to go to the coils, you will have to cut the wires to intercept them and route them to this post on the relay, they are orange and white on most GS's, run either one from the kill switch, or both of them if you wish, it makes no difference.

post 87- run this to both coils via the orange and white wires that already went to them, where you cut them off just wire them to this post. both of them, both wires go here, splice them together wherever you want, or run two wires to this post, whichever works best for you.

post 30- run this to the battery positive post.
Click to expand...

I would just use a normal relay instead of the old truck relay, but I don't have any spade connectors large enough to crimp to the battery and starter cables.
 
crash-harris said:
This one grounds from where it's bolted (on a truck) to the inside of the passenger side fender and they are ment to be beat on. Been through a lot of mud and over downed trees and some pretty rough terrain with it firmly bolted to the fender. So I plan to bolt it to the electronics plate tightly and not worry about it since they are made to take the vibration and abuse.

I'll try to wire it up this week :)
Click to expand...
The plate that the electronics are bolted to on my GS is isolated from the frame with rubber grommets, apparently for vibration. Make sure your plate is ground or the relay will not have a path to ground.
 
I think I may have miss understood. This relay mod isn't ment to replace the solonoid between my positive cable and the starter is it? I did replace tat one with the truck solonoid and I am now getting slightly better readings and she'll still turn over.
 
Now I get it :)

I will probably get it done today or tomorrow then. Although replacing the relay for the stater did help me gain another volt and a half or so as well.
 
It's about 1.5 - 2 times the size of the stock Zook one. I successfully completed the relay mod and of course no spark (ignitor suspected), but I did gain a few more volts. Still under 12, but not by much, more like 11.6V/11.8V

As soon as I get a used igntior and this tank and R/R from 4rcFed my bike will be running :dancing:
 
I think at that moment my battery was around 12.2V. I'm going to look for more connections to clean while I'm waiting on responses for the parts I need.
 
Some pictures of the mod(s) for you guys. Thumbnails are clickable.

This is more or less a temporary mounting location. I'm sure it won't fit there is the tank on.


Then the constant duty relay from an 8th gen Ford truck.
 
And how the poor bike looks at the moment...


The jumper cables laying there aren't for the charger, instead they are running to a lawnmower battery since the one bike battery I have can't hold a charge and it's sealed.
 
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GS1100GK said:
You can test your bike by removing the tank and using your DMM (digital multimeter) with black lead on battery (-) and red lead on the supply lead to the coils (one on each coil). They are normally orange or orange/white(?)

Compare this voltage to the reading directly across your battery terminals to determine the loss you have.- JC
Click to expand...

Sheeesh! Now I'm getting confused. I've been trying to follow various threads which discuss measuring the voltage drop in the coil primary circuit.

My DMM manual indicates that when measuring for voltage drop I should put the RED lead on the battery (+) terminal and the BLACK lead on the positive (+) terminal of the coil.

Additionally, it is my understanding that in order to measure a voltage drop, current must be flowing in the circuit. How does current flow in the circuit with the KOEO (Key On Engine Off) if the ignitior pulls the primary circuit to ground momentarily, only when the signal generator is spinning? And if one trys to read the voltage drop with the KOER (Key On Engine Running), the meter is going to be bouncing around between open circuit voltage and loaded voltage.

Could one of the electrical gurus give us a refresher course to be sure we are all using the correct method in determining the coil primary circuit voltage drop?
 
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